ThaiHome Posted August 5, 2003 Report Share Posted August 5, 2003 Says iono: Cold fuck'n bitches if you ask me Another true lover of women. TH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 5, 2003 Report Share Posted August 5, 2003 I guess I can provide a little input here since I have been in this situation. My ex left her three year old daughter behind in BKK with her sister, After struggling with this for over several months I have came to the following conclusion. My ex was very unsure about making the huge step of relocating to America, She had never been outside of Thailand and heard so many stories about Thai women moving thousands of miles from home only to have a worse life, i.e. spousal abuse, being totally dependant on another person for survival etc. She was very concerned about having her daughter exposed to this type of behavior and felt that she would be in a lot better position by staying behind with trusted family members until she was sure of the situation. Besides the fact that my ex has always worked hard and long hours in order to provide for her child and the entire time her sister was the fill in mom, her sister was married and had two of her own children. To take a child away from the only life she knows and expose her to potential problems was not an option, besides the fact that her entire family was totally against the move and they made the final decision. I can also tell you that while she was here she was an absolute basket case and missed her family, including her daughter so much that she could not stay away from home. I've read numerous times on this board that if you are involved with a Thai woman that the chances of making it are much greater if you relocate to their environment. I had very strong feelings for my ex and I'm sure the feelings were mutual, just bad timing for all involved. She moved back to BKK and because of career choices I stayed in America, worse decision I have ever made! Everybody went back to their lives and we finally lost contact, but to this day I still miss her and think about her everyday. Just my point of view! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaiLuk Posted August 5, 2003 Report Share Posted August 5, 2003 The nuclear family reigns supreme in farangland. An extreme example: Many states passed grandparent visitation laws, the US supreme court slapped them all down. The US constitution gives the natural parent the absolute right to prohibit the grandparent from having any contact with the children. The idea behind it is that the bond between child and parent is fundamental natural biological irrefutable etc and is not to be messed with by anyone. If farang Mom leaves her children behind, even with family, she is going against god and nature and gets branded with what we see in this thread. There is even a stigma if mom lost custody to dad (why did she not get custody?) This "mom must raise her children" idea doesn't hold in all places. The idea that a grandparent could be prohibited from visiting grandchild would be very unusual in some places. The entire family raises the child (this also occurs in farangland as well so no absolutes here) I don't think these thai woman have abandoned their child by leaving them with family, they might be shocked if you said it. In their minds (and their family raising the child) this would be a contradiction in terms. The child has cousins, aunts uncles grandparents and is raised the way children ought to be raised, not by mom alone. There is also the question of lack of power for some girls. Some i know about: 1. My ex-tg friend in farangland divorced her husband, decided that if she can't take her kids to thailand with her (she couldn't) then the kids are better off living with dad in the marital home. So she agreed to give him custody. She did not have the means to make it on her own with 2 kids. 2. A bgfriend in los: as a teen she lost first child to thai husband's family, second child to farang husband in farangland, was not given any choice. I'm sure others can think of hundreds of examples of this story. 3. Phillipina ex-gf: as a teen in phillipines she had a baby. the bf and his family took the child after two weeks for a visit. Refused to return the child, the ex and her mom went to the bf's house, bf called the police. bf's family had connections and ex has to give up on her baby. Some may be cold bitches, but not because they don't have their kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iono Posted August 5, 2003 Report Share Posted August 5, 2003 Says CaptCraig: She was very concerned about having her daughter exposed to this type of behavior and felt that she would be in a lot better position by staying behind with trusted family members until she was sure of the situation. I can also tell you that while she was here she was an absolute basket case and missed her family, including her daughter so much that she could not stay away from home. This is a situation were the Mother had major concerns with a change of environment for her child and in this case the women was devastated by her decision Where as with my experiences I witnessed self serving hatchet wounds concerned with their own security and not the childs. Motherhood should over ride all other natural instincts to include shopping. Oh and I do love women and am a very compassionate individual, however if it weren't for the pussy there would be a bounty on their heads. Women hater, dam! I think not! Says THAIHOME: Says iono: Cold fuck'n bitches if you ask me Another true lover of women. TH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaiLuk Posted August 5, 2003 Report Share Posted August 5, 2003 besides the fact that her entire family was totally against the move and they made the final decision. This points up the differences about raising children, no right or wrong way imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 5, 2003 Report Share Posted August 5, 2003 Obviouslt there can be many factors a work here. The age of the child, birth fathers rights (especially in Thailand, and particularly if the the child is male). We also have differing views on the subject. Mostly what I am trying to pass on is the viewpoint expressed to me by the Thai women I've been friends with. And yes 90% we working girls. I can understand it when a woman decides to move to bangkok in order to provide for her child and has no choice but to leave her with some relatives. But the situation is entirely different IMO when she decides to marry a farang who would normally provide her with enough financial security to take care of her children herself. Many have children from less than ideal circumstances. And for some being separated is a gain in their mind. Can't go dancing til 2 or sleep til noon with a 3 year about. And heck all your friends do that. Heck you are just a kid yourself. So this farang wants to marry you and go to Europe. Sounds great, but that kid will definately put a cramp in your lifestyle. Besides the kid is happy at home with grandma, has other kids to play with etc. Sure doesn't speak any Englsih, and yours is barely OK. Maybe when you get settled and the kid is older. (I'm not saying that I agree with any of this or not. Just trying to convey the message I've been given.) Beside what if farang husband, partnership does not work out? Better to leave Thai child in Thailand. Or at least that what some girls tell me. Actually, that?s what I am thinking, too. The fact that the mother leaves their children in thailand may be a very telling sign about how serious she really is about her relationship. Quite possible true. But Thai females are renowned for have at least 3 gameplans and 8 backups on the go at once. IMO One more of the attitude differences between the 'individualistic' west and the 'collectiveism' of the east. Here?s where you and I think the exact opposite. I feel that leaving the children in LOS may be a sign that the woman in question is very selfish (and thus individualistic) and probably abandons her children because she simply doesn?t care. Then again, I have never been a believer in the essential goodness of mankind. No doubt she is being selfish here. Now whether or not it is 'enlightened selfishness' or not, only time will tell. If things continue to work out in her new country and providing the child can actually leave Thailand without destroying the the entire family and/or village, then she will most likely pursue that path in due course. Again, I doubt that she feels that she is doing anything terribly wrong. And if she does, the marriage won't last long anyway and she'll be back to LOS in short order. (In her mind, without the burden of having to bring back the child that has now tasted the forbidden fruit.) Ah, their minds are often the most convaluted, twisted soap opera conceivable. But then they are women. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iono Posted August 5, 2003 Report Share Posted August 5, 2003 Says MaiLuk: Some may be cold bitches, but not because they don't have their kids. I agree there are a lot of situation were it is out of the hands of the Mom when the fathers family takes the child away, however the main gist is the women that wantonly abandons their children allowing the distant family to raise the child so they can better their own situation. Hey I'm a Daddy/Mommy right now, my ex knows I can provide a more stable environment then she. However, she keeps in daily contact with the kids and has not opted to just let someone else have them so she can live her life forgetting she had children (what I interrupted as the original gist of the main post) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 5, 2003 Report Share Posted August 5, 2003 poverty is another factor as well. it forces people to become hard and make decisions difficult or us to comprehend, and, poverty and loss in social ethics do often go hand in hand. just look or example at the countless migration workers here - going off to taiwan, singapore or arabia for years without a holiday home, leaving spouse and children in their homecountries, hoping that this move will one day improve their life. a thing i could not do, but then, i am also not that poor. and the point you mentioned about seriousness of the relationship is a very valid one - many (but not all!) former bargirls do see a marriage to a westerner just as an extension of their working life, love and all that plays a much smaller role than a continuous and secure provision for her family (who in this case may bring up her children). maybe try to look more in this issue how many of our moral and ethical standards are actually influenced by our wealth. wasn't too long ago that in the industrial revolution during the migration from the land into the cities people in europe faced the same hard choices. or the immigration to america - men leaving their families behind in europe until they might make it in the new world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattaya127 Posted August 5, 2003 Report Share Posted August 5, 2003 I can only think about these women as stone cold heartless bitches ------------------- I hope you found out directly from them why this is so, before to judge them. May have some financila reasons behind it, or the kids will come later, I dunno.... I know that if my GF was coming to the States marry me, and stay, i am not sure how i could handle a bigger rent, school fees, for her kid, while still saving for my retirement, at 48. Kids are raised differently in poor Thailand, often left to the grandparents when the parents work in BKK, or abroad. I certainly ask myself if the best is not for the 2 of us to get an income and pay for that kid, in Thailand, where our money to raise and school her will go further, then live there, in Thailand, within the next 10 years, as a retiree, instead of starting to be a family man so late in my life, which could really have me contemplate having to work some 10 years longer, maybe. I mean, i am no heartless thoughtless jerk but..... PS: BTW< i think this thread should be moved to FAMILY LIFE, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soongmak Posted August 5, 2003 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2003 Thaihome, it is obvious from your comment that you know more about these things than me. Without knowing the specifics of the situation you are not qualified to make a generalized judgement on what is best for their child. I think based on your superficial view of the situations and rush to judgement that probably makes you qualified to be Family Service Social worker. Instead of rushing to a judgement about me, how about actually adding something to the discussion? If my opinion was set in stone, I would hardly open a discussion on the subject, now would I? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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