Disturbing Phnom Pehn "Slave" Brothel Report-

[BelgianBoy]

I fail to see how it leaves a sour taste - this is exactly what Cent was talking about.

 

I dont really like karaoke bars but I dont spend time posting in a thread about karaoke bars about how much I dont like them. If you dont like Cambodia, fine, but dont come on trying to convert everyone else to your point of view.

 

And lets face it, do you believe every press release thats issued by organisations with an interest in sensationalising events ( individuals, organisations or governaments ) ?

 

Ultra,

 

Then you totally failed my point, and cents' point.

He advocated a free platform on this board for any member writing anything on Cambo.......

That leaves me sour taste, because it implicated that all other POV will be dealt with......

Now then, I understand the board to be less PC, but this way is not how I would do it......

 

That is the point I was making, balancing views.

Never been to Cambo, no experience other to what I read myself here, and elsewhere.

 

BB

[Shit-Spattered Dog]

ultras67 said:

BelgianBoy said:

jita,

 

Thanks for posting this here !

A nice report on how things can really be.

 

It also balances a bit this thread which did leave me a bit of a sour taste in my mouth......

 

Specially this bit :

Hopefully KS and the mods will keep the harassment of anything written about P4P in Campuchia off the board/forum and those who wish to post their info and stories and such here "under the guidance of the board rules" will be free to do so without having to endure the harassment by those with agendas, biases and a penchant to preach and moralize.

which I found really mai sanuk ......

 

Just my opinion of course....

 

BB

 

I fail to see how it leaves a sour taste - this is exactly what Cent was talking about.

 

I dont really like karaoke bars but I dont spend time posting in a thread about karaoke bars about how much I dont like them. If you dont like Cambodia, fine, but dont come on trying to convert everyone else to your point of view.

 

And lets face it, do you believe every press release thats issued by organisations with an interest in sensationalising events ( individuals, organisations or governaments ) ?

 

I fail to see what the big fuss is. Well, is not what's occuring in Cambo, no different than what's occuring (or occured) in Thailand?

Or is it now because Cambo is poorer than is neigbour that it rates " special " and " immediate "attention by all concerned, namely the New York Post. All I can say is bs. Don't want forced labour, but everyone is painted with the same brush here.

Why not publish the truth and write how some girls work to buy things like tv, food etc for the family. Not that there is much other real work around.

Just ask any hollywood porn filmmaker: sex sells.

Or tell the press to do a story on what exist around the Portland subway stop on the Kowloon side in Hongkong .

Shit.

[Guest]

>>>Why not publish the truth and write how some girls work to buy things like tv, food etc for the family.<<<

 

 

 

OK, what about the other truths... for example how i have been in a slave market between the borders, on the main supply route for KM11 and other brothel villages with vienamese women?

anything available for sale - children, virgins, whatever the pervert is in need of.

 

or the many accounts i was given by girls how they were kidnapped, raped and tortured? that was in brothels frequented regularly by sextourists as well?

some of which histories i have followed up in the villages as well, and found confirmed.

 

or the 13/14 year old girls in KM11 i have seen on the second foor of a brothel frequented by western sextourists as well?

 

not hearsay - my own personal research on cambodia's scene.

 

and yes, some of those things do still happen in thailand, but would we want to discuss the merits of those sort of border brothels in mae sai etc. here on this board? hardly.

[Nervous_Dog]

Fly accused me of:

 

Wanting to get rid of all the other sections except nightlife

 

Confusing the issue

 

Disregarding his post (Gee can't I make my own?)

 

I said "Well, that would sum up why most read this board, and why they started to read it! "

 

Fly Said"what i would say is that "most" people here are actively involved in the scene here in thailand, or at least have been at some stage."

 

We just said the same thing!

 

You never read but leap don't you?

 

I also said "While all the "Extra's" that the board covers, and I agree with you, are very good,"

 

To which you replied "then, why should we keep the general, news, relationship, technology, language, arts etc. folders?"

 

Which totally contradicted what I also said with "While all the "Extra's" that the board covers, and I agree with you, are very good,"

 

OOPS already said that didn;t I ) You'll have to get up early than today mate to have a go at me with this one.

 

Point is as YOU said, (I am quoting YOU)

 

<<"most" people here are actively involved in the scene here in thailand, or at least have been at some stage>>

 

So I think discussing the issue of Cambodia is very relivant, and if people want to talk about places where they go for a fuck, as long as its not under age, good on them.

 

As far as indentured sex workers, underage workers go, most of the worlld thinks that Thailand is 95% full of underage sex slaves (if you beleived what you read in the "quality" newspapers.

 

Now I know thats not true, I also know that if we went for a walk around nanaplaza, I bet we could find both someone who was sold into the sex for baht business, as well as someone underage.

 

So - using your dictum, we shouldn't talk about nanaplaza either?

 

DOG

[Guest]

>>>So I think discussing the issue of Cambodia is very relivant, and if people want to talk about places where they go for a fuck, as long as its not under age, good on them.<<<

 

 

well, the problem is that in cambodia there actually very few places that have not underage girls on its premises, or indentured prostitutes.

my knowledge is a bit out of date, 4 or 5 years old, but i have seen even in the for it's freelancers famous martini girls of 14 and below, and mamasans from the different brothel villages bringing their stock of partly also indentured girls there (if you want proof i can present it to you when we meet the next time).

 

and so far, even though it appears that KM 11 has closed mainly due to international pressure, i have not seen any evidence of a major change in those practises in cambodia, other than pedos have to be a bit more careful nowadays, and that in the well known places the wares are a bit more hidden than before.

 

so, can you tell me please how we can discuss cambodia's scene without touching underaged or indentured prostitution?

do we have any resident members with enough cambodian language skills and cultural knowledge to back statements of sextourists and sexpats up, or correct them?

 

 

 

>>>So - using your dictum, we shouldn't talk about nanaplaza either?<<<

 

the question is not what the world imagines things to be, but to find out ourselves what really happens.

i can only repeat - i have personally seen all that i have posted about cambodia.

or do you tell me that i am a liar?

[khunsanuk]

Hi,

 

"He advocated a free platform on this board for any member writing anything on Cambo......."

 

In a word, bullshit!

 

"That is the point I was making, balancing views."

 

Balancing views???? Come again? You mean like attacking every single post dealing with Cambo?

 

Sanuk!

[Shit-Spattered Dog]

flyonzewall said:

>>>Why not publish the truth and write how some girls work to buy things like tv, food etc for the family.<<<

 

 

 

OK, what about the other truths... for example how i have been in a slave market between the borders, on the main supply route for KM11 and other brothel villages with vienamese women?

anything available for sale - children, virgins, whatever the pervert is in need of.

 

or the many accounts i was given by girls how they were kidnapped, raped and tortured? that was in brothels frequented regularly by sextourists as well?

some of which histories i have followed up in the villages as well, and found confirmed.

 

or the 13/14 year old girls in KM11 i have seen on the second foor of a brothel frequented by western sextourists as well?

 

not hearsay - my own personal research on cambodia's scene.

 

and yes, some of those things do still happen in thailand, but would we want to discuss the merits of those sort of border brothels in mae sai etc. here on this board? hardly.

 

OK, these other truth you speak of exist everywhere. From what I hear and read. I don't like it but it sounds like you have had a more close up view of these things than me. But why pick out Cambo, and ignore the rest of Asia. I have seen a bit of these other things in Hong Kong but no mention of that in his post. Is that because HK is more civilized than Cambo so therefore it does not exist there? This is what makes me angry, the writer tries to portray poor Cambo as a haven for forced labour bondage and child perverts and ignores everything else.

Shit

[Central Scrutinizer]

BelgianBoy said:

jita,

 

Thanks for posting this here !

A nice report on how things can really be.

 

It also balances a bit this thread which did leave me a bit of a sour taste in my mouth......

 

Specially this bit :

Hopefully KS and the mods will keep the harassment of anything written about P4P in Campuchia off the board/forum and those who wish to post their info and stories and such here "under the guidance of the board rules" will be free to do so without having to endure the harassment by those with agendas, biases and a penchant to preach and moralize.

which I found really mai sanuk ......

 

Just my opinion of course....

 

BB

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

BB,

 

What I find "Mai sanuk" are people who have agendas and try to impose their morals and views on others here who are posting "within" the rules and guidelines of the board. What I find obnoxious is the fervor with which these moral guardians of the world/board harrass and try to intimidate others from posting. These posts are "totally within the rules and guidelines" set up by the moderators and KS. If you have a problem with them then obviously you need to take them up with KS, because HE approved them and made up the rules himself. We all know there are grey areas and limits and borders we need to observe and be careful of, because NONE of us you mentioned agree with indentured servitude in the sex scene, and none I know of participate in this knowingly, approve of it, or want to see this sort of stuff being promoted here, same with underage as well. Read that sentence again in case you don't fully understand. You yourself, as did Fly, participated in the bar scene and sex trade scene in Thailand. Were your "pros" all stamped with some "NGO Seal of Approval" whereby you knew for positive the circumstances where you knew how the lady came to work her trade? Have you ever participated in the scene in Cambodia? Have you ever been to Cambodia? Do you think it is so very different in certain areas of venue as it is in Thailand, in Bangkok, Phuket, and Pattaya? Are you telling me that it is OKAY for those members following the rules and regulations to have to endure "harrassment by those with agendas, biases, and a penchant to preach and moralize"? You find my saying this Mai sanuk? IMHO I find the harrassment by the certain few who try to shut down a forum and keep people who are following the rules and regulations and guidelines set up by KS from posting as being "mai Sanuk".

 

And what's next? If these moral crusaders (members of this board) decide that the scene in Jakarta doesn't meet their approval due to something they've read or experienced there shall we allow these people to start harrassing those writing about the Indo scene as well? "Under the guidelines of the board rules" means just that. And YOU helped to come up with these rules and regulations while a moderator here yourself. Are there new ideas you have you'd like to share with KS about how to run the board and what new rules need to be put in place? If so, post them in the suggestion forum or PM KS.

 

That sour taste in your mouth is something you need to take care of. Try flossing and using mouthwash three times a day after each meal, or lay off the som tam maybe.

 

Cent

[Nervous_Dog]

Fly, stooping very low:

 

<<or do you tell me that i am a liar?>>

 

So you use the last resort of a politician in a debbate, claim the others are saying something thats not true?

 

Sorry, if you weren't a mate I'd ask a mod to edit your post, where did I insinuate, say, or even refere to your knowledge of Cambodia being lies?

 

YOU KNOW (YES I AM SHOUTING I THINKS IT HELPS PEOPLE UNDERSTAND ENGLISH) That I have NEVER doubted what you have seen.

 

That said, I think that MANY people fuck girls who are not underage, and are as indentured as the thai girls are here.

 

I think you owe me a large appology as I have NEVER said you lied, and you use this to attack me?

 

SHAME SHAME SHAME

 

DARREN DOG HINCH

[Guest]

>>>OK, these other truth you speak of exist everywhere.<<<

 

 

true.

and despicable wherever they happen.

i think we do not really need to argue about the merits of the media , they media industry often does only get in action when westerners are involved, but ignores when when only "natives" are involved. nothing to be done about that unfortunately.

and if true, that the report of the brothel raid is that flawed, it is a perfect example how some overzealous organisation can do enormous harm do the cause they pretend to support.

does it change though anything on the fact that underaged and indentured prostitution is endemic in cambodia? i don't think so.

it makes it only more difficult to fight that practise. very sad.

 

 

what concerns me here on the board is that cambodia is a definate destination for western sextourism. nothing i can do about it. there is also nothing i can possibly do to persuade tourists not to visit brothels there, and instead look for the other non-sexual beauties cambodia has to offer. it in the end is up to them.

what i can do is to criticise "trip reports" to cambodia's brothelvillages here, posting my opposing experiences, and hope that those sort of trip reports are not gonna be tolerated here due to the difficult set up in cambodia.

the big difference between cambodia's scene, and thailand's scene is, that here in thailand it is relatively easy to avoid places of indentured prostitution as long as people stick to the mainly discussed areas - western oriented prostitution.

that though is not so easy in cambodia.

 

what happens in the rest of asia does personally concern me a lot, but the rising sexindustry of other asian countries, i have some knowledge about, is so far not much of a topic on this board here. fortunately.

i would not enjoy reading trip reports on some of the nastier areas i know of in some other asian countries

 

i would not want to be a member of an internet community that condones practises such as indentured or child prostitution, for the sake of "sanuk" (whatever that could mean in such a context).