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Ladies, whilst I'd love to parry Cav and meet his backhand with my forehand, volley after volley, the outcome is inevitable, Trump will be impeached, and probably not removed from office.

But the moment the polls start to move in the wrong (for the GOP) direction, he's history.

Putin is still pulling levers and it's going to be a watershed moment when the general populace start to wake up to the extent to which Russia is and has been involved.

 

And then ::

 

Orange-Grifter.jpg.acb3b8977c1978840252299ef9c90b8e.jpg

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15 hours ago, Flashermac said:

"Not corruptible ..."  Really, CS? All of "the squad" have been charged with misusing there own campaign funds. And Warren and Bernie aren't exactly saints. Just give the new folks time. They'll become as corrupt as the rest.  :(

Meanwhile, Ken Starr has spoken up:

Congressional Democrats have pushed too hard on President Trump’s impeachment hearings and may force Republican senators to dismiss the case altogether, said former special prosecutor Ken Starr on Thursday:

“It’s an outrage to seize control of the deliberate process of a committee — [it] simply compounds a series of very, very terrible abuses,” he said…  “Where did she get this power?” Starr asked… “It is an abuse of power.”

:hmmm:

 

 

Hey Flash, I'd love to know any campaign that upon close examination that has spent every dollar according to the law. This is NOT an excuse. I have a HS classmate who ran for a state legislature and as well as  congregational seat outside Philly. I finished my HS years in the suburbs. Great guy, very honest. He will tell you that its pretty much impossible to run a completely transparent campaign. First of all, there are expenses that are cash and no receipts. Expenses can come in an emergency manner and you need to pay in cash. There is nothing about any of the 'squad' you mentioned that is beyond what are deemed routine campaign violations. Also, how is that an example of being currupt? I am using it in the context of being bought off by a person or group. I'd love to see any evidence any group has bought them off. AOC raised all her funds organically. The only group is the Wolf PAC which is a progressive group that gives money to candidates who do not want lobby money and only to raise money organically which may seem like a dichotomy but isn't. 

She (and the rest) or not in the pockets of any of the groups and people that own everyone else including every presidential candidate on both sides except possibly Sanders...maybe Warren. 

I'm not going to be cynical and suggest they will change. They gained their popularity in part by not being in the pockets of the people who own everyone else. 

As to your second point, first, Starr is a Republican. Hardly an impartial arbiter. Second, he was part of the the impeachment process for Clinton. Purely political with no basis for impeachment and a process that the Republicans totally rammed down the Democrats throat. If there is something the Dems are doing that is uniquely unethical with regards to the process, I'd love to hear it. I have the opposite opinion personally. The Democrats are prosecuting the impeachment process weakly. Peolosi narrowed the scope which is unheard of. Both Nixon and Clinton investigations were wide and far reaching even if it wasn't germane to the original investigation. Both prior cases went on fishing trips. Trump is getting off very, very lightly. So, I'd like specifics and I'd trust it from someone who is impartial. 

As an aside. The very fact a private citizen is conducting foreign policy in Ukraine, violating all manner of federal laws and the Democrats haven't done anything about it, I would conclude they are derelict in their duties. I understand why the Republicans haven't. They operate out of mortal fear of being on the end of one of Trump's tweets or tirades at a rally. Cowardly but I get it. I've long expected very little ethics out of the Republican party just as I expect very little competence out of the Democrats. 

 

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...also its hard to have one iota of sympathy from the Republicans when 

1 They are arguing the process not the actual acts.

2. A member of the investigation committee is a co-conspirator (Nunes).

3. They stage a fake outrage storm the bastille incident about being excluded by the committee with 11 members are PART OF THE F*CKING COMMITEE!! WTF? 

4. The white house openly obstructing justice by telling key people of interest not to participate. 

Republicans couldn't have it any better. Seeing Pelosi and Schiff f*ck up the easiest of impeachments could legitimately be used as a reason NOT to trust them with the reigns of governing if the Republicans weren't so utterly detestable in their present form. The laundry list of breeches of etiquette, law, morality, the constitution, propriety and the military and it being condoned immediately after the very same Republicans accusing Obama of wearing a tan suit and using the salad fork for his main meal at state dinners (the latter is sacrasm), makes the Republicans unfit totally and until they get some ethics back and actually live up their own stated love for the country and flag, they are not honest partners in governing. I wouldn't negotiate at all with this Republican party. They are completely dishonest. I'd ignore their pleas and act totally on my conscience and respect for the law. They have not deserved any consideration. None at all. It's not just the hypocrisy but also the inhumanity of seeing little kids in cages and other similar things. When you are that bereft of humanity, you get treated the same as the Nazis. No quarter given. Whatsoever. 

....and any pleas for mercy ignored. 

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I long for the days of Jack Kemp and Bob Dole and the old McCain, not the one that was forced fringe right. I loved the Dole-Kemp Republican ticket in '96. They were never going to win but had they won, we'd have had a much better administration than Clinton. 

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This financier voted for Trump purely for economic reasons and has been a big critic of him since. I disagree with him on some things such as his hatred of cryptos which I think is a generational thing (yes, I own some cryptos...full disclosure). 

PS: No one can predict the collapse specifically, so I would ignore that date. 

 

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7 hours ago, chocolat steve said:

Hey Flash, I'd love to know any campaign that upon close examination that has spent every dollar according to the law. This is NOT an excuse. I have a HS classmate who ran for a state legislature and as well as  congregational seat outside Philly. I finished my HS years in the suburbs. Great guy, very honest. He will tell you that its pretty much impossible to run a completely transparent campaign. First of all, there are expenses that are cash and no receipts. Expenses can come in an emergency manner and you need to pay in cash. There is nothing about any of the 'squad' you mentioned that is beyond what are deemed routine campaign violations. Also, how is that an example of being currupt? I am using it in the context of being bought off by a person or group. I'd love to see any evidence any group has bought them off. AOC raised all her funds organically. The only group is the Wolf PAC which is a progressive group that gives money to candidates who do not want lobby money and only to raise money organically which may seem like a dichotomy but isn't. 

She (and the rest) or not in the pockets of any of the groups and people that own everyone else including every presidential candidate on both sides except possibly Sanders...maybe Warren. 

I'm not going to be cynical and suggest they will change. They gained their popularity in part by not being in the pockets of the people who own everyone else. 

As to your second point, first, Starr is a Republican. Hardly an impartial arbiter. Second, he was part of the the impeachment process for Clinton. Purely political with no basis for impeachment and a process that the Republicans totally rammed down the Democrats throat. If there is something the Dems are doing that is uniquely unethical with regards to the process, I'd love to hear it. I have the opposite opinion personally. The Democrats are prosecuting the impeachment process weakly. Peolosi narrowed the scope which is unheard of. Both Nixon and Clinton investigations were wide and far reaching even if it wasn't germane to the original investigation. Both prior cases went on fishing trips. Trump is getting off very, very lightly. So, I'd like specifics and I'd trust it from someone who is impartial. 

As an aside. The very fact a private citizen is conducting foreign policy in Ukraine, violating all manner of federal laws and the Democrats haven't done anything about it, I would conclude they are derelict in their duties. I understand why the Republicans haven't. They operate out of mortal fear of being on the end of one of Trump's tweets or tirades at a rally. Cowardly but I get it. I've long expected very little ethics out of the Republican party just as I expect very little competence out of the Democrats. 

 

 

Steve, once again a polite, well reasoned response ... as I've come to expect from you. So why can't our political leaders be this way.  :(

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55555

and yet another laughable blather from a republican senator, 

The latest Trump defence is ::

"So Ukraine was backing Hillary in the 2016 election.

How is that different to Russia and Putin backing Trump? see, perfectly OK."

So this GOP idiot, is asking us to believe that - because Ukraine backed Hilary, they then went on to Hack the DNC server, which the FBI gave to Crowdstrike (American Company whose services are used by the Republican Party amongst others) and the server somehow is in Ukraine now. And all this proves, that despite all the evidence and facts to the contrary, Russia did not interfere with the 2016 election...

Jeez, even Trump can't believe this tripe...

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28 minutes ago, Flashermac said:

Steve, once again a polite, well reasoned response ... as I've come to expect by you. So why can't our political leaders be this way.  :(

The best post I've seen in this thread. 🙏

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