panadolsandwich Posted September 16, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2011 Hi, I'm sure the OP didn't write that himself. My guess is that it was lifted from some guy's blog. Sanuk! Why are you so sure? Not that it matters, but you are very kind in a way to suggest that this wasn't written by myself, which I assure you it is. For me there's nothing to be proud of in such drunken rants. The only way I can return to them is to get drunk again. Words may fly, yet the tide submerges all. For that matter, I've never plagiarised anyone - the mere suggestion of doing so - and for such a paltry purpose is exceptionally revolting to me. Finally I do admit to turning up the contrast, and dialling back the brightness (lol!). It's awfully stuffy here in your home-page. I thought you'd appreciate it! You'd have to admit that your numbers are down, the people are really quite knowledgeable and friendly and I'd hate to see the board die out of disinterest. In that light - if I encourage debate in a useful way - despite my style - what harm is done? eh? Now go I in content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashermac Posted September 16, 2011 Report Share Posted September 16, 2011 The best authors always write when they are drunk. Maybe I need to drink more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kamui Posted September 17, 2011 Report Share Posted September 17, 2011 when the euro finally crashes and burns....all the old hatred will start. some polish politician speaks of war within 10 years in europe!!! IMHO, that's bullshit. By now everybody in Europe knows that no one would gain from a war. Of course right wing, anti-democratic, anti-Europe politicians relish on the current situation. But they are still in a minority, and the recent massacre of the a right wing, christinan, anti-muslim fundamentalist in Norway has hurt the position of the right wing parties considerably, especially in Scandinavia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lazyphil Posted September 17, 2011 Report Share Posted September 17, 2011 the islamaphobic thing will be a thing of the past. it'll be an economic war. you cant rule it out. africa is not the dark continent, europe is and always will be despite modernity and euro-zones......count on it. btw, i dont want war, but fear it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Munchmaster Posted September 17, 2011 Report Share Posted September 17, 2011 ...africa is not the dark continent, europe is and always will be despite modernity and euro-zones......count on it.... Damn it Phil, you pike fishers are obviously a bunch of wisdom guys cos I thought I was reasonably intelligent but goddamit I ain't got a clue what you're talking about! Care to explain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teddy Posted September 17, 2011 Report Share Posted September 17, 2011 the islamaphobic thing will be a thing of the past. it'll be an economic war. you cant rule it out. africa is not the dark continent, europe is and always will be despite modernity and euro-zones......count on it. btw, i dont want war, but fear it. There are and have always been many schools of thought about where we are heading. After every crash the doomsayers are always the loudest but also always the ones that miss the opportunities that the said crash bring up. Fill yer friggining booots is a better philosophy and one that will bring you more riches than betting on armageddon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gobbledonk Posted September 17, 2011 Report Share Posted September 17, 2011 I went looking for the Twain quote re nationalism and found this lot. Its interesting to see that many of them come from folk who, at various times, have been draped in their country's flag in a call to arms .... “Patriotism is fierce as a fever, pitiless as the grave, blind as a stone and as irrational as a headless hen.†Ambrose Bierce = “Patriotism is a religion, the egg from which wars are hatched.†Guy de Maupassant = “Patriotism is a menace to liberty.†Emma Goldman = “Patriotism is a pernicious, psychopathic form of idiocy.†George Bernard Shaw = “Patriotism is a superstition, one far more injurious, brutal and inhumane than religion.†Gustave Herve = “Patriotism - the virtue of the vicious.†Oscar Wilde = “Patriotism is a survival from barbarous times which must not only be evoked and educated but which must be eradicated by all means - by preaching, persuasion, contempt and ridicule.†Leo Tolstoy = “You’ll never have a quiet world until you knock the patriotism out of the human race.†George Bernard Shaw = “A patriot sets himself apart in his own country under his own flag, sneers at other nations and keeps an army of uniformed assassins on hand at heavy expense to grab slices of other people’s countries and keep them from grabbing slices of his. In the intervals between campaigns he washes the blood off his hands and works for ‘the universal brotherhood of man’ - with his mouth.†Mark Twain, The Lowest Animal = “This disgrace to civilization should be done away with at once. Heroism on command, senseless violence and all the loathsome nonsense that goes by the name of patriotism.†Albert Einstein = “Patriotism means advocating plunder in the interests of the privileged class of your particular country. The time will soon come when calling someone a patriot will be the deepest insult.†Ernest. B. Bax = “Politically speaking, tribal nationalism [patriotism] always insists that its own people are surrounded by ‘a world of enemies’ - ‘one against all’ - and that a fundamental difference exists between this people and all others. It claims its people to be unique, individual, incompatible with all others, and denies theoretically the very possibility of a common mankind long before it is used to destroy the humanity of man.†Hannah Arendt, The Origins of Totalitarianism, p.227 = “Seas of blood have been shed for the sake of patriotism. One would expect the harm and irrationality of patriotism to be self-evident to everyone. But the surprising fact is that cultured and learned people not only do not notice the harm and stupidity of patriotism, they resist every unveiling of it with the greatest obstinacy and passion (with no rational grounds), and continue to praise it as beneficent and elevating.†Leo Tolstoy = “Blind patriotism has been kept intact by rewriting history to provide people with moral consolation and a psychological basis for denial.†William H. Boyer = “Patriotism is a superstition artificially created and maintained through a web of lies and falsehoods, robbing us of our dignity and increasing our arrogance and conceit.†Emma Goldman = “In the beginning of a change, the patriot is a scarce man, brave, hated, and scorned. When his cause succeeds however, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot.†Mark Twain = “If the test of patriotism comes only by reflexively falling into lockstep behind the leader whenever the flag is waved, then what we have is a formula for dictatorship, not democracy... But the American way is to criticize and debate openly, not to accept unthinkingly the doings of government officials of this or any other country.†Michael Parenti = “During times of war, hatred becomes quite respectable even though it has to masquerade often under the guise of patriotism.†Howard Thurman = “Heroism on command, senseless violence, and all the loathsome nonsense that goes by the name of patriotism— how passionately I hate them!†Stephen Decatur = “Patriotism is your conviction that this country is superior to all others because you were born in it.†William Shakespeare Men in authority will always think that criticism of their policies is dangerous. They will always equate their policies with patriotism, and find criticism subversive: Henry Steele Commager - (1902-1998) Historian and author We should take care, in inculcating patriotism into our boys and girls, that is a patriotism above the narrow sentiment which usually stops at one's country, and thus inspires jealousy and enmity in dealing with others... Our patriotism should be of the wider, nobler kind which recognises justice and reasonableness in the claims of others and which lead our country into comradeship with...the other nations of the world. Lord Baden-Powell Our country is not the only thing to which we owe our allegiance. It is also owed to justice and to humanity. Patriotism consists not in waving the flag, but in striving that our country shall be righteous as well as strong. James Bryce More often than not, those leaders who rally the people to kill other people in the name of patriotism and nationalism are usually themselves murders, liars and thieves who through their power cause millions of others to "kill, steal and destroy." Satan is well served by these devious tyrants. Gary Amirault “When a whole nation is roaring patriotism at the top of its voice, I am fain to explore the cleanness of its hands and purity of its heart.†Ralph Waldo Emerson = “The feeling of patriotism - It is an immoral feeling because, instead of confessing himself a son of God . . . or even a free man guided by his own reason, each man under the influence of patriotism confesses himself the son of his fatherland and the slave of his government, and commits actions contrary to his reason and conscience.†Leo Tolstoy, Patriotism and Government = “One of the great attractions of patriotism—it fulfills our worst wishes. In the person of our nation we are able, vicariously, to bully and cheat. Bully and cheat, what’s more, with a feeling that we are profoundly virtuous.†Aldous Huxley = “The dangerous patriot: “The one who drifts into chauvinism and exhibits blind enthusiasm for military actions. He is a defender of militarism and its ideals of war and glory. Chauvinism is a proud and bellicose form of patriotism . . . which identifies numerous enemies who can only be dealt with through military power and which equates the national honor with military victory.†Marine Corps Colonel James A. Donovan = “Patriotism means to stand by the country. It does not mean to stand by the president or any other public official save exactly to the degree in which he himself stands by the country. It is patriotic to support him insofar as he efficiently serves the country. It is unpatriotic not to oppose him to the exact extent that by inefficiency or otherwise he fails in his duty to stand by the country.†Theodore Roosevelt = “Patriotism in its simplest, clearest and most indubitable signification is nothing else but a means of obtaining for the rulers their ambitions and covetous desires, and for the ruled the abdication of human dignity, reason, conscience, and a slavish enthrallment to those in power.†Leo Toystoy = “Patriotism is the belief your country is superior to all other countries because you were born in it.†George Bernard Shaw = “Patriots always talk of dying for their country and never of killing for their country.†Bertrand Russell, attributed = “We should take care, in inculcating patriotism into our boys and girls, that is a patriotism above the narrow sentiment which usually stops at one’s country, and thus inspires jealousy and enmity in dealing with others... Our patriotism should be of the wider, nobler kind which recognises justice and reasonableness in the claims of others and which lead our country into comradeship with...the other nations of the world.†Lord Baden-Powell = “Our country is not the only thing to which we owe our allegiance. It is also owed to justice and to humanity. Patriotism consists not in waving the flag, but in striving that our country shall be righteous as well as strong.†James Bryce = “Each man must for himself alone decide what is right and what is wrong, which course is patriotic and which isn’t. You cannot shirk this and be a man. To decide against your conviction is to be an unqualified and excusable traitor, both to yourself and to your country, let men label you as they may.†Mark Twain = “A man’s country is not a certain area of land, of mountains, rivers, and woods, but it is a principle; and patriotism is loyalty to that principle.†George William Curtis = “It is not easy to see how the more extreme forms of nationalism can long survive when men have seen the Earth in its true perspective as a single small globe against the stars.†Arthur C. Clarke = “Patriotism is not short, frenzied outbursts of emotion, but the tranquil and steady dedication of a lifetime.†Adlai E. Stevenson = “It is lamentable, that to be a good patriot one must become the enemy of the rest of mankind.†Voltaire = “Patriots always talk of dying for their country and never of killing for their country.†Bertrand Russell, attributed = “Our country is not the only thing to which we owe our allegiance. It is also owed to justice and to humanity. Patriotism consists not in waving the flag, but in striving that our country shall be righteous as well as strong.†James Bryce = “Each man must for himself alone decide what is right and what is wrong, which course is patriotic and which isn’t. You cannot shirk this and be a man. To decide against your conviction is to be an unqualified and excusable traitor, both to yourself and to your country, let men label you as they may.†Mark Twain = “You’re not to be so blind with patriotism that you can’t face reality. Wrong is wrong, no matter who does it or says it.†Malcolm X (1925-1965) = “To abolish war it is necessary to abolish patriotism, and to abolish patriotism it is necessary first to understand that it is an evil. Tell people that patriotism is bad and most will reply, ‘Yes, bad patriotism is bad, but mine is good patriotism.’†Leo Tolstoy “A nation is a society united by a delusion about its ancestry and a common fear of its neighbors.†W. R. Inge = “My kind of loyalty was to one’s country, not to its institutions or its officeholders. The country is the real thing, the substantial thing, the eternal thing; it is the thing to watch over, and care for, and be loyal to; institutions are extraneous, they are its mere clothing, and clothing can wear out, become ragged, cease to be comfortable, cease to protect the body from winter, disease, and death.†Mark Twain = “Actions are held to be good or bad, not on their own merits, but according to who does them. There is almost no kind of outrage—torture, imprisonment without trial, assassination, the bombing of civilians—which does not change its moral color when it is committed by ‘our’ side. The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side, he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them.†George Orwell = “Politically speaking, tribal nationalism always insists that its own people are surrounded by ‘a world of enemies’, ‘one against all’, that a fundamental difference exists between this people and all others. It claims its people to be unique, individual, incompatible with all others, and denies theoretically the very possibility of a common mankind long before it is used to destroy the humanity of man.†Hannah Arendt, from her book The Origins Of Totalitarianism p.227 = “Nationalism is a silly cock crowing on his own dunghill.†R. Aldington = “To me, it seems a dreadful indignity to have a soul controlled by geography.†George Santayana = “The notion that a radical is one who hates his country is naive and usually idiotic. He is, more likely, one who likes his country more than the rest of us, and is thus more disturbed than the rest of us when he sees it debauched. He is not a bad citizen turning to crime; he is a good citizen driven to despair.†H.L. Mencken = “Patriotism is your conviction that this country is superior to all other countries because you were born in it.†George Bernard Shaw = “There is almost no kind of outrage—torture, imprisonment without trial, assassination, the bombing of civilians—which does not change its moral color when it is committed by ‘our’ side. The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side, he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them.†George Orwell = “Excessive partiality for one foreign nation and excessive dislike of another cause those whom they actuate to see danger only on one side, and serve to veil and even second the arts of influence on the other. Real patriots who may resist the intrigues of the favorite are liable to become suspected and odious, while its tools and dupes usurp the applause and confidence of the people, to surrender their interests.†George Washington (1732-1799) Founding Father, 1st US President, “Father of the Country†-Source: Farewell Address, September 17, 1796, Ref: George Washington: A Collection, W.B. Allen, ed. (521) = “Let those who would die for the flag on the field of battle give a better proof of their patriotism and a higher glory to their country by promoting fraternity and justice.†Benjamin Harrison, Inaugural Address, 1889 = “Do not regard the critics as questionable patriots. What were Washington and Jefferson and Adams but profound critics of the colonial status quo?†Adlai Stevenson = “We must not confuse dissent with disloyalty. We will not be driven by fear into an age of unreason if we remember that we are not descended from fearful men, not from men who feared to write, to speak, to associate and to defend causes which were, for the moment, unpopular.†Edward R. Murrow = “You do not become a ‘dissident’ just because you decide one day to take up this most unusual career. You are thrown into it by your personal sense of responsibility, combined with a complex set of external circumstances. You are cast out of the existing structures and placed in a position of conflict with them. It begins as an attempt to do your work well, and ends with being branded an enemy of society.†Vaclav Havel = “Guard against the impostures of pretended patriotism.†George Washington = “If the author of the Declaration of Independence were to utter such a sentiment today, the Post Office Department could exclude him from the mail, grand juries could indict him for sedition and criminal syndicalism, legislative committees could seize his private papers and United States Senators would be clamoring for his deportation that he should be sent back to live with the rest of the terrorists.†Frank I. Cobb = “One of the best ways to get yourself a reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the great struggle for independence.†Charles A. Beard = “Our country is not the only thing to which we owe our allegiance. It is also owed to justice and to humanity. Patriotism consists not in waving the flag, but in striving that our country shall be righteous as well as strong.†James Bryce = “Let those who would die for the flag on the field of battle give a better proof of their patriotism and a higher glory to their country by promoting fraternity and justice.†Benjamin Harrison, Inaugural Address, 1889 = “Our country is the world, our countrymen are all mankind. We love the land of our nativity, only as we love all other lands. The interests, rights, and liberties of American citizens are no more dear to us than are those of the whole human race. Hence we can allow no appeal to patriotism, to revenge any national insult or injury.†William Lloyd Garrison, Declaration of Sentiments, Boston Peace Conference, 1838 = “It is a very great mistake to imagine that the object of loyalty is the authority and interest of one individual man, however dignified by the applause or enriched by the success of popular actions.†Samuel Adams (1722-1803), was known as the “Father of the American Revolution.†= "It is not easy to see how the more extreme forms of nationalism can long survive when men have seen the Earth in its true perspective as a single small globe against the stars" Arthur C. Clarke = "A man's country is not a certain area of land, of mountains, rivers, and woods, but it is a principle; and patriotism is loyalty to that principle": George William Curtis = "Flags are bits of colored cloth used first to shrinkwrap people's brains and then as ceremonial shrouds to bury the dead." Arundhati Roy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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