Old Hippie Posted June 7, 2002 Report Share Posted June 7, 2002 One of the more interesting tours of this area involves a bus ride, then a lunch/dinner cruise down the river and a tour of the "real bridge." Which, if I understand correctly was bombed by the allies. The bridge in the center of town is a newer one. I like this area a lot for some reason, saw a few MP's and discos, not really sure on the whole sanuk scene there, but I think there is more to the country than that. As for the cemetery tour, there are are a lot of Netherlanders there as well. I did see a few Americans as well, but was told Lyndon Johnson brought home most of them during his administration. WWII is still a volital issue for many, reguardless of what side you were on. The day I took the tour, there was a bus load of Japanese tourist there as well. I had this occur during the tour of Pearl Harbour some years back. It was interesting to see how they reacted. I assume their intention was the same as mine, to see a piece of history. If we can't move passed certain aspects of the passed, then they will become the fuel for future fires, just look at the middle east and Yugoslavia, they are fighting over issues 100's of years old, not sure there is still a need for it, but non the less they do. It is my hope, that we can all move passed the atrocities of WWII and find common ground to insure such things never happen again. As for Escape Rabbit, I am not sure he deliberately intended to insult or offend anyone with his original post, I think he was merely pointing out a few notes on history. As for atrocitiers of war, no side is innocent. I am reminded of an old quote "...history is written by the victor..." No doubt everyone has a different of who did what, and who really won what or was the hero. Let's try to understand that, and not point fingures, or or claim one is more responsible for the victory. In the PI, I had the honor and privilige of meeting some of the Battaan death march survivors, these men, and all the others like them, and those who fought but didn't make it home are far better men then many of us will ever be. I tend to think they would hate to see us argue now. So let's get back to sanuk! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jp1 Posted June 7, 2002 Report Share Posted June 7, 2002 Well said , OH, I like your attitude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 7, 2002 Report Share Posted June 7, 2002 I appreciate that post too. My aim was to provide historic information to balance the fictional aspects of the movie. It seemed so harmless at the time and I never meant to come off as defending or denying ANY atrocity!!! Yes OH, the bridge was eventually hit by an allied bombing and destroyed. If you would like to judge for yourself, here is the link & brief info on the documentary. If I can provide any common ground at all, I have heard this is a good place for a visit. So can we be one big happy family again? http://store.aetv.com/html/catalog/vp01.jhtml?id=42834 The 1957 film Bridge on the River Kwai won six Academy Awards and may be the most famous and celebrated war movie ever made. But while the story of the collaboration of a British officer and his Japanese captors was the perfect way to illustrate "the great joke of war," it also horrified the POWs who lived through the experience on which the movie was based. THE TRUE STORY OF THE BRIDGE ON THE RIVER KWAI interviews former POWs and guards to reveal what really happened, and how the "collaborating" officer, Lieutenant Colonel Philip Toosey, was a hero, not a traitor. As on soldier recalls, "he was always there to stand between us and the brutality of the Japs." His inspired leadership was the primary reason why only nine of his soldiers died during the construction of the bridge (compared to 16,000 on the Thai-Burma railway overall) and his humanity likely saved the Japanese overseer of the prison camp from execution after the war! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 8, 2002 Report Share Posted June 8, 2002 Escape Rabit... Your aim was to provide some historic information ? Was you there? Do you have some first hand information? I doubt it. Probably you are some armhair historian getting all your facts from a US history TV channel. I find your post deeply insulting not only to me but to all the guys who died out there. Guys who never had the luxury of hypothesising on the internet about something they don't know the fuck about like you do. BTW How comes you are so reluctant to declare your nationality? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 8, 2002 Report Share Posted June 8, 2002 ER seems to have more information than you and most other posters on this thread (including me), even though he wasn't there at the time. In fact, most people there during an historical event have less knowledge and perspective on what happened than reasonable historians after the fact. ER said absolutely nothing that was offensive, unless you find the truth offensive. If you have an issue with his facts, please let us know (I know I plan on looking up that "Butcher" Harris thing when I get a chance). Understanding and knowing the truth of history does more to honor to those who lived it, than does cherishing a fantasy. ER's nationality is and should be irrelevant. The only use you could have for that info woud be to diminish or ridicule whatever he has to say. It is interesting to see how different cultures interpret history, but in this case he was just listing the facts (as he knew them, and that was from an american dominated history channel, so it is irrelevant). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lazyphil Posted June 8, 2002 Report Share Posted June 8, 2002 Why the f**k ER can't show some respect to the fallen men, young men who never had the chance to induldge in too many pleasures in there shortened lives. The lads that made it home were physically and or mentally scared by the experience in Thailand/Burma. Not to mention the 100,000 Asian labourers that perished under the Japanese, did they not (the Japanese that is) considor themselves the liberators of the western imperialists, funny way of showing it. By the way, to answer the original poster, get a public bus to kanchanaburi and check into a guesthouse and they'll sort you some trips out. Erawan waterfall is pretty spectacular. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lazyphil Posted June 8, 2002 Report Share Posted June 8, 2002 The point is the original poster only wanted info on tourist stuff and he waded in bombing us with stuff anyone one of us can pull of the net and throw around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 8, 2002 Report Share Posted June 8, 2002 [color:blue]Why the f**k ER can't show some respect to the fallen men, young men who never had the chance to induldge in too many pleasures in there shortened lives. color=blue> Where is the lack of respect? There was no disrespect in his notes (that I could tell), just cold facts. It would be disrespectful if ER were actually at the Kanchanaburi soldiers' graveyard and offered his opinions on Japanese efficiency to random visitors. Enough time has passed that we should be able to discuss the historical truth with some objectivity. There is a time for solemn and respectful silence and a teary eye, but this board is not it. It's time for all of us to stop hating the Japanese for WWII atrocities. Hate them for pixellating their pornography instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 8, 2002 Report Share Posted June 8, 2002 [color:blue]The point is the original poster only wanted info on tourist stuff and he waded in bombing us with stuff anyone one of us can pull of the net and throw around.color=blue> One could pull that info off the net if one knew it existed. Before I visited Kanchanaburi 99% of my info on the topic was from the movie. I would have found the other perspective interesting if I had known about it. Next time I go, maybe the trip will be more interesting since I'll do some research first. Frankly, I thought the bridge itself (the one in town) was boring and the highlight was walking around the cemetary. Somehow I missed the museum (my tour guide was not a professional The only interesting part about the bridge was wagering whether anyone would fall or be knocked off of it while we were there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lazyphil Posted June 8, 2002 Report Share Posted June 8, 2002 I don't hate Japanese, and I don't remember saying that I did (not sure if that was directed at me or not?), i'm only too aware of my own countries (UK) blood on our hands over many past events throughout the ages. To me it was offensive, as I said before my Grandad (as others may well have too) suffered miserably in Thailand, logic and reason doesn't always come into how something said makes you feel, that is what makes us human. Peace!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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