Steve

I would like to see some quality candidates being seriously considered. Its upside down. Paul, Huntsman and Johnson are the best of the lot. I see that its the ones with a bit of integrity that aren't liikely to be bought off that can't get a look. Speaks volumes of the party.

Dems at least will vote their heart. Obama winning over Hillary proves that. I wouldn't have put money on him in Vegas. He was a long shot. Dems have a habit of picking long shots on occasion. Carter in '76. Clinton in '92. Obama in '08. Can't tell you when a party outsider won for the Republicans. The Republican machine picks the winner and the people go along.

Regardless of the sex scandals, I'm not even counting them. Cain was woefully unprepared to be President. It seemed embarrassingly obvious to me that he had no idea about some basic questions, especially foreign affairs. I cringed when he couldn't answer basic stuff that most of you on this thread knew. Palestine. Egypt. Immigration, as well as other things he has no clue about. I am not starting to believe he never wanted to be President but wanted to sell books. As I said, Commerce Secretary is about as high a level as he should be. He doesn't have a clue about some basic stuff. Sorry. Great personal story no matter what you think of his politics. But Presdential? Not in the least. Some in the media and few of you touting him despite being so unprepared. Its not as bad as Palin but its in the same ballpark.

Come to the party prepared. If a candidate can't do at least that, they shouldn't be in the race.

I think we can call it a day for Cain. Seems like the nail in the coffin for him. Personally, I could give a damn who he is banging. Republicans seem to make more of an issue out of affairs than Dems do but that stands to reason with the moral standards they impose on candidates as well as so much social conservatism.

http://news.yahoo.com/woman-alleges-long-affair-cain-222218960.html

In an explosive allegation, a woman said Monday she and Republican presidential hopeful Herman Cain had a 13-year extramarital affair that lasted nearly until the former businessman announced his candidacy for the White House several months ago.

"Here we go again. I didn't do anything wrong," Cain said in a pre-emptive denial that lumped a detailed claim of a consensual affair in with earlier allegations of sexual harassment.

But the Georgia woman, Ginger White, said in an interview with the Fox 5 Atlanta television station that over the years, Cain bought her airplane tickets so she could join him in cities as far-flung as Palm Springs, California, and Atlanta.

"It was fun," the 46-year-old White said. "It was something that took me away from my humdrum life at the time. And it was exciting."

The secret Fed bailout shows just how arrogant and how much hubris they have. Fact is both Obama and Romney have the balls to do anything about. Paul and possibly Johnson are the only two in the race who would.

I'm more upset at the American people than anyone. In this victim society, we all blame the media. F*ck the media, people are lazy. We have more access to the truth these days than we ever did in our history.

The pizza thingy shows how much they are bought off. Also, biologically tomatoes are fruits. They get clasified as veggies but they are fruits.

Its all bullshine. What gets me is that some of us think that one party will fix things. Its always a lesser of two evils proposition.

Kamui I thought the article was petty. It gets that way at times, from both parties. Dems talked about Bush's vacations as well. The fact is the President never really has a vacation. He has to be available 24/7 for all things. He delegates some of it but he has to be kept abreast of all manner of things.

I like to stick to things that are pertinent when discussing the presidency. I had a discussion with a coworker who commented on one of the candidate's voice. WTF?! Who gives a damn?! That should be way down on the list, way down. If Teddy Roosevelt, one of our greatest Presidents (his face is on Mt. Rushmore along with Jefferson, Lincoln and Washington) would not have been elected today because he had a high pitched whiny voice. He said how the president looks and speaks is important. I agre

Is a guy capable and honest? Everything else should be far down the list. Very far.

This is interesting. Hmmm....I wonder what is going on amongst those countries. History has shown us that when they are left alone, the arabs fight amongst themselves. Give them a common enemy and they unite.

http://news.yahoo.com/unprecedented-step-arab-league-sanctions-syria-190857108.html

In an unprecedented move against an Arab nation, the Arab League on Sunday approved economic sanctions on Syria to pressure Damascus to end its deadly suppression of an 8-month-old uprising against President Bashar Assad.

Interesting that the article doesn't name his party affiliation. Usually its noted but not sure if its how Yahoo news normally does things. Anyway, pussy move by the Governor. Way too sensitive and dropping dime as well. Maybe he didn't know his people were going to call the school but after he found out he should have had a sense of humor about it all and squashed it.

http://news.yahoo.com/teen-tweeter-wont-apologize-kan-governor-230737888.html

Emma Sullivan, 18, of the Kansas City suburb of Fairway, said she isn't sorry and doesn't think such a letter would be sincere.

The Shawnee Mission East senior was taking part in a Youth in Government program last week in Topeka, Kan., when she sent out a tweet from the back of a crowd of students listening to Brownback's greeting. From her cellphone, she thumbed: "Just made mean comments at gov. brownback and told him he sucked, in person (hash)heblowsalot."

She actually made no such comment and said she was "just joking with friends." But Brownback's office, which monitors social media for postings containing the governor's name, saw Sullivan's post and contacted the Youth in Government program.

Sullivan received a scolding at school and was ordered to send Brownback an apology letter. She said Prinicipal Karl R. Krawitz even suggested talking points for the letter she was supposed to turn in Monday.

This is a very positive sign. So, you all who are in America, do things seem on the up? I know the government wants us to spend to start the economy going. However, Americans don't save enough. I'd rather see us spend ONLY if we have proper savings rates amongst Americans. I wouldn't like to see people who are in too much debt be the main ones going to the stores to shop. That said, it is a positive sign because people don't shop unless they are a bit optimistic about things.

http://news.yahoo.com/retailers-robust-start-holiday-season-225348430.html

A record 226 million shoppers visited stores and websites during the four-day holiday weekend starting on Thanksgiving Day, up from 212 million last year, according to early estimates by The National Retail Federation released on Sunday. Americans spent more, too: The average holiday shopper spent $398.62 over the weekend, up from $365.34 a year ago.

HH, Flash and a few others, I'll throw you all a bone..lol. One of my brothers is very right wing. He sent me this:

Whaaaaaaaaaaaat a coincidence!

Hey, this is great! Imagine the odds of this happening.

Do you know the park in NYC that the Wall Street protesters are occupying?

It's Zuccotti Park.

Did you know this park is not owned by the city of New York?

It is owned by Brookfield Properties.

Who was just hired by Brookfield Properties as an attorney?

Vice President Joe Biden's son.

Who sits on the board of Brookfield Properties?

Mayor Bloomberg's live-in girlfriend.

Now, guess what company just received some of the last of the Obama

Stimulus $$$$$$$.

Thaaaaaaaaaaaat's right, Brookfield Properties.

Isn't life great in America!

Now, guess what, on a completely unrelated note,

Wisconsin is shaping up to be the swing state in the 2012 presidential

elections.

Not Florida. Not Ohio. But Wisconsin.

Now, guess who owns the company that will be tabulating the electronic

votes in Wisconsin.

Thaaaaaaaaaaaat's right, the biggest contributor to Obama, the puppeteer

George Soros.

Whaaaaaaaaaaaat a coincidence!

Now remember what Stalin said. "He who votes does not have the power. He

who counts the votes has the power".

 

 

THANKS TO ALL WHO HELPED PUT THIS GREEDY WINDBAG IN OFFICE!!

 

NO PRESIDENT IN HISTORY HAS SPENT SO MUCH MONEY FLYING AROUND THE WORLD SPENDING TAX PAYERS MONEY IN HISTORY!!

Three things. 1. I question the accuracy of this statement. 3 years in office and he spent more than 8 years of Bush and Clinton? The only way if is if the cost of AF1 in totality has gone up (oil prices, pay of secret service, etc.). I can't believe that it costs more now especially when both his predecessors used it for re-election and thats a ton of traveiing. 2. Does any President have a choice? They can't use private commercial airline can they? furthermore, ex Presidents have secret service for life and with all the talking circuit money they do both nationally and internationally, there has to be a ton of money spent there. 3. So what? I hate tax money being spent wastefully as the next guy but okay he'll be replaced by a Romney or whomever who will use the services of secret service and AF1 as well.

Perry's new campaign poster.

Why doesn't the party heirarchy want Paul and Johnson to be herad? I know why? The party has lost its soul. It picks its candidates to face the Dems not on hearing all views and letting the people decide but who polls better. They are also scared of candidates that can't be bought. The marriage of the corporate power structure and religious zealots have ruined the party. Just to show you the hypocracy, the fundamentalists support a mormon, a religion they consider a cult over a president who is a public saved Chritisn. They are convenient Chritians. They always say America should be led by a Chrisitan but it seems there is an exception if he's a Democrat. Frankly, a person's religion shouldn't even be on the table for things to consider in a president. So, I have no problem with Romney's mormonism as long as it plays no part in his office and he is capable.

http://news.yahoo.com/longshot-republican-candidate-mulls-third-party-run-183023075.html

Disgruntled former New Mexico governor Gary Johnson says he is considering leaving the Republican slate and running as a third-party candidate in the 2012 presidential election.

"I feel abandoned by the Republican Party," Johnson, who has been left out of most of the Republican debates, told the Sante Fe New Mexican newspaper this week, saying he might seek the Libertarian Party's support.

"The Republican Party has left me by the wayside," said Johnson, whose polling numbers have recently been so low that they are often not even being picked up by pollsters.

"If I'd have been included in 16 of the last debates we wouldn't even be having this conversation," he said.

While the Libertarians are on the ballot in every state, Johnson acknowledged that the party, which espouse freedom of expression and action, had never received more than one percent of the nationwide vote.

Johnson, 58, holds dear libertarian values such as low taxes and limited government and wants to legalize marijuana. He is also a fitness fanatic, having competed in a number of "Ironman" triathlons and climbed Mount Everest.

Ex-Massachusetts governor Mitt Romney and former House of Representatives speaker Newt Gingrich are currently topping the polls of Republican candidates trying to unseat President Barack Obama in November 2012.

The months-long state-by-state voting process that will decide the nominee begins on January 3 in Iowa.

You know. I know it may be a weak arguemnt that she doesn't deserve it since they were married for so long but c'mon! If I was rich I'd never get married. I'd be living the Tony Stark, Ironman, billionaire playboy life. I'd CS jr snipped and have at it.

http://tv.yahoo.com/blogs/yahoo-tv/hulk-hogan-divorce-details-public-210908388.html

So much for 50/50. Linda Bollea received more than 70% of the couple's liquid assets. But the pain doesn't stop there for the Hulkster. His ex also received a 40% ownership stake in Hulk's companies. Plus, she received a $3 million property settlement.

So, what are the gritty details? According to the documents, Linda Bollea got a lump sum of $7.44 million from the couple's investment accounts. The remaining $2.97 million went to the Hulk.

The properties were either sold or are still on the market. The couple's home used in "Hogan Knows Best" was originally listed for nearly $14 million. It is now available for around $8.87 million. Once that sells, Hogan will owe his ex-wife $1.45 million. The two will split the remaining proceeds.

Additionally, Linda Bollea received several cars in the split, including a Mercedes-Benz, a Corvette, a Cadillac Escalade, and a Rolls-Royce. Hulk received many of the remaining automobiles.

It may sound like Hulk got body slammed, but it's not all bad news for the iconic wrestler. Deadspin explains that the Hulkster will get to keep any money he earns from personal appearances and will not have to pay alimony.

The banks can do what they want to a large extent. I don't like what BofA are doing and I think the government should be doing a better job of protecting the people when they offer contracts such as these. What is worse is the big banks having the influence to kill of the alternatives like credit unions who they have been trying to legislate out of existence even though they are a tiny part of the banking market.

http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2011/11/14/367467/bank-of-america-unemployment-benefit-fees/

...Millions of jobless Americans [like Busby] have little choice but to rely on the bank’s prepaid debit cards to collect their monthly benefits. Forty-one states have contracted with Bank of America, Wells Fargo, JP Morgan Chase, and other banks to provide access to public benefits, allowing them to collect unlimited fees, both from the unemployed and state governments. South Carolina, for instance, pays Bank of America a fee for each transfer it facilitates on a debit card, and for handling direct deposit of unemployment benefits.

Families who are living hand-to-mouth are outraged to discover that banks worth trillions of dollars are taking such a big cut of their benefits, when they depend on every penny. The New York Times reports today that banks have been quietly raising fees on everything from replacing lost cards to monthly maintenance. BofA customers can be charged $1.50 for speaking to a customer service operator more than once a month, $1.50 for using an “out-of-network†ATM, and $0.50 for entering the wrong PIN number too many times...

Immortals. Not bad, but not great. My subjective opinion. Others may love it. Maybe old age creeping in but I got lost a wee bit regarding the Titans and the Gods. Still, had good special effects. To be honest it was the only thing at the threatre that seemed interesting that I didn't have to wait too long to see.

Rather than start another thread I'll 'edit' this one and add this stuff.

Started watching The Walking Dead tv show and I thought it was gonna just another zombie movie but its damn good! It has great subplots.

One show that I don't think is that great but for some reason I keep tuning in every week is Terrnova. I must say one of the actors who was the bad guy in Avatar, the commander and he basically plays a military commander in this one too but is a good guy, is in incredible shape for a guy his age. Read his bio and he's up there in age.

Another show that I didn't expect to be good that was mentioned a few pages back is 'Game of Thrones'. I downloaded the first season and loved it! Can't wait for season 2. I love the midget. Totally pissed off at Stark's daughter who in my view sells out her family to live out some fantasy dream about being a princess. Sorry, spoiler. Some sympathize with her. I didn't. I want to read teh book to get deeper into it.

One last show that I can't wait for is the new Sherlock Holmes that only had a few episodes. Why only a few?! This show was made in England and the new Holmes is a socially awkward maladjusted a hole. Some one told me he was modeled after the main character in 'House' and I can totally see it!

Tears Of The Sun

 

I saw this movie. Liked it very much.

While I think that the president of the USA is much more powerful than many other heads of states, it seems that the system is so dysfunctional that even the strongest president can't win against the vested interests, the extremely powerful lobby groups and the corruption. The failure of the super committee has shown that there are extremely strong groups which are not interested in a solution which would pull the USA out of the mess. For those groups their own interests are more important than the fate of the USA.

I knew a guy who was a congressional page in his idealistic years just out of college. He left completely convinced the country was chronically broken and would never be fixed...and this guy was a page in '70s! He said, idealistic people often go and after they see the enormity and the endemic corruption that permeates all levels of government even the judicial to some extent they just give up and either return home or join the money/power train. I spoke to him on skype a few weeks ago and he laughed it took me this long to realize something he had told me years ago.

The sad fact is that even if a Ron Paul gets elected it won't matter. The real problem is that members of congress are usually there longer than the President as well as the CEOs of the corportations that own them. Even if the CEOs leave or retire the corporation's main goals of favorable laws and regulations remain. They can wait out any president that opposes them. Even 8 years. Congress has to change, thats the place that needs a lot of Ron Pauls or Gary Johnsons.

Take away the special interst and I think opposing ideologies can compromise. They don't now because they have toe the line. Remove this and I honestly think, two honest and decent guys with different ideologies like BT and HH on here could find middle ground. No doubt both want the best for the country and wouldn't be bought off. Both would have some deal breakers but that's okay. I honestly think there is enough left for things to get done. We just have to remove the power brokers behind the scenes. Maybe I'm still a bit too idealistic.

Newt is that type of guy that throws you a curve when you expect a fastball every once in a while. I know its a touchy issue but I agree with him. Did they break the law? Yes, however, the party picks and chooses which lawbreakers it wants to bring to task and which ones it doesn't. There are politicians who deserve jail time technically for stuff but they find a way to protect each other. These candidates are pandering. I don't like illegal immigration any more than the next guy. Live in LA or for that matter any of the southwestern states long enough and you'll come across very decent people who are just trying to make a better life for themselves. Many of whom served and risked their lives for this country in its wars. I absolutely guarantee you had the european immigrants to America been in Canada and Mexico instead of an ocean away they'd be streaming across in the same manner as the latinos have. All this my great grandfather came here from [insert any european country here] stuff is basically he had no choice but to come here legally. Even plenty of them came here illegally. I've often heard that many Italians (amongst others) had doctored and fraudulent papers. The REAL issue is enforcing the border. Is it enforceable? Some say no. I guarantee you if an Al Qaida terrorist did something tragic and came through the southern borders, it would be sealed faster than a New York minute.

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/newt-gingrich-prepared-heat-immigration-043951171.html

"I don't see how the party that says it's the party of the family, is going to adopt an immigration policy which destroys families that have been here a quarter century," the former House Speaker said. "And I'm prepared to take the heat for saying 'let's be humane and enforce the law without giving them citizenship but by finding a way to create legality so they are not separate from their families.'"

Gingrich—who advocates the Vernon K. Krieble Foundation's immigration proposal to create "red card" work permits-- said he does support deporting recent illegal immigrants. But he did disown a hardline policy of seeking out and punishing children of illegal immigrants, including those who wish to serve in the U.S. military. As rival candidate Michele Bachmann was quick to point out, Gingrich's position shares many affinities with the DREAM Act proposal defeated in Congress last year. And Bachmann, together with other conservative candidates on the dais, called out Gingrich for backing a version of amnesty for the families of people who entered the United States illegally.

I guarantee you this is a department that has nothing to do and trying to find anything to justify its existence. Give me a friggin' break. Just talk to the guy and let him keep his haul. Taking money out of the guy's hands that he could use to employ folks and god forbid make a little money. If I was the secretary of whatever department that oversees that I would call them up and say 'Really? Are you that bored? Use some friggin' common sense.'

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow/man-catches-881-pound-tuna-seized-feds-194650751.html

A Massachusetts fisherman pulled in an 881-pound tuna this week only to have the federal authorities take it away. It sounds like a libertarian twist on the classic novella by Ernest Hemingway, The Old Man and the Sea, but for Carlos Rafael, the saga is completely true.

Rafael and his crew were using nets to catch bottom-dwellers when they inadvertently snagged the giant tuna. However, federal fishery enforcement agents took control of the behemoth when the boat returned to port. The reason for the seizure was procedural: While Rafael had the appropriate permits, fishermen are only allowed to catch tuna with a rod and reel.

It would seem that unlike the fictional New England shark hunters in Jaws, Rafael didn't need a bigger boat, just a better permit.

In an interview with the Standard-Times of New Bedford, Rafael disputes the claims from the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration's (NOAA) enforcement division that the humungous tuna was trawled from the bottom of the Atlantic. "They didn't catch that fish on the bottom," he said. "They probably got it in the mid-water when they were setting out and it just got corralled in the net. That only happens once in a blue moon."

And while Rafael is denied the mother of all fish stories, the federal impoundment of his catch also means he's probably losing out on a giant payday. A 754-pound tuna recently sold for nearly $396,000. NOAA regulators do not share any of the proceeds from the fish's eventual sale with a fisherman found in violation of federal rules.

"They said it had to be caught with rod and reel," a frustrated Rafael said. "We didn't try to hide anything. We did everything by the book. Nobody ever told me we couldn't catch it with a net."..

I will say this about Newt. Recently, he's come under fire for supposedly wanting to bring back child labor and break child labor laws. I saw what he said and it is taken out of context. He was discussing inner city jobs and said it may be best to offer the job of janitorial work in the schools to the poor students than to a unionized janitor. I can see the logic in that. One of the best things for teens in the inner city is to see what its like to get a paycheck. Janitors in some of these school districts are getting paid well over 50k a year or more because they've been in the job for a long time. Its a cushy job. A case can be made for either. That janitor probably lives in the inner city and raised a family, bought a house and car on that salary so although we may not like paying a guy 50k a year to clean a school the residual benefits of that wage probably did more good than bad.

Of course on the other hand provding a source of income for inner city kids and perhaps keeping them from gangs and drugs by instilling a work ethic and a paycheck will have residual benefits as well.

That said, I looked at Gingrich's economic plan and its pretty much the basic Republican mantra. Cut capital gains and corporate rates. Drill anywhere you want. Cut regulations so companies can do whatever they want. He wants a flat tax as an alternative as well. That will have holes as well. I think he's a smart guy. I just don't agree wtih his policies or politics. I don't care about his personal life. If he wants to bang two women thats his issue as long as it doesn't affect his job. Both the French and Italian leaders have mistresses and banging anything that moves and they're doing their job.

Finally NONE of the Republican leaders address health care. All they can say is repeal Obamacare as some mantra and offer NOTHING of consequences instead. Over 60 percent of Americans who file a BK do so for health cost reasons. If that isn't an urgent matter I don't know what is. However, they offer NOTHING. Why? The health care industry owns them. Pure and simple. The Health Savings Plan thingy is a crock of shit. Poor and working class can't possibly save enough for catostrophic events. They parrot the health care industry with this 'best medical care in the world' bullshit while those of us on this forum from America go to Thailand to have medical work done and its also why medical tourism to places such as India and Thailand is booming and has been for some time. That is a great system? They demonize nationalized health care as if its straight out of the communist manifesto. We have the great advantage of seeing what other nations have done right and wrong with national healthcare but the very notion is demonized.

Why do you think a change in the White House will change much?

Exactly. I would have no problem changing my vote from Obama if Paul was the candidate. I know he's not everyon'es cup of tea so I'll offer Gary Johnson. Read about him. 2 term governor or New Mexico where Democrats are 2-1 over Republicans. He balanced their budget, he wants to legalize pot. He's pro choice. He's as honest as they come, self made mulit-millionaire, NOT bought off by the special interest. Its one of the reasons he's NOT a favorite of the Republican heirarchy since they're all bought off. Huntsman is reasonable as well.

Romney has NO concrete plan other than the conservative mantra and even that is said in broad strokes. I swore off the Republican party in '08 and I see no evidence that they will even do what they say. Reagan ended with a deficit and we became a debtor nation for the first time under Reagan but he's hailed as the greatest president in history. Bush gave us the deficit as well. They preach one thing, get in office and do another. Deficits and overspending is fine as long as we're fighting wars that profit the military/industrial complex and big oil. Its so much utter and complete BS and I'm angry at myself for not seeing it all earlier.

The Dems are no prize. I'm aware of that. I'm officially independent but will go with a Dem over a Republican in almost all cases these days.

As for Perry, let me tell you about Texas. I heard this once and its accurate. A Texan Democrat is more conservative than a New York Republican. Its so true. I recall Bush saying he worked with Dems while a governor. The whole state is right of center and any Dem who wants statewide office has to be at a minimum right down the middle.

All I hear from conservatives is what Obama is doing wrong and I don't hear what their man will do. Republicans are masters of public opinion. Gotta give them that. What will Romney actually do?

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/07/us/politics/07romney.html?pagewanted=all

"repealing President Obama’s health care law, cutting the corporate tax rate, placing sanctions on China as a currency manipulator and immediately reducing taxes on savings and investment by the middle class.."

also..

"...his economic plan is a classic Republican blueprint that relies on tax cuts and reduced regulation — not stimulus — to jump-start the economy"

and

"..he promised to immediately cut the corporate income tax rate, currently topping out at 35 percent, to 25 percent."

This is BS. Cutting taxes will make rich companies richer. In the article economists state that there has never been proven historically that it creates jobs. I've said ad nauseum on this thread that its NOT high taxes that are stopping companies from hiring, its no faith in the short and long term future of the economy as a whole.

As for sanctions of China? WTF?!! Insane. Reducing regulations is needed in some areas. However, if we can go by Repubican history its to let companies do all kinds of shit. For instance, ability to drill for oil in the Gulf waters as well as build a pipeline through the middle of the country, regs to make it easier to drill for coal, oil , shale oil and depending on how 'green' you are, its not a great idea. We need to LESS dependent on oil NOT more.

None of his plans involve infrastructure and that makes Obama's idea infinitely better than Romney's. Infrastructure spending amongst other things is a no brainer. It ticks off all the boxes. It creates American jobs for American companies, working class and middle class jobs, the REAL people who jump start the economy because they have to buy the groceries, cars, household appliances, houses, etc. that companies need. Also, its needed. There are so many tunnels, bridges and the like that are in desparate need of repair but infrastructure spending is also high tech needs as well so there are jobs for technical, white collar folks as well

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/21/opinion/how-china-can-defeat-america.html?_r=4&pagewanted=all

How China Can Defeat America

I don't think America can accomplish much with only 2 parties. I think a 3rd party has to emerge to force some things. Maybe a 3rd party will only make things worse. Its possible but if a true 3rd party could emerge that was NOT bought by the special interest it may reverse some things.

The root of everything is that both parties are given marching orders by special interests. Some have been 'Stockholm'd' to the point where they see the wants as the special interest as ideology.

So much of the bills that go through the Congress is written by special interest groups for the Congresspersons to argue on their behalf and they are given talking points.

Obama made a huge mistake initally for not concentrating on what the country needed at the time. A President who was going to concentrate on improving the economy and creating jobs. The Health Care bill could have waited. It should have waited. The Republicans didn't help. Why should they? The unwritten rule is who ever is in the White House gets the credit or the blame so why help unless there is some way they can get part or all of the credit?

The said truth as I see it (and I hope and pray I am completely wrong) is that pretty much nothing will save us. Two significant things happened this decade that should have given us a kick in the ass to get our house in order and do some things right: 9/11 and '08 Prime Mortgage/Financial Crisis. Our response (from our leadership) has been almost treasonous. We used 9/11 to enter wars and take away civil liberties. We used the financial crisis to save those that caused it and left the ones most hurt by it to suffer. In both cases very powerful institutions benefited greatly.

Obamacare

The refreshing thing about many Dems is that they will be honest about their feelings and criticize each other. Chris Matthews has valid points. During the 8 years of Bush, Republicans did nothing. Many saw the BS, erosion of freedoms and civil liberties and stood idly by. Even the media. The party it seems is more important than the nation. I truly believe maney see the party and the country as the same so being loyal to the Republican party is being a good American and being loyal to America.

This painting of Obama as the worst President is inaccurate to be kind. He's not even the worse this century. He put himself in a position where he had to walk on water. He has made mistakes. The conservative mantra has been to transfer the blame of the debt to him instead of Bush. I am very confident that had McCain been elected we'd be in as bad or worse of a situation. The wars would still be going on with much higher participation and that would have soaked up untold billions. bin Laden would all likely still be alive and enjoying life in a Pakistani mansion. All McCain would have done is cut taxes for the rich and they'd be richer than they are now and we'd be seeing more people suffering from cuts to social welfare, medicare and the VA.

Its the loss of power NOT the state of the country that has Republicans and conservatives pissed off. The '90s told me that. The country was doing phenominally well so their focus moved to morals. Even dredging up stuff from way back with the Rose law firm thingy. Who cared?

Gary Johnson and Huntsman have great records as governors but are overlooked by Republicans. If you can't take Paul, Johnson and Huntsman are great alternatives. Romney or Perry can't hold a candle to these guys. Romney's ONLY value for them is that he polls well against Obama.