Guest Posted August 21, 2001 Report Share Posted August 21, 2001 You did the right thing Phil, but its not your life you should worry about but your job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 22, 2001 Report Share Posted August 22, 2001 quote: Originally posted by KhunK: One thing I have noticed is Thais react strongly, in a volcanic sense, to when somebody catches them in a lie. Rather than be ashamed, they get aggressive. It is considered a big sin to make somebody lose face and you committed that sin even though they are the true sinners. But I would have done the same thing too. Don't you find it fun when they freak out over losing face when it is their fault to begin with? If you really want to see them freak tell them "Mai dong moo-sa" which is the Pali Buddhist precept: "Don't lie!" I have only vaguely noticed this in past, but as I stop and think about it now, you are absolutely right. It is an interesting character flaw. Also potentially dangerous. I am thinking now about a couple of people I know to which your little observation clearly applies; I don’t think I would quote your Buddhist precept to them if I caught them in a lie. But I wouldn’t mind someone else doing so, provided I was safely out of harm’s way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 22, 2001 Report Share Posted August 22, 2001 The Thai receptionists have now been told to give information to would-be residents in a private room behind the reception area rather than give the information over the counter. Just in case Phil's around reading the Bangkok Post and having an earwig. So people are still being lied to - but in private. How despicable is that??? I asked the receptionist today what it felt like having a job where she has to lie for a living. She gave me that irritating mai ben rai shrug of the shoulders and while I've never ever hit a lady - she came mighty f***ing close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 22, 2001 Report Share Posted August 22, 2001 Phil, Certainly, you did the right thing in a stricly moral sense. I would have done the same thing in my hometown or in any other Western country. However, from what I have read about society in Thailand, I may not have done what you did. I'll be the first to admit - I would be concerned about possible reprisals. This is an ethical dilemma that everyone faces now and again in their life. Sometimes I read reports about a 'whistle-blower' in a company or government who gets fired after blowing the whistle, or is forced out of their job. It comes down to: 1) how morally outraged you are, 2) what is the possibility and severity of any reprisal and 3) how brave a person you are. JG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 22, 2001 Report Share Posted August 22, 2001 Hi BP, A bit late I know and I appreciate I have had a couple of days to think about it! but here's what I would done (If I had thought about it at the time!). When you heard the Farang getting the BS about cable you should have wandered accross and butted in and pretended (?!!) to be a bit slow and said something along the lines of "oh good, you are getting cable now" and appeared really pleased and whilst you were their explained to them BOTH why you were so happy ie that you hadn't had cable for a long time, that people were leaving because of it as they had all got fed up with waiting and you hadn't expected them to put it in. Maybe suggest to the Farang that if he was worried about them not putting it in after he moves in that instead he gives YOU a call to check when it has been connected - but stress that their is no need as you are SURE they are telling the truth as after all it has only been six months with no cable..... so far. Any attempts at the manager to contradict / interject could be met with your not understanding, so no need to stop your explanantion. Remember to smile when you are being "helpful"! Face saving all round (sort off!)and the Farang should have still got the message - unless it was me with a hangover Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 22, 2001 Report Share Posted August 22, 2001 It comes down to: 1) how morally outraged you are, 2) what is the possibility and severity of any reprisal and 3) how brave a person you are. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 4) How crazy or stupid are you.. Unfortunately I suffer from 3 of the above and never consider 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 22, 2001 Report Share Posted August 22, 2001 BKK Phil Good show!! I like it when somebody exposes liars for what they are--particularly when a liar is trying to cheat somebody out of their money. I've read a lot of messages here that makes me believe there are a lot of shrinking violets around. Afraid of this, afraid of that...etc. Seems that they are afraid to confront a Thai about anything. All worried too much about "cement boots", ducks, etc. Thai's don't put up with crap. They have their own way of taking care of things. They're living in a global community now and its time that they start learning some of the culture of this new community of theirs. Believe me, my Thai friends in the U.S. are certainly aware of the differences, and they are not in a hurry to hustle "home". They guys back at TI would be proud of ya. chongnoi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 22, 2001 Report Share Posted August 22, 2001 Originally posted by pattaya127: "aggression and violence? examples, please..." The Australian auditor (?) who investigated the finances of that sugar mill in Nakhon Sawan was gunned down after he had accused the owner during a board meeting of malpractice (cheating). Thais take it very badly when they get caught out lying or cheating - the onus is on YOU, who catches them out. Shoot the messenger not yourself. A friend of mine (another outspoken Aussie) had a smashed beer bottle rammed into his back in a restaurant by a waitress. The reason? He had complained that the food that day was not as good as usual. He's a very friendly guy, not aggressive at all and speaks very good Thai. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 22, 2001 Report Share Posted August 22, 2001 The last two seem rather extreme. My experience is that Thais are increasingly demanding service and customer satisfaction. I deal with cases on an idividual basis, here are the last two:- 1) On trying to return a printer cartridge to Tesco Lotus. I paid for the cartridge by Visa card, on returning it because it would not fit even after being informed by the sales girl it would; I was told the refund would be made in 45 days. Not satisfied I asked to speak to the customer service supervisor, she re-stated 45 days. I asked to see the store manager....... 30 seconds later I was refunded in cash. 2) Padded bill at Karaoke venue, I informed the cashier that I had not ordered the "snacks" and that I only pay for "lady drinks" when I have agreed to pay for them. Result halfing of bill which was 100 or so less than the true amount. Moral..... Don't let them get away with it. Some of us deserve the epithet "Stupid Farang" .......... I don't believe I'm one!! Back to the original gripe....... Tell the lying bastard to install cable or you will join the departing throngs too. So by saving money on cable, he has seen ten or so paying tenants leave his building, even Toxic Sinalot could see the bad business sense in that!!!! The phrase "ha'p'worth of tar" springs to mind ....... must be some of sort of Thai-Chinese business ethic. I'm beginning to despise the money grabbing Thai-chinese sector. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattaya127 Posted August 23, 2001 Report Share Posted August 23, 2001 quote: Originally posted by Scum_Baggio: Originally posted by pattaya127: "aggression and violence? examples, please..." The Australian auditor (?) who investigated the finances of that sugar mill in Nakhon Sawan was gunned down after he had accused the owner during a board meeting of malpractice (cheating). Thais take it very badly when they get caught out lying or cheating - the onus is on YOU, who catches them out. Shoot the messenger not yourself. A friend of mine (another outspoken Aussie) had a smashed beer bottle rammed into his back in a restaurant by a waitress. The reason? He had complained that the food that day was not as good as usual. He's a very friendly guy, not aggressive at all and speaks very good Thai. Well, the first case is a bit far-fetched. Are we talking trying to prevent corruption at the million$ level or just everyday incidents? second case, why not, i will believe you, but again, it's a case of a friend of a friend. not that it does not happen, but to say that farangs complaining about something in LOS ends up in violence is a bit extreme, still. IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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