Guest Posted June 27, 2001 Report Share Posted June 27, 2001 Maybe I should have said "As a historian, I loved Angkor and Tol Seng". The latter being very sobering indeed. After studying this type of human behavior at different places around the world, I begin to wonder why it doesnt happen more often. I see some of the cruelty in the sanuk scene and it turns me off big-time. Aloha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 27, 2001 Report Share Posted June 27, 2001 hi, km11fan here, i was banned for offering info on cambodia (?). i was told someone replied to my post, but khun sanuk deleted it before i saw it. what can i say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattaya127 Posted June 27, 2001 Report Share Posted June 27, 2001 Mykal, one of the most touching experiences i had in PNH was to go see the young dancers training at the School of Fine Arts (in front of French Embassy). first they are beautiful (apsara stuff),but to see resurrection of the almost defunct art of Cambodian royal theater is balm to the heart. Strongly recommended, with another view of what women and young girls can achieve in a poor country. you will come out of it a better man than by shooting grenades at the range, IMO. Dance practicing is morning only, 9 to 12... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 1, 2001 Report Share Posted July 1, 2001 Flonzewall wrote... "if you are into having sex with women and girls who to a large part are enslaved or debt contract bonded, than you might have a great time in cambodia." Indentured labor certainly is part of much of the brothel prostitution in Cambodia, as it is in Indonesia and other South-East Asian countries. I've never been able to figure out who was and who wasn't. If a girl can't go overnight it could be an indicator, but not a guaranteed one. Indentured labor is not only an intrenched part of the sex business in third world countries but in many other industries including agriculture and domestic service. "if you do not mind that there is a fair chance that your sex toy has been tortured and beaten so that she is more willing to give the brothels customers a great time, than go." I have been with hundereds of brothel girls and only twice, did any girls ask me for pity/escape instead of a tip. One appeared to be lying. For all I know the other one owed money and wanted out of her contractual obligations. But she may have been mistreated. I couldn't be sure. So, yes, I would be the first to say that coersion does exist in the sex trade in Cambodia. The question is do what degree and how can it be alleviated? Obviously the potential for corecion is an issue that needs to be solved. Decriminalization could be one step. I once interviewed a nurse in Tuol Kork and she said that almost all the working girls came voluntarily into prostitution. Sob stories are wonderful for the press. I never read in the Phnom Penh Post any interviews with girls consciously choosing sex work when this was obviously the predominant case, much much more than horrific stories of kidnapping and torture. I am reminded of the books that came out in Victorian times about 'White Slave Trade', how hookers in London and New York were really chained to their beds and beaten daily. This simply wasn't the reality at all. When religious reformers patrolers came through San Fransicso they offered prostitutes the opportunity to become 'decent women'. None took them up on their offer. Of course Cambodia is not the USA, but it is similar to Europe some centuries ago when indentured labor existed there too. The reason one doesn't read stories of women earning money, enjoying a more comfortable life off the rice paddy and women deciding to help their families out, is that it doesn't make good sensational reading. I don't claim that hooking is a romantic job, but neither is working in a carpet factory in Pakistan or being a home sweeper in Calcutta. IMHO anti-prostitution propoganda hurts the poor the most. Women with no skills, no job training and no capital can easily work on their backs. Yet NGOs and do-gooders would have them work in factories for the Taiwanese. I abhor policemen and politicians, fellow women among them, who would tell a woman what she can do with her body and life. Legalize prostitution. And social change is necessary too. As the sculptor Gauguin wrote: "Women want to be free. That's their right. And it is not men who stand in their way. The day a woman's honor is no longer located below the navel, she will be free. And perhaps healthier too" The enemy is fraud, theft and coercion. This is often done by gangsters, but more typically by the state and special interests of the ruling class. Conclusion: Are there abuses in the sex trade in Cambodia? Yes. What's the best thing you can do to avoid being involved? Treat the girls well and tip directly and generously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 1, 2001 Report Share Posted July 1, 2001 winston james, before you play down the abuses in cambodian brothels, read my post about what i saw and answer me on these points you so comfortably left out. yes, of course you are in the opinion that anti prostitution "propaganda" hurts the poor the most, you want to keep on visiting the cheapest brothels and continue making money from disgusting videos. plans by NGOs and do-gooders to get the poor out of their trapped situation would make that impossible for you. most of all, slavery i will never accept as prostitution. by the way, from the women and girls i spoke with about 70% were against their will in their brothels, the ones who volontarily worked there had been open about it. the way not to get involved is simply not get involved, tipping generously and treating them well just lightens your own conscience but does not change their situation at all. the enemy is everybody who profits from indentured prostitution, the brothelowners, the policemen who receive protection money and the clients who only care about sating their libido. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 6, 2001 Report Share Posted July 6, 2001 I think there is plenty of action for most of us at Martini's and similar places where most of the girls are freelancers, especially if you want to avoid the brothel scene. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 6, 2001 Report Share Posted July 6, 2001 "frisson" is the elegant version of "edge" - i know exactly what you mean, because Jo'burg has it (though for different reasons), and i had this feeling too first hours spent in angeles (though of course not after it became familiar)- there is an illicit quality in the air, a threat which is not articulated, until you cross the shadow line- by the way, in response to another message here, MSN Fun in Cambodia is run by a mcarhyist unlike its equivalent site at delphi,- i'm posting on http//:forums/delphi.com/luzonladies- someone i met in payyaya jun/01 described cam. sanukers as "irregular", as in to assume these risks you would have to be an irregular character- i'm looking forward to my first trip to PP/SP! jOa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ricosuave Posted July 7, 2001 Report Share Posted July 7, 2001 Jim of Arabia, im sorry you feel that way about the msn sanukcambodia site. We are quite easy going, but have one firm rule. No discussion of underage girls in any way shape or form for the quite reasonable reason that we dont want to encorage pedophilia or give lurkers information as to where to find underage girls in Cambodia. We have only banned 4 members out of over 400, and all for this very reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 7, 2001 Report Share Posted July 7, 2001 jimofarabia has arrived! finally the most racist maniac i have ever seen posting on the boards. moderators before you ban me for flaming read his post i cut and pasted from the FIC board which he posted there. this post actually stunned me, i was speachless for a while after reading that. From: JIMOFARABIA Jul-5 1:32 am To: ALIAS16 (3 of 5) 507.3 in reply to 507.2 did you know bombay is the biggest brothel (by far) in the world? i lived there for 2 yrs 93/95 and every fri/sat- imbibed with kingfisher or haywards beer- taken at mondegar/ leopald on colaba- would jump in a taxi- too self deluding to admit unless so imbibed of my overwhelming sense of superiority which then gave me an appetite to fuck a 3rd world piece of dirty brown meat- and 50 rupees, 20 mins ride later we arrive, in a vast rat infested thoroughfare - nr falklands rd, but not the cages of falklands rd- of victoriana buildings without a rupee spent on maintenance for 100 yrs- and because i was in the know - for 150 rps only- make my choice of the parade of girls before me- always the only westerner- always the girls wearing sarees- if you're lucky the odd girl from nagaland, or another eastern province, more chinese looking- and i'd fuck in a drunken stupor- but always feeling good afterwards- enjoying the taxi ride back- past chowpatty- and before entering the grand entrance of the taj hotel- satisfied in this dichotomy betw. having been so intimate with the poorest girl in the world, and now in the portals of its grandest dame- i've not mentioned india in lusonladies on delphi- but this thread reminds me that i should- and that i should return also! Oh! god- let the sanuk times roll jOa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 7, 2001 Report Share Posted July 7, 2001 Flyonzewall, For once we are in complete agreement, I wondered how long it would take this guy to show up here. Not good. The post you quoted is one of his milder ones, I don't know if the original one where he said that any girl past puberty is fair game is still up on FunInCambodia but if anyone has read that then you will have no doubt as to this guy's intentions. He gives us all a bad name. Rico, Dead right, I wonder how long it will be before he shows his true colours here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.