Guest Posted October 8, 2001 Report Share Posted October 8, 2001 quote: Originally posted by Blackie: William Ginzer, could you please clarify the amount earned in a month by the average factory worker in an IBM plant in Thailand. I should imagine it's a lot less than 40KB/month. My TGF wants to know.(So do I) TIA blackie Here is what I said in the post above: quote: [T]he total average for an entire subsidiary (which also provides services which will raise the average), [and which] total does include factory workers... This is highly skilled labor, but the actual factory workers will be paid lower than [THB 40,000 per month] I am quoting from my own post - with clarifying comments in brackets to provide context - but I think this will make things clearer. Having now stated this twice, I hope this clarifies matters. The more interesting issue is this claim that Seagate pays full time factory workers THB 4,000 a month. I asked for information from the poster so that it would be possible to check that claim, but have not see anything yet. Is that information available? [ October 08, 2001: Message edited by: William Ginzer ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bembaman Posted October 9, 2001 Report Share Posted October 9, 2001 I know of a fishing net factory/workshop in Chinag Rai area where they are getting B20 per day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 9, 2001 Report Share Posted October 9, 2001 "I know of a fishing net factory/workshop in Chinag Rai area where they are getting B20 per day." 20 baht a day - amazing! Anybody going to try to top that with a story about wages of 10 baht a day? My boss, a farang, pays his full time live-in maid 8,000 baht a month (plus room and board), his Thai counterpart only pays 3,500 a month (but has one less kid), my boss's secretary gets exactly 38,500 baht per month (plus insurance, parking privileges, two months bonus at the end of the year, etc.), and I know I guy that keeps his Mia Noi in a 50,000 baht a month apartment (no idea as to the other perks.) Salaries vary tremendously in Thailand, and this very thread does a good job proving that, unless you are very clear on how you define your terms, you are not going to get a meaningful answer when you ask about "average wages." A few things, however, are clear, at least to me: 1. Education really matters. This is true even for the Mia Noi, whose English is excellent, although having sighted her once at the Emporium, I suspect that her strong English skills were only one of many qualifications considered. 2. The English teachers are doing a tremendous service to not only their students, but all of Thailand. English ability makes a difference in earning ability - see next two points. 3. Internationally oriented firms, particularly multi-nationals, pay substantially better for a variety of reasons. To work in any internationally oriented firm, but particularly a multinational, you generally need strong English skills. 4. If Thailand as a whole wants to raise the bar and compete internationally, it needs raise education standards. How can you compete effectively in an international economy without raising English standards? The country obviously should not make things more difficult for English teachers. Now on this last point, there was an interesting article a few days back where a well known Thai economists lamented the fact that the amount of money spent on education has declined substantially (I believe in percentage and absolute terms, but I cannot find the article now.) I have seen several articles reporting that in terms of education Thailand is falling futher behind. The economy is getting more global - and there isn't a damn thing that can be done to stop that - but less resources are devoted to education. Go figure. OK, back to private sector. Another big difference I have noticed between multinationals and local firms is that multinationals take in-house trainning and education much more seriously. The local firm where I worked thought it was a big joke while the multinationals actually not only allowed, but encouraged employees to take time for trainning, and - always the litmus test for whether a company is serious about anything - spent serious money on trainning programs. Big difference in attitudes. P.S. I am not an English teacher. [ October 09, 2001: Message edited by: Gadfly ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 10, 2001 Report Share Posted October 10, 2001 The only way I'd believe 20 baht/day is if the place provided food and lodging. They've just got to, for that rate. By the way, I think you can legally pay below minimum wage if food and board are provided. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
think_too_mut Posted October 10, 2001 Report Share Posted October 10, 2001 A BG I know went for work in a factory during the "slow" month of August. Honda, an asssembly line, 8hrs 5 days a week, plus 1 hour travel each direction. 240 Baht per day. Endured 6 weeks and then the labourer she was standing in for returned back from somewhere. [ January 08, 2002: Message edited by: Lazaro ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 10, 2001 Report Share Posted October 10, 2001 William Ginzer - Here are some factories that are my customers here in Thailand: Seagate Technology (Thailand) Ltd. 90 Moo 9, Tumbol Sungnoen Amphur Sungnoen Nakornratchasima 30170 Seagate Technology (Thailand) Ltd. 1627 Moo 7, Teparuk Road Teparuk Amphur Muang Samutprakan 10270 Read-Rite (Thailand) Co. Ltd. 140 Moo 2, Bangpa-in Industrial Estate Ayutthaya 13160 All of these factories bus girls in from about 100 km radius. The girls ride in deluxe air conditioned busses, with video entertainment playing. They get to work all day in a clean, air-conditioned environment. They get free low-level medical care via company on-site clinic. They get subsidized (but not free) meals at company canteen, with water and rice provided at no charge. Shifts are 12 hours, plus maybe 2-4 hours travel time. Alternative: stay home in hot village fending off stay-behind male population that is drunk by 10:00 am, earn no money breaking your back tending family rice plot. Most girls would probably take the Seagate job for free, just for the more pleasant surroundings. I had a gf who made her move to leave the bargirl life. She had licenses for both regular Thai and foot massage from Wat Po shool of massage, plus had graduated from training courses for both airline ticketing and import/export shipping administration. She had a couple years of college, and spoke and read/wrote excellent grammatically-correct English. Took a job at a travel agency on Sukhumvit Soi 5. 12 hours a day - 200 baht per day, six days per week. Broke my heart - she was really trying. As a bargirl, she had made 28,000 - 48,000 per month, depending on season. I know that she later shifted to work at an Internet shop, and recently told me that she starts a new job at Don Muang next week, working for TAGS at Terminal 2. Salary not disclosed to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 10, 2001 Report Share Posted October 10, 2001 Thank you for the post. Certainly does not sound like horrible sweatshop conditions to me. I also know that many multi-national factories provide clean and modern housing for their workers. quote: All of these factories bus girls in from about 100 km radius. The girls ride in deluxe air conditioned busses, with video entertainment playing. They get to work all day in a clean, air-conditioned environment. They get free low-level medical care via company on-site clinic. They get subsidized (but not free) meals at company canteen, with water and rice provided at no charge. Shifts are 12 hours, plus maybe 2-4 hours travel time. Alternative: stay home in hot village fending off stay-behind male population that is drunk by 10:00 am, earn no money breaking your back tending family rice plot. Most girls would probably take the Seagate job for free, just for the more pleasant surroundings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bembaman Posted October 11, 2001 Report Share Posted October 11, 2001 To clarify, cos the problem with the internet is it is difficult to know if people are genuinely responding or taking the piss: My B20/day story was actually made public at last year's Thai Canadian Chamber of Commerce AGM held at the Sheraton Hotel by the river. The chamber supports business development projects in the North in cooperation with other NGO's and they pointed out that many of the workers had switched jobs to one of their new supported projects from this factory(textiles if i remember correctly). it may be on their website-I haven't looked. My girlfriend by the way was only getting B10 about 8 or 9 years ago (food provided-plain rice with some soup). Yes, 8 years ago is a while ago now but it was still B26 to the $ or something even then. [ October 11, 2001: Message edited by: Bembaman ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long Gun Posted October 11, 2001 Report Share Posted October 11, 2001 quote: Originally posted by Gadfly: 4. If Thailand as a whole wants to raise the bar and compete internationally, it needs raise education standards. How can you compete effectively in an international economy without raising English standards? The country obviously should not make things more difficult for English teachers. Interesting post, Gadfly. but I think you are contradicting yourself here. The very reason that Thailand SHOULD make things more difficult for English teachers is that they DO need to raise standards and there are so many incompetent, unqualified 'teachers' here who are not helping anybody. Maybe I should rephrase that and say that Thailand should be making it more difficult for people to get jobs teaching English UNLESS they are an English Teacher. LG Not an English Teacher, but an English teacher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 11, 2001 Report Share Posted October 11, 2001 quote: The very reason that Thailand SHOULD make things more difficult for English teachers is that they DO need to raise standards and there are so many incompetent, unqualified 'teachers' here who are not helping anybody. I think not. Do you really think the Thai government, particularly the xenophobic government now in power, could and would impose rules that actually raise standards or help students? quote: "The government solution to a problem is usually as bad as the problem." -Milton Friedman Isn't it far more likely that any "standards" imposed by the current government would simply protect teachers of Thai nationality and restrict or even prohibit foreign teachers? Hasn't that been the policy of this government? Witness the legislation passed last night restricting foreign ownership in telecoms to 25% or less. Does that help Thai business and industry in the information age? Or does it only help certain vested interests at the expense of the country as a whole? Or consider the arrest by the Thai immigration police of certified, but foreign, dive masters and instructors about a year or so ago. The immigration authority argued those jobs should go to Thais even if they were not qualified to handle such work. If we are talking about objective and international standards for teaching English, fine, but we need to be realistic about what sort of standards are likely to imposed and to what purpose those standards are likely to be put. "That government is best which governs the least, because its people discipline themselves." -Thomas Jefferson Thailand could do with a little more market discipline. [ October 11, 2001: Message edited by: Gadfly ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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