Are higher price BG less likely to have STDs/AIDs?

[Guest]

As long as condoms break, education don't mean squat. Hundreds of punters each means they are still having unprotected sex on a very regular basis, even if insisting on a condom every time.

 

 

 

I think drug and alcohol use is the biggest factor. If a girl is prone to either, it will allow her to let her guard down. She can be talked into anything. Doesn't matter what her education level might be. And don't tell me educated girls don't drink, or use drugs. The best you can do is pick girls who are straight, and are adamant about condom use. Your still going to get a girl who has recently had unprotected sex, but your odds will be better that it happens a lot less with her.

 

 

 

HT

[Guest]

[color:blue]have you ever been hanging out at some of the blow job bars and looked at how few of the western customers used condoms? almost none.color=blue>

 

 

 

I don't find that your examples support your argument in the least. No one has argued that there aren't a significant number of farang who don't use condoms. No one has argued that there aren't plenty of bargirls who are reckless with their health, or completely ignorant of the various risks. Siam Sam's original point was that those girls in the farang sex industry were more likely to play safely than girls who served only or mostly Thai. If you went into a BJ bar that catered to Thais do you think you could even find a condom on the premises? I don't dispute your information, I just don't see the relevance (unless I missed something).

[Guest]

[color:blue]As long as condoms break, education don't mean squat. Hundreds of punters each means they are still having unprotected sex on a very regular basis, even if insisting on a condom every time.color=blue>

 

 

 

That is a ridiculous statement. Education will cut down on the number of times a girl has condomless sex and reduce the number of times that the condom breaks. Education is a key factor in reducing the risk.

 

 

 

[color:blue]I think drug and alcohol use is the biggest factor. If a girl is prone to either, it will allow her to let her guard down. She can be talked into anything. Doesn't matter what her education level might be. And don't tell me educated girls don't drink, or use drugs. The best you can do is pick girls who are straight, and are adamant about condom use. Your still going to get a girl who has recently had unprotected sex, but your odds will be better that it happens a lot less with her.color=blue>

 

 

 

You contradict yourself here. Education will cut down on the number of girls who abuse drugs and alcohol, it will also give them more confidence and the ability to resist those who would coerce them into doing something risky. Certainly even educated girls are not perfect, but they have a better chance.

[Guest]

>>>Education will cut down on the number of times a girl has condomless sex and reduce the number of times that the condom breaks. Education is a key factor in reducing the risk.<<<

 

 

 

Education will reduce the number of times a condom breaks??? Huh?....Interesting theory. Condom breakage rate directly related to b/g's I.Q. That's a new one.

 

 

 

>>>You contradict yourself here. Education will cut down on the number of girls who abuse drugs and alcohol, it will also give them more confidence and the ability to resist those who would coerce them into doing something risky.<<<

 

 

 

Where did I contradict myself? I stated a girl on drugs is higher risk, regardless of education, and that educated b/g's do drink and also do drugs. My point was that a college graduate prostitute on B-52's and yaba is a higher risk than a straight girl adamant about condom use. I still say that.

 

 

 

You think all these girls are not educated as to what HIV is? Or they don't know the dangerous effects of drugs and alcohol, after seeing it for years while growing up in their village? I think you put too much weight on a supposed lack of education that exists there. 15 years ago, OK.... I'd buy the fact that some did not know what was going on. These girls elect to become prostitutes for many varied and different reasons. Complete stupidity is not high on the list. They know how they can get HIV, and that they will die if they get it.

 

 

 

One last thought. I pulled this from search on statistics:

 

 

 

>>>Drug Abuse Resistance Education (D.A.R.E.) reaches over 70% of elementary school children in the United States, making it far and away the most prevalent drug education program in use today.17 Long term studies have found little or no difference in drug use between D.A.R.E. graduates and non graduates.18<<<

 

 

 

The war on drugs in US? A complete joke. It's sad, but education does very little to combat drug and alcohol abuse. Hereditary factors, early environment, social factors....they all play a much more important role in determining risk factors.

 

 

 

HT

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest]

[color:blue]Education will reduce the number of times a condom breaks??? Huh?....Interesting theory. Condom breakage rate directly related to b/g's I.Q. That's a new one.color=blue>

 

 

 

"Education" in this case is ambiguous, but it certainly does not have anything to do with I.Q. In Keith's original message he probably meant general schooling, but I took your response to be both that and specific education about STDs (and drugs).

 

 

 

For the former, certainly basic schooling, such as reading, writing, logic, math, etc. will help any person to learn and understand the risks of STDs/drugs. If the person is unable to read and comprehend the directions on a condom box then they are ill-suited to meet life's challenges.

 

 

 

For the latter, sex education and drug/alcohol abuse education is extremely valuable. Learning how to apply a condom and the proper use of lubricants is critical to reducing the incidence of breakage.

 

 

 

Both types of education will give the girl more confidence and the ability to withstand the pressure from some asshole who tries to convince her that a condom is not necessary.

 

 

 

[color:blue]Where did I contradict myself? I stated a girl on drugs is higher risk, regardless of education, and that educated b/g's do drink and also do drugs. color=blue>

 

 

 

I retract that. Given your further explanation your statements were completely consistent.

 

 

 

[color:blue]You think all these girls are not educated as to what HIV is? Or they don't know the dangerous effects of drugs and alcohol, after seeing it for years while growing up in their village? I think you put too much weight on a supposed lack of education that exists there. 15 years ago, OK.... I'd buy the fact that some did not know what was going on. These girls elect to become prostitutes for many varied and different reasons. Complete stupidity is not high on the list. They know how they can get HIV, and that they will die if they get it.color=blue>

 

 

 

Every piece of evidence I have seen and almost every report on this board indicates that most BGs are pretty clueless about how HIV is transmitted and the various risk factors. Are they aware and are they scared? Yes, but they don't understand it and they don't take reasonable precautions (e.g. the number who don't know how to properly apply a condom and the importance of lubrication is absurd). Perhaps some engage in risky behavior (e.g. condomless sex) because they have coolly calculated the odds vs. the extra baht, but I somehow doubt that.

 

 

[Guest]

[color:blue]One last thought. I pulled this from search on statistics:

 

 

 

>>>Drug Abuse Resistance Education (D.A.R.E.) reaches over 70% of elementary school children in the United States, making it far and away the most prevalent drug education program in use today.17 Long term studies have found little or no difference in drug use between D.A.R.E. graduates and non graduates.18<<<

 

 

 

The war on drugs in US? A complete joke. It's sad, but education does very little to combat drug and alcohol abuse. Hereditary factors, early environment, social factors....they all play a much more important role in determining risk factors. color=blue>

 

 

 

I'm not sure where you got this info and I'm not an expert on the topic, but I don't see how this illustrates the point that STD and drug abuse education is not helpful. This is just a condemnation of one particular program and the people who run it. Glancing at drcnet.org (which may be where you got you info) I could find nothing that states that drug education programs are a waste of time or money. All it says is that D.A.R.E. is flawed, and more particularly a waste since that money could be used for other more effective drug education programs.

 

 

 

It seems the inefficacy of D.A.R.E. quoted on drcnet.org is in large part due to the program completely distorting and exaggerating alcohol and drug use to the point of making it unrealistic and therefore useless (think modern "reefer madness"). This is the same complaint I made about artiew's exaggerating (IMO) the danger of HIV.

[Guest]

Hi FarangDang, (what is a Dang, anyway?)

 

 

 

>>>Every piece of evidence I have seen and almost every report on this board indicates that most BGs are pretty clueless about how HIV is transmitted and the various risk factors. Are they aware and are they scared? Yes, but they don't understand it and they don't take reasonable precautions (e.g. the number who don't know how to properly apply a condom and the importance of lubrication is absurd).<<<

 

 

 

I guess both our points surround the factual reality of your above statement. I would be shocked to know that this was true as a general fact. Why? Because the realities of STD's/HIV is a pretty short course. "Man has bad bug inside. Wear condom, you no die. Not wear condom, you die". Of course, this is an oversimplification, but you get my point. 5 minutes is all it takes to get a clear view of this subject. Pretty simple concept, even for a complete moron. No way have any of these girls grown up in villages that were HIV free. I think you'd be hard pressed to find one that didn't witness someone they were at least acquainted with, succumb to the virus, at some point in their lives. Then there is the press, TV, mamasan's training, B/G's sitting around the proverbial 'water cooler', etc. Not to mention "where do B/G's infected with HIV go? Back home, of course". I used to think that this made HIV kind of invisible to working girls in BKK and Pattaya, but then, I realized they must have seen much of this growing up in their village.

 

 

 

My own experience shows that all the girls I've been with have asked for a condom, if I didn't pop one out first.

 

 

 

But FarangDang.... I readily accept that I could be very, very wrong here, and that you have a much better understanding of the situation. I know that you live in US, also. Maybe an expat with some first hand experience could share some knowledge. If such extreme ignorance really does exist, on a wide scale, then I will have to re-think my view. I hope that's not the case.

 

 

 

PS. Never had a problem with B/G applying condom correctly. I'm always right there, 9 times out of 10, in case is done incorrectly.

 

 

 

HT

 

 

 

 

[Guest]

my point is that AIDS awareness programs in thailand made it possible new infections during commercial sex went down a lot. those are the facts, supported by the latest statistics.

 

if you would know the thai prostitution scene you would find out that firstly thai males are a lot more careful and responsible than they were a few years ago. the thai oriented prostitution is generally in a more controlled environment happening where obligatory condomusage is easier to force on customers.

 

these statistics were done in mainly thai oriented prostitution areas, and they say that condom usage in commercial sex is very high, new infections during commercial sex went down. what is there not to understand?

 

my point is also that i have found the opposite true, that nowadays i would say the less responsible behavior is in farang oriented prostitution. i have said that most sexpats i know are rarely using condoms, often have had hundreds of unprotected encounteres.

 

what is there not to understand?

 

those are facts, not wishful thinking.

 

the statistics say that nowadays most new infection in thailand are in non commercial sex, as the responsible behavior only goes as far as commercial sex is concerned. both customers and prostitutes are also engaging in non commercial sex, which means that they can still be infected, but due to high condomusage in commercial sex don't transmit the virus during those commercial encounters.

 

what is there so difficult to understand?

 

but then, ignorance is bliss, and i am getting tired of arguing.

[Guest]

i am writing that post from my computer in bangkok, so you could maybe consider me an expat first hand experience.

[Guest]

>>>i have to chuckle a bit when i read someone telling me about how well educated (about AIDS) women in the farang oriented prostitution scene are. they maybe are, but being educated and follow it up are two different things.<<<

 

 

 

This was my original point. The majority of Thailand prositutes are aware of HIV, regardless of education. OK, I can see a few wayward farm girls maybe being totaly clueless, but as a generalization, how can you be that ignorant? The subject is in your face the world over, with Thailand and Africa being cited frequently as high incidence countries.

 

 

 

But, back to what you are posting. Are you saying that you are witnessing a downward trend, as in a previous high awareness, but lately seeing a reversal? Plenty more farangs going bare-back also translates to B/G's accepting this desire. Do you think because HIV has been taking a recent 'back-seat' in terms of escalation, and that a more relaxed attidude has developed because of it?

 

 

 

I really don't know, but would seriously like to have a good grasp of what the actual situation is.

 

 

 

HT