Thaispeak

[Guest]

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Why is it that Thais feel embarrassed to discuss future plans? I?ve never been able to work it out.

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I reckon it's Khreng Jai...

Over the years I have observed that, often you can make a plan to meet a Thai at a certain time and at a certain restaurant, for example, and have them not turn up. Usually this is because some one else has arranged a conflicting appointment with them and because of Khreng Jai, they don't want to say no to either party.

Perhaps the inability to plan for the future is insurance against causing offence by committing to something that might not occur.

IMHO

[Guest]

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Originally posted by Zane May:

Art and Museums: IMHO the Thais are obviously not up to speed. Almost all art revolves around the religion. Just like western art in the beginning. Once I've seen 10 beautiful roofs or 10 wonderful Buddhas, I've had about as much as I need for awhile. But dead white guys in the Louvre or the British Portrait Museum - I can look at them for days! The Thais love them temples and Buddhas but hate looking at dead white guys. Makes sense to me.

Plays and literature: Mostly old traditional stuff retold and retold. Not so interesting to the westerner. But the soap opera has reared its ugly head high! Not so interesting to this Westerner.

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I can also look at old temples and Wats for days, provided I have the right background information in the form of a good guide or guidebook, preferably the former.

Just as some western art can accurately be described as “pictures of old dead white guys”, the ruins at Sukhothai can also accurately be called a bunch of old rocks. When looking at pictures of old dead white guys, old roman ruins, old wats or even just taking in a stroll around old Luang Prabang, what makes the difference is what you bring to it. The difference goes beyond simple familiarity with local history and culture; it involves differing capacities for appreciation of history, art and culture, and that capacity seems to be at least partially determined by our upbringing.

I have also noticed that I use and understand the English word “culture” very differently than my Thai friends. Two of my Thai friends told that they were surprised to learn after spending time in America that it had “culture”, but I could never quite understand what they meant when they used this term. (I have had similar conversations with Europeans, but there was usually a sneer involved, and I knew immediately what they meant.) My conversations with Thai friends typically went something like this:

RR: By “culture”, do you mean art?

TF: No.

RR: Do you mean poetry and literature?

TF: No.

RR: Do you mean philosophy or western thought?

TF: Definitely not!

RR: Well, do you mean large animated cartoon characters like me?

TF: Yes, that’s it!!

OK, I am embellishing a bit on the first part of this dialogue. But there is a divide, and I still can’t quite put my finger on it.

Incidentally, two quick tips while we are on the subject. You can now rent audio CD guides at the Grand Palace; not everyone's preference, but much better than 99% of the guides I have encountered in Thailand. Second, if you want a quality guided tour of old Siam, join a Siam Society trip. But leave the BG behind.

[ July 04, 2001: Message edited by: RogerRabbit ]

[Guest]

Bangkok Phil,

I've only been here a year and I have been asked about my salary on a few occasions and what am I doing at the weekend etc.

As someone else pointed out, I think this is a big city v upcountry kind of thing. I remember one particular occasion when I was in a pub in London waiting for a friend. To pass the time I tried to strike up a conversation with the guy next to me at the bar. He looked at me like I was a Martian and moved away.

I have never been asked my religion here - I think this is because they automatically assume that as a farang you are a christian. When I have let it be known that I am an atheist, they are shocked - not just because they're surprised, but because they think that it's a very bad thing not to have a religion.

RogerRabbit,

I could be wrong - it has been known - but I think that by 'culture' they just mean 'way of life' or 'way of doing things'.

[Guest]

Before our first trip to LOS, my wife and read a few books and were prepared for a bunch of 'personal' questions. Sure enough, in our hotel we were constantly asked "you have baby?". Well, we don't have any, and don't want, but the books all suggested this would confuse Thais, so the good answer was "no, but we are hopeful".

This worked fine on our first trip, but when we went back the next year, (still no kids) and gave the same reply ... I got some funny looks, think they were wondering about my plumbing.

Luckily, most of my Thai friends have just stopped asking

[Guest]

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Originally posted by del_boy:

Bangkok Phil,

RogerRabbit,

I could be wrong - it has been known - but I think that by 'culture' they just mean 'way of life' or 'way of doing things'.

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That is an interesting possibility, and it does make some sense. It certainly makes more sense than the possibilities that occurred to me.

Now that does mean that Thais who have never ventured out of Thailand think that Farangs don't have a way of doing things or way of life? Sounds absurd when phrased this way, but possible in a place where country girls from Issan are surprised to learn that there is also a moon in the sky over Los Angeles or that the earth is not really flat (I recall seeing those amusing anecedonts posted here before.) I think you may be right.

[Guest]

Another aspect of Thai language and conversation culture which intrigues me is the 'indirect answer'

Thais are the masters at it.

I was in a restaurant a few days ago and fancied a small beer. Alas the restaurant only had large beers (which is too much for me at lunchtime) I know the owner to say hello to and so called her over.

"why don't you sell small beers" I said

"A large beer is only 55 baht" she answered, and walked away.

My question didn't get answered, and she got herself out of the face-losing situation of having to explain why they don't stock small beers. Now, that's brilliant!

There are countless other examples I could give but none come to mind right now.

If I remember correctly, this whole aspect of the Thais and their use of indirect answers is very well explained in the excellent book 'Working With the Thais'

[ July 06, 2001: Message edited by: Bangkok Phil ]

[Guest]

I was only asked about my salary after I asked the girls. Which is fair. As luck would have it (I didn't want to make them feel uncomfortable), someone said something and the conversation went elsewhere.

Yes, I agree. Thai's dislike speaking english.

They are afraid of making mistakes. Tell them that grammar is not important and that it will come to them naturally, if they do speak. I have got students speaking this way and best of all, correcting their own grammar. Thai's are generally very intelligent people.

[ September 12, 2001: Message edited by: mushroom ]

[BkkShaggy]

mushroom:

>They are afraid of making mistakes. Tell them that grammar is not important and that it will come to them naturally, if they do speak. I have got students speaking this way and best of all, correcting their own grammar. Thai's are generally very intelligent people.

Many of my Thai friends speak English fluently and they make a lot of mistakes but don't seem to care!! Just getting the message across is all they care about. Where as an Aussie friend of mine embarrases to speak Thai eventhough he can read and write Thai!! What a shame !!