trotsky2 Posted April 1, 2003 Report Share Posted April 1, 2003 I have almost finished the book Siam Mapped by Thongchai Wittachul (sp?). The book is a critique of the way Thai history has been written by both Thais and foreigners. For me, the book provides a different formula for conceptualizing the "Thai" history. Further, it has raised many more questions which should be investigated. As a possible future thread, what about the fiction stuff on Thailand? Isn't it all a load of garbage? I have not read any of the fiction works (a class I indictment about what I am about to propose) on Thailand with the exception of one book about a drug bust, jail break, something with the CIA, and concluded with an assassination. I admit I was entertained for the few days I read it. However, I wonder if these books make "better falangs" out us. My speculation is that "academic" reads would make foreigners more "knowledgeable" about Thailand and that the fiction books only do the reverse. Not that these aims of being a "good falang" or an "educated" one should be our goal. That is up to you of course. People have their own purpose for reading. I just get the general impression that the fiction tales about Thailand are the most popular type of read for foreigners. Perhaps a mix of both types would be good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markle Posted April 1, 2003 Report Share Posted April 1, 2003 While I tend to agree, you are talking about falangs writing books set in Thailand. In fact most of these books could be set anywhere, aside from a couple superficial observations and the place names. Given the mindset of the majority of the falangs residing in the Kingdom you can hardly blame authors and publishers for releasing the kind of purile garbage that passes for literature set in Thailand. I mean we are talking about a place that still hold a hack like Bernard Trink up as a legitimate voice of the expat community. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khun_Kong Posted April 1, 2003 Report Share Posted April 1, 2003 Stephen Leather may write books, but he's a loooong way from writing literature, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeng bireley Posted April 2, 2003 Report Share Posted April 2, 2003 What about "Inside Thai Society" by Niels Mulder One of my favourite books or " Reflections on Thai Culture" by william Klausner bit dated but still very relevant or " Thailand: a short history " by David Wyatt Ive read, or tried to read, some of the fiction books you mention, mostly rubbish, The only thing that saves them is the familiarity of the setting. How about some of the thai novels that have been translated into english? Like " Four Reigns" by Kukrit Pramote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markle Posted April 3, 2003 Report Share Posted April 3, 2003 Says daeng bireley: What about "Inside Thai Society" by Niels Mulder One of my favourite books or " Reflections on Thai Culture" by william Klausner bit dated but still very relevant or " Thailand: a short history " by David Wyatt I think he was talking about fiction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldAsiaHand Posted April 4, 2003 Report Share Posted April 4, 2003 Threads like this seem to start up every few months, all of them more or less the same, and I have to say that the sort of comments they draw have always stuck me as a tiny bit odd. A remarkable number of people seem to develop what you can only describe as a personal and highly emotional relationship with Bangkok as a city, and to a lesser degree, with Thailand as a whole. In my observation, this relationship all too frequently leads them to become self-appointed guardians of 'the truth' as to what the 'real' Bangkok really is and what kind of books about it are therefore worthwhile. As a result, there is never any shortage of people insisting that this novelist or that who writes about their beloved city fails to protray accurately the true reality of this place, although I have to admit that it's pretty original to condemn all such novelists as a group as 'crap' and 'a load of garbage' since they only 'entertain' and fail to 'make better falangs' of us all. Wow. That raises the whole concept of narrowmindedness and snobbery to new levels, huh? I have always wondered if somewhere out there in Net Land there are other threads in which other posters are castigating Michael Connelly for not writing about the 'real LA' or Michael Dibdin for not understanding the 'real Italy.' You don't suppose that now people might also be demanding that Connelly write for the purpose of creating better Americans or Dibdin to create better Italians, do you? Nah, I didn't think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 4, 2003 Report Share Posted April 4, 2003 at least 'real' crime novelists do actually investigate the environments they write about, but here in gagaland, the land where everybody thinks he can reinvent himself as something he isn't, people do seem to get away with that sort of stuff they wouldn't anywhere else. but the main problem is with the audience they are writing for. funny how many experts on thailand and bangkok do actually have not the slightest clue of the language of the place they are writing about, and the main readership doesn't as well. an inbred club of a mutual appreciation society. nah, that is not the environment good fiction can come out. personally, i think that of the expat writers david young does show promise, and i do enjoy some of chris moore's novels. i do take in consideration that he has some problems with literary style, but at least he does go around and does research the sceneries he writes about. not many people do unfortunately. that has nothing to do with snobbery, there is no 'universal' truth, just many angles and viewpoints. but i as a reader do expect at least that the view presented to me is well researched, and not full of factual mistakes which could have easily been avoided by proper research. i am still waiting for world class literature coming out of that country here (be it written by an expat or by a thai writer). everyday life here has so much drama, so many facets to write about, but so far i have not seen a novel making all the connections that a truly great book needs. as it is now, thailand is seen by the outside world as nothing else as the place middle aged westerners go and make their young girl holidays. sad. thailand is so much more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldAsiaHand Posted April 5, 2003 Report Share Posted April 5, 2003 That's my point exactly. I have repeatedly seen people on this board sneer at books about Bangkok as being filled with 'mistakes' that weren't mistakes at all, just a difference in the author's perception of something and their own. No one I know sneers at Mike Connelly if he says something about LA that they didn't know (or think) was true. They instinctively accept that he writes about the world that he moves through and observes, one that is more complex and layered than any single person can really get his arms around and one that different people 'know' different things about. God save us from the self-appointed experts whose mission in life is to correct everyone else's 'mistakes.' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trotsky2 Posted April 5, 2003 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2003 Oops sorry there. I should have prefaced my original post by letting you know that I am the official expert on all Thai related matters. It is only me who holds the "real truth" about Thailand. You may think you "know" but you will always be a clueless falang. You could spend seven lifetimes in Thailand but would never attain the knowledge and understanding of the Thai people that I have. At least this is what my tee-rak, who I met at Nana Disco at three in the morning, tells me. Her words only confirm what I previously thought about myself. She even told me I was "chatma". I couldn't believe it! For you novices out there, "chatma" means a falang who can pass as a Thai because he/she knows where Sukhumwit Road is and knows that somtam is a spicy papaya salad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidel Posted April 5, 2003 Report Share Posted April 5, 2003 I've tried reading 'Spirit House', 'The Big Mango' and a few others and I just don't like the literary style. I really get the impression that many of the guys who write about Bangkok are doing so as an excuse to stay there. I have less interest in reading novels about Farangs living in Thailand than I would have in reading genuine Thai literature written from a Thai perspective. I feel that many of the Farang writers who specialise in writing about Thailand go to great lengths to display their "cultural knowledge" and to explain to their readers the quirks of Thai life. I find this boring and patronising. I enjoyed David Young's Thailand Joy.. a book that wasn't about a middle aged Farang going through a second puberty in BKK... or going on a crazy goose chace through Soi Cowboy's Bar Bias and go-gos looking for some stolen gold. Although I haven't read very many books set in or concerning Thailand my favourites are as follows: Non-fiction: The Slaughter House Fiction: Thailand Joy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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