Working without a work permit

[Khun_Kong]

Collateral said:

It's not that many pieces in the jig-saw, but I will try to make it clear.

- Have a one year Visa B.

<snip>

 

On what basis is the non-imm B issued?

 

If obtained by a showing a Thai employer's letter at a Thai embassy/consulate overseas, I believe it has to be "renewed/extended" at 3 months, showing the WP at that time. No WP, then visa expires in 7 days. With WP, can extend to the full year.

 

BTW, none of what I say may be correct. Just seems like the plan that I'm under.

[gummigut]

If you fly back to the US (and I daresay Europe as well) it's not that hard to get a 1-year Non-Imm B visa.

 

If you stay in the SE Asia region, it's much harder. Need all the documentation blah blah blah.

 

<<burp>>

[SUZIBANDIT]

If you're doing freelance work here in Thailand you need to be paying Thai tax on that (in the case of writers, many publications in Thailand do take tax out of your payment and request to see your tax ID card), and if you're making an income here and paying tax I would think you would need a work permit to justify things.

 

Better find a way to kiss and makeup with this guy, as you're definitely not 100 percent in the clear.

[iono]

Sorry this may be a little on the immature side and of no help, however it's time for you to go on the offensive. All it takes is a digital camera, a night on the town and some compromising positions with men and women . Then let him know that you are going to use your writing skills and see he gets the attention he deserves back in his home town . Although he could barley get a business going ::, he may even have a problem following through on his vail threats.

[Guest]

I agree with Suzi bandit. I would think of the tax issue as separate from the work permit issue.

 

On the tax issue, I think Suzibandit is right on your personal tax liability. Even though ABC has no office in Thailand, it may also have tax liability. (You also mentioned they went out of business, but I am not sure if you are referring to the local operation or the headquarters office outside of Thailand.) Your working for ABC, even freelance, may have a created a PE (permanent establishment) in Thailand, which means the Thai revenue authorities can tax ABC on the income they generated from your work. When dealing with companies outside of Thailand, the Revenue Department tends to put the tax payment burden on the local payer; in this case, that may mean you. I am not sure.

 

Having a work permit is a separate issue, and the Thai authorities define work very broadly. Even attending a business meeting or a seminar counts as work.

 

When we were working on restructuring matters, we required our outside consultants to get work permits and strongly suggested that any visiting ex-pats representing foreign creditors side get a temp work permit (15 days) even to just attend a meeting with the debtor's side. It was a pain in the ass, but necessary.

 

If you go back a few years to when Effective Planners was handling the TPI case, one of the senior Australian directors was convicted of a work permit violation simply because he signed a board resolution while he was in Thailand. That was the only evidence the Labout Department had of work in Thailand, and was enough to get a conviction.

 

Incidentally, this is why the Australians pushed so hard in their FTA negotiations with the the Thais for a special grace period on work permits when an Australian enters Thailand to attend a meeting, speak at a conference, inspect a piece of machinery, etc. It was based on some rather unpleasant experiences with the Thai Labour authorities

 

I think it will come down to whether there is any written evidence that you performed (wrote) in Thailand. If there is, you are vulnerable. If there isn't, I wouldn't admit to it if asked.

 

Finally, if this other guy is an ex-pat and he was working in Thailand, isn't he in the same boat as you? I wouldn't start trading threats (you'll both end up in immigration jail), but see if some calmer voice can intervene and mediate a sensible resolution.

[think_too_mut]

>Having a work permit is a separate issue, and the Thai authorities define work very broadly. Even attending a business meeting or a seminar counts as work.

 

In the immigration form that you fill in when entering Thailand it has check boxes for "attending a conference" or something like that.

Can't believe the attendees of that conference about AIDS (the plane I was on had about 200 doctors onboard) were considered as people coming to work in the Kingdom.

[Guest]

Gadfly.......... interesting comment re the temporary work permit (15 days). Could you elaborate on obtaining one of these.

[Guest]

I have met people in the past working without a WP, but yet they still had taxes deducted and paid to the government, filing a form every year. Or so they said. I always wondered how that could be, if true. I assume that Labour and Revenue don't coordinate? Seems the company's in question did not want any future added problems with tax evasion. These guys would have had WPs except the company's had reached their limit of allowed WPs.

[lembeh]

 

 

>I assume that Labour and Revenue don't coordinate?

 

To some extent they do. You certainly have to provide proof of tax payment to get your work permit renewed (and this is a major issue at the moment, as the "minimum salary" rules are just comming in - theoretically in, but I am not sure how rigorously they are applied at the moment). I am not sure what the deal is the other way round though, at what point (if any) the tax office looks for a work permit - maybe not at all, although, the way they are closing loop holes at the moment, it would not surprise me if that was one of the "checking" steps soon...

-j-

[Guest]

Can't believe the attendees of that conference about AIDS (the plane I was on had about 200 doctors onboard) were considered as people coming to work in the Kingdom.

They are, but that is the beauty of these sorts of rules: they allow selective enforcement. You have deliberately vague rules that virtually everyone breaks in practice and few are even aware of. When a Farang starts creating problems or gets into a dispute with a vested interest, you enforce the rule.

 

If the Farang complains, your response is easy: it's the law, you are a visitor here, and it is perfectly reasonable for us to require that you comply with our laws. We heard the same sort of nonsense when the "rule" about always carrying your original passports was enforced (or devised) during the CM2 raid.

 

That is the way it works here, and that is why foreignors and their embassies should rely on common sense and cry foul when it happens here. Don't get sucked in by the local BS.