My Dilemma

[Guest]

Guys,

Thanks for the great responses. I suppose that I should clarify something. There will be stages with this woman. It won't be a case of me going on the airplane with her and we move in together and live happily ever after. I am impetuous, but not that impetuous. It is more like I will visit her and if things continue as they are now then I will make the "big move", but this is over a bit of time. And she will eventually come back to Thailand when she finishes her studies. The university is sending her away to get an advanced degree and she has to come back and work again.

WYD made a great point. I would be going to a Western country which isn't my own. I am not really enthusiastic about the place. I have been there before. Yet, this country would provide for me some things that I have been longing for in Thailand and a short move there would actually be quite nice. I am sure it would be tolerable.

I have had more time to consider what I wrote about the bar scene. My feelings of being jaded really have nothing to do with the girls. I have actually met some outstanding women that unfortunately have chosen working in a bar as an occupation. The irony is that these girls are also sucked into the scene and their lives in a way are not that much different than the guy who frequents the bars. I empathize with them. I am sure that they are just as sick as being seen as a business transaction and a sex object as the man who rents them out and uses them for sex. I think this is what makes everybody so fucked in the head. Also, this is the same thing that gets guys coming to Thailand for the women. An illusion is created where it seems that it is more than sex for money because of the nature of the girls, yet when the nature of the girls sucks you in one has to step back and ask, "Do they really like me or is it an illusion and it really is just a business transaction?" Perhaps both. I feel appealed to Thai women because they do act like human beings in contrast to Western women. For me, I suppose, the bars and the culture that surrounds it has become a way of life rather than just a venue of entertainment. And I don't even consider myself hardcore, but I know I am easily recognized at all the bar girl establishments. Part of the impetus of writing this post has to do with an encounter I just had while I was out on a "normal" date. While I was out with a normal girl, a bar girl came and spoke with me. I never had sex with this particular bar girl, but my date knew she was a prostitute. It was pretty obvious. And it was embarrassing as hell. I have known this bar girl for a long time and I told her the girl I was with was a normal girl. This conversation was in Thai, so it is difficult to explain the vocabulary which was used to get across to the bar girl concerning my situation. Anyway, I said something along the lines of, "Please don't make a problem for me. This girl is a normal girl, not a bar girl." I said it in a polite way. Well, the bar girl got angry with me and said, "Chan pen arai?(What am I?) Chan pen pooying boorigan mai?" (Am I service girl? Polite way of saying prostitute) I wanted to say you are a fucking whore and you look like a whore and you are making me lose face in front of my date. But I said, "Chai, khun pen pooying boorigan." And I gave her this look like it was fucking obvious and what were you trying to deny. Well, she lost the plot and even tried denying that she was a whore, which I found hilarious. She has three kids from three different guys. I tried to calm her down and eventually she walked away in a huff. Thank the Buddha I had this conversation away from my date, but, of course, the damage was done. So even when you want to escape the scene, it is difficult, and my anecdote also demonstrates, if you didn't get it, how both the bar girls and the farangs who frequent the scene are also victims of it. And this is one of the reasons why I am jaded.

Sinsin: Sorry that I misinterpreted your post.

Late,

Raddemo

[pattaya127]

I wonder, have you ever asked yourself what you want from life? I just believe the solution lies in your answer. While admitting the sex life is fun, ego-reassuring, and addictive, i think the great happiness of life is to answer any strong callings and "follow your bliss". Be it love or any other passion. You may find it worthwhile to put down on paper (so to speak) what you have achieved in your life these last few months/years, and answer sincerely if that fulfills you, if that is what you can expect from it. Some guys may be shallow or wretched enough that all they want is sex with different girls until they drop, uninterested as to how anonymous they have become, though stroking their ego night after night, and believe this is all the worth they can get from existence. Most likely, many will get out of it, and can recognize when it's time to move on. maybe try to look at yourself with a HE (bird's eye view) instead of a I, and see the whole picture of what this is this HE is doing right now,right here in BKK, and would this HE could really be you. somehow, i think it is not just about this woman, but also about your life you may be asking yourself about. Apologies for the psycho-babble, maybe it made sense.

[Steve]

Thanks, Pattaya127, there is something for all of us to think about. Its interesting, we think the bar life changes the bar girls but what about us? Has it or will it change us eventually?

I may be a bit close to the butterfly sanuker you described although I do try to treat everyone I meet with a certain amount of respect and dignity.

My trips to LOS have changed me in how I approach relationships in the States. I put up with less BS than I did before and I more straight forward and have an indifferent, meloncoly look from what I've told. Which strangely enough the women are finding more attractive. I guess when you seem like you don't want them....that's when they want you!

[Guest]

Life's too short, man. Go for it. What have you got to lose? You said you already lead a "gypsy life", so the move isn't a problem.

To quote: "Tis better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all".

It will always nag at you if you don't. The other sanuk will always be there...she won't. Never give yourself the opportunity to say "What if..."

Just my two cents.

[BkkShaggy]

Raddemo:

Like zwoel69 said "Life's too short, man." Go for it! You've found a great girl that many people on this board would love to have found one. You've got many great advice already from other posters. Going to visit her often is a good idea. And then see how it goes.

I don't think she would get upset learning your past as long as you're single or not in a relationship. But don't butterfly once you're in the relationship with her. You don't know how a nice Thai girl could become when she gets mad. There are too many cases in Thailand that penises have been cut off if the owners are unfaithful.