BadaBing Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 gummigut said:Things like the tech bubble took years to correct. <<burp>> I find that term " to correct " being the same one used during the May-06 free-fall of the markets here in the U.S. , " They were just correcting themselves " ( and killing me :: ) Bada Bing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJsushi Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 Old Hippie said: So, say we owed Saudi $1Million, which we maybe don't have, or don't want to pay and Peru owed us $500K, which we knew we were never going to get. Why not send the Saudis a check for $500K, and tell them "Peru will pay you the other $500K...?" I mean what is the difference after a certain point...? Of course I know nothing about economics, just being cynical. But somewhere in there is a valid point, I think... Politics and counterparty risk but mostly politics. Plus the defaulting payee cannot dictate to the owner of the debt how he should collect it. I mean dude we are talking about contracts here. Would u tell the landlord or the bank to collect payment from your best friend who owes u money? LOL! how about your bookie? Ya think he wants to hear "I over paid my AMEX bill last month so give them a call and have them send u the credit!" LOL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Hippie Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 jjsushi said: Old Hippie said:Well, that is sort of my point, people who actually do know about money and economics seem to often differ on who/what is responsible for a given trend or situation...and there is almost always a political bend to a given theory, or at the very least, somehow politics will influence it. To me if you owe money, or have money owed to you, you pay it, or get paid, but that never really seems to be the case on the world scale...it seems everyone uses the debt they owe or hold to manipulate and influence everything else, and it seems a vicious cycle that ends up biting them in the ass in the end... To put a Thai twist to it, it all seems like loaning a Thai girl money, the chances of getting it back are slim, but it still has an influence on your and her financial situation...one gets helped, one gets hurt. LOL!! You bring to mind a song my pops used to play when I was a kid. OJays - For The Love Of Money Money money money money, money Some people got to have it Some people really need it Listen to me y'all, do things, do things, do bad things with it You wanna do things, do things, do things, good things with it Talk about cash money, money Talk about cash money- dollar bills, yall For the love of money People will steal from their mother For the love of money People will rob their own brother For the love of money People can't even walk the street Because they never know who in the world they're gonna beat For that lean, mean, mean green Almighty dollar, money For the love of money People will lie, Lord, they will cheat For the love of money People don't care who they hurt or beat For the love of money A woman will sell her precious body For a small piece of paper it carries a lot of weight Call it lean, mean, mean green Almighty dollar I know money is the root of all evil Do funny things to some people Give me a nickel, brother can you spare a dime Money can drive some people out of their minds Got to have it, I really need it How many things have I heard you say Some people really need it How many things have I heard you say Got to have it, I really need it How many things have I heard you say Lay down, lay down, a woman will lay down For the love of money All for the love of money Don't let, don't let, don't let money rule you For the love of money Money can change people sometimes Don't let, don't let, don't let money fool you Money can fool people sometimes People! Don't let money, dont let money change you, it will keep on changing, changing up your mind. Your Dad sang with the O'jays? wow, maybe you do have some soul in you... :dunno: :bow: :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Hippie Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 "...They are related. So is a company's stock price and it's performance...." Unless you are United airlines and your labor contracts are up for renegotiation...or ENRON... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJsushi Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 gummigut said: drogon said:(who said that economy and the currency rates are related? They are related. So is a company's stock price and it's performance. Problem is that people want to make money off the short term movements. Those aren't predictable. Fundamentals are called fundamentals because sooner or later the market/company/what have you, will get back to it. Things like the tech bubble took years to correct. <<burp>> isn't that what financial guys "call revert to the mean"? Sort of like a guy pulling a chick out of the bar to sponsor/marry after a 1 month holiday and over time she heads back to the bar! LOL!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJsushi Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 Old Hippie said:"...They are related. So is a company's stock price and it's performance...." Unless you are United airlines and your labor contracts are up for renegotiation...or ENRON... Actually UAL's stk px was valued relative to it's performance. They lost money and filed for bankruptcy. During that time the market valued the stock price to pennies on the $; UA restructured, did and exchange offer before they emerged and went public again. Investors were never made whole but they did get something out of the deal. That is the risks u take when ur dealing with a risky business like airlines. The problem with employees is that they don't realize how undiversified they are nor do they look @ their employer as a potential investor would. Think about it u recieve ur primary income from an employer in the form of a wage;subsidized benfits such as healthcare, retirement plans and insurance. If u work in a high risk business u should be socking as much cash away as possible and invest away, in the event ur employer "defaults" on you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Hippie Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 jjsushi said: Old Hippie said:"...They are related. So is a company's stock price and it's performance...." Unless you are United airlines and your labor contracts are up for renegotiation...or ENRON... Actually UAL's stk px was valued relative to it's performance. They lost money and filed for bankruptcy. During that time the market valued the stock price to pennies on the $; UA restructured, did and exchange offer before they emerged and went public again. Investors were never made whole but they did get something out of the deal. That is the risks u take when ur dealing with a risky business like airlines. The problem with employees is that they don't realize how undiversified they are nor do they look @ their employer as a potential investor would. Think about it u recieve ur primary income from an employer in the form of a wage;subsidized benfits such as healthcare, retirement plans and insurance. If u work in a high risk business u should be socking as much cash away as possible and invest away, in the event ur employer "defaults" on you. You didn't mention ENRON!!! Actually, I was being sarcastic again, UAL stock was doing well when negotiations started, pre 9-11, (and prior to negotians in 93?) yet the company was complaining it had no money and the company was going to have to cut costs...blah blah, same stuff every time...they start losing money when it is time to negotiate. All businesses really... As for covering your own ass, I agree 100% I learned a long time ago not to rely on the airline bastards to honor their agreements and commitments...It is a must in any high risk field indeed. I remember seeing a lot of the guys I worked at Eastern with, who were my age, losing everything, when they went under...they had over spent, and didn't prepare for the future...in hind sight, I am sure many are rethinking that strike vote, as are many North West Mechanics...tough to find a $30/hr job in Deluth, especially when you WERE making $38, and spending like you were making $45... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gummigut Posted July 14, 2006 Report Share Posted July 14, 2006 jjsushi said: gummigut said:They are related. So is a company's stock price and it's performance...Fundamentals are called fundamentals because sooner or later the market/company/what have you, will get back to it. Things like the tech bubble took years to correct. isn't that what financial guys "call revert to the mean"? Sort of like a guy pulling a chick out of the bar to sponsor/marry after a 1 month holiday and over time she heads back to the bar! LOL!! Depending on who you talk to, you're right. But for astute investors like premier PE firms, they invest basically on fundamentals and market timing. Knowing the market and the players and really understanding the target company they invest their money knowing that the market will realize the fundamental value created or inherent in the company. They aren't doing it on hunches alone. These guys are pulling down high double digit returns and people pay up to be part of the action. Year after year. They aren't at the mean by any means. <<burp>> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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