Would your country embrace a former enemy ?

[USVirgin]

Steve: You've probably seen this, and it's a bit off-topic, but I'll post this interesting link for others regarding the war in Iraq, by GB1 regarding GF1. Odd that neither his son nor his son's boss, Cheney, heeded his words.

 

Why We Didn't Remove Saddam

[gobbledonk]

I seem to recall Norman Schwarzkopf saying that the US military commanders pushed very hard for the scope of the conflict to be made very clear from day one of Desert Storm. They were concerned that it could become another Vietnam if they tried to invade Iraq.

[cavanami]

The Vietnam war was a cluster f%ck!

 

I love the fact that some think tank in Washington, DC modeled the idea on their computers to see if the war could be won by bombing...NO! it could not.

What did Johnson do, at the urging of the US Air Force, try to win the war by bombing!!

 

The US Special Forces started out building schools and villages, winning the hearts and minds of the people...can't have that, as these are fighting men...this was stopped.

 

Some many bad decisions, plenty of blame to go around but the "Wall" in DC sadly says it all.

[shygye]

... but GF1 galvanized the Al Qaeda movement.

[gobbledonk]

As I said, hindsight is 20/20, but some of the decisions made by the US over the years seem very poor today, much of the BS perpetrated by the CIA.

 

- they fostered the rise of both Saddam and the Taliban. Bin Laden and others did their apprenticeships fighting the Russians in Afghanistan

 

- they have repeatedly made promises to various opposition figures that country X would be theirs, abandoning them at the key moment. If I was Kurdish, I would trust absolutely no-one:

 

http://revcom.us/a/1226/lvexcerpt.htm

 

- after bombing a province into submission, they seem at a loss as to what to do next. As previously mentioned, the 'hearts and minds' phase seems to be an afterthought in many parts of Washington.

 

I dont know how the US can secure Afghanistan from the Taliban without having troops on both sides of the Pakistan border, and that isnt going to happen. As I said in an earlier post, they bombed Laos with everything they had in the Vietnam war, but its a different story when the country has nukes and a border with China. Even the CIA dont want to open that can of worms.

 

Not sure what will happen with Iran, but its hard to see an exit strategy after the quagmires in Iraq and Afghanistan.

[Steve]

My guess as to some of America's actions internationally was that it was a matter of expediency. I don't think we thought long term as the Chinese are reputed to be. We don't have a sense of history at times.

 

We have not learned our lessons as well it seems. The so-called Powell doctrine of Colin Powell, born out of what he saw in Vietnam where he advises that the U.S. should only enter wars that have popular support, can be won quickly and decisively, no prolonged war and an exit strategy.

Iraq is anything but that and perhaps Afghanistan.

 

[Flashermac]

<< The US Special Forces started out building schools and villages, winning the hearts and minds of the people...can't have that, as these are fighting men...this was stopped. >>

 

 

The commies would enter remote villages, demanding free food and the village young people as unpaid bearers. Refuse and somebody got killed. (Tactics straight out of Mao.) The SF armed and trained the villagers to DEFEND THEMSELVES. This was succeeding ... until the politicians decided they knew bettter than the military and sent in the troops and the USAF. Instead, the villagers were forced to move from their homes and the area was left to the VC and NVA.

 

One of Schwarzie's main principles is that the military decides how to fight. Also, don't get into a war if you don't think you can win it and when you do GO AFTER THE ENEMY WHEREVER THEY ARE. Fight to win or don't fight at all. This was done in Iraq, but the idiots in Washington made no plans for what to do after Sodom was defeated. Rumsfeld said "it wasn't necessary".

 

 

p.s. Bravo ... here comes a thunderstorm. We need it.

 

 

[gobbledonk]

I dont know if we are getting the sanitised version, but it seems that there may be some hope in Iraq. Afghanistan ? I just cant see how the Afghan people can ever take back their country without ongoing, massive aid for decades. As long as the Taliban can train a continual stream of radicals in those hills, it will be like foxes around a henhouse IMO.

[Steve]

My fear and my guess is that Afghanistan is a lost cause long term. I don't see the U.S. people accepting a prolonged occupation and I don't see the Afghanis capable of or willing to do what needs to be done to stay Taliban free. Third, I don't see Pakistan being able to control the border area. They never have been able to and that area is significant to defeating the Taliban or at least reducing their strength.

[drogon]

There is a movie 'Diên Biên Phu' filmed by Pierre Schoendoerffer.

 

Rwanda -> US sitting doing nothing was Clinton's administration fault (certainly the US didn't want to send troops for something they persistently refused to be called 'genocide', after having lost some soldiers just one year before in Somalia) I know it well as my ass was there as well as my classmates (lost most of them by the way)

 

I disagree about the French Foreign Legion.

This is not an expendable unit at all, this is an elite unite (and consistently one of the best through French military History since its creation), whenever there is a crisis, France always sends its elite units, The Legion, the paratroopers (and marine paratroopers/RPIMA), why? Not only are they elite troops but also they are trained to operate under almost all conditions.

 

Also the Legion is not composed only of foreigners especially its elite officer corps -> which has always been mainly French and many of the soldiers and NCO were also French nationals from the start.

 

 

 

If you look at the recruitment stats then you will see that throught the French Foreign Legion's history the recruits are the products of history's events -> thus it is not suprising if before, during and after WW2 there is a big influx of German recruits, including former waffen SS.

During the Norway campaign there were many Germans in the 13ème DBLE, the ones who left Germany before the war, also after France surrendered, many 'now Germans' from Alsace and Lorrainne either fled or tried to hide, and entered the French Foreign Legion.

At Dien Bien Phu many Legionnaires were Germans.

 

Having met as a teenager in Rwanda, the Legion in operations and having been able to jaudge them against other French units and militaries part of UNAMIR -> they impressed me.

 

When, for a short time, I was part of the army, I have the privilege to operate with the Legion and they earned my respect.