Scuba Diving Thread - mini forum

[lembeh]

 

 

>It'll cost you a few beers extra.

 

LOL..sounds fair.

 

>Was that with Tim?

 

It was indeed. And I *think* we are talking about the same Tim. For some strange reason about 60% of the people I have dived with are called either Tim or Dave. Bizzare...

-j-

[Guest]

I have found too many of the DM's to be verfy rude in Phuket. I'm all to aware of the hero scuba master and all the good stuff but having enjoyed diving all over the world for 39 years now I really think that to call Thailand WORLD CLASS is a bit over the edge! Pattaya is junk....Phuket is OK but look how long the boat ride is for some short dives as many are deep. There is also a lack of dive sights and they are way over used! There are as many divers on a site as in Cozumel which has many more sites and better diving. There are only a few first class boats, based on International Standards and with the generally poorish service it makes the whole picture less that what it could be. I'm going to try a 1 day to the Similans next month to see if that is a good niche for some fun scuba. Overall picture, too many dive shops and not enough customers so corners a cut resulting in downgraded service. I always bring my gear but have to be in the right mind to go out for a day in Phuket.

For those of you readers whom are non professionals this is my spin. If you are a newbie diver don't let them push you into a deep dive that you don't want to go on! Professional readers, let me just tell you that the PADI Instructor Development Process was unveiled at the Course Director Update held in the Newport, CA. in Aug of 1984. As it stands now there is only one person working in Thailand that attended that program. How do I know all that????? And only one regular visitor to Phuket who attended that program also!

I would give Thailand a B rating,which is good, but not the top A rating like you get on the Mike Ball/ Aggessor level operations. The diving is very good and could be a better experience with better Dive Staff! They are arrogant and often lack experience. I'd say only about half of the dive guides I have gone out with would'nt last more than a day if I were there boss!

[limbo]

Hi you naughty Bibblemaker,

 

Thanks for the contribution.

 

A few points though, I do think that Thailand has some first class dive sites, especially in the Similans. Best way to experience them is on a live aboard.

 

Comparing everything with Mike Ball standards may give you some negative experiences possibly all over the world, not only in Thailand. How many times do you meet a service like that?

It's the same as some divers complain about the visibility since at dive site XXXX they had 40 meters. If that's your standard, a lot of your other dives are gonna be disapointing.

I know for a fact that on our custom build dive boat on Koh Samui, we do put an effort in to give good customer service, so come on over and join us for a day. To the dive site sare far away though, nearest would be Koh Tao. 1 hour and 20 minutes by speedboat.

 

On customer service, how about this story fromSF. I called a shop and asked about diving, they said I could come to the shop, rent some equipment and a tank, go to a certain beach and wait there for another diver to show up and ask him if I could be his buddy.

Any shitty dive boat in Thailand beats this IMHO.

 

Referring to your CD Update in 84, are/were you a CD? Interesting, I'ld like to know more about it, if you feel like elaborating, by all means do so.

However, what's your point, you make it sound like a bad thing that only one of these original fellows is still in Thailand. Come on, it's 20 years ago, how many CD's from that original Update in 84 you think are still around world wide? Does it make Thailand better or worst if none or 20 of those original fwllows would be here, or for that matter any where else in the world?

 

Anyway, I'm looking forward seeing some more input from you.

 

BTW, I totally agree on the fact that novice divers should refuse going on deep dives if they are not qualified or don't feel comfortable with this.

[Guest]

Let the Good Times Roll! Let me look at this piece by peice

 

Hi you naughty Bibblemaker, ***Who says I'm naughty

 

Thanks for the contribution.

 

A few points though, I do think that Thailand has some first class dive sites, especially in the Similans. Best way to experience them is on a live aboard.

***Agreed , First Class not World Class

Comparing everything with Mike Ball standards may give you some negative experiences possibly all over the world, not only in Thailand. How many times do you meet a service like that?

***I did mention more than Mile Ball but that would be the standard and I have had that in the "Seven Seas of the World"

IN all fairness the cost in Thailand don't reflect that level of service but none the less it is lacking.

 

It's the same as some divers complain about the visibility since at dive site XXXX they had 40 meters. If that's your standard, a lot of your other dives are gonna be disapointing.

I know for a fact that on our custom build dive boat on Koh Samui, we do put an effort in to give good customer service, so come on over and join us for a day. To the dive site sare far away though, nearest would be Koh Tao. 1 hour and 20 minutes by speedboat.On customer service, how about this story fromSF. I called a shop and asked about diving, they said I could come to the shop, rent some equipment and a tank, go to a certain beach and wait there for another diver to show up and ask him if I could be his buddy.

Any shitty dive boat in Thailand beats this IMHO.

****

I am not nor did I ever refer to San Francisco althoughI did

so lets jhust drop you little attempt to put me on the defensive as I haven't set foot in a dive shop in San Fran for more tht 10 years! With the exception to the PADI dive at Catalina for a very special group of memebers in 1993 I haven't made a dive in California for many years!

 

*** I would say my info speaks for itself, at the CD update in 1084 the presenters were the Training Manager at that time, John Stewart, the RTC's (Now) RM's and Jeff Mondale!

BTW the biggest changes in the IDC for the early years was to reduce the candidate writing and then computer use for class training too over and niow CD's should be editing their programs to fit the specific candidates needs. In the early days PADI was run by the late JC, who doubled as the USDivers Pres for s few years, Al Hornsby and Jeff Nadler

whpo are both with PADI today. Also there are a number of other longtimers still there with numbers like CD-32 etc.

 

Referring to your CD Update in 84, are/were you a CD? Interesting, I'ld like to know more about it, if you feel like elaborating, by all means do so.

***No thanks, I won't take you long to see I'm very real!

 

 

However, what's your point, you make it sound like a bad thing that only one of these original fellows is still in Thailand. Come on, it's 20 years ago, how many CD's from that original Update in 84 you think are still around world wide? Does it make Thailand better or worst if none or 20 of those original fwllows would be here, or for that matter any where else in the world?

*** You would be supprise how many of that group are millionares***from diving

Anyway, I'm looking forward seeing some more input from you.

 

My input will be based on your posts. As to evaluations good consultants with many many years experience usually fetch about 1000USD per day!

 

BTW, I totally agree on the fact that novice divers should refuse going on deep dives if they are not qualified or don't feel comfortable with this. ****Thats comforting

 

Since King, Shark, and Ano Reef are all deep let me tell you that I have had to organize lost and panic divers a few times whom fell into that problem due to poor Divemasters. IN addition to the long boat ride the engine smell on most day boats is make people, not I, very sick!

****I do think that Similans are OK, need more dive sites. Thailands greatest asset is their people and the Thai dive staff are very good. It is generally the German and French staff who are terrable and very poor dive guides.

You tell me more of what's good and I will give you my spin!

One that is based on 39 years of diving and many many awards from PADI and DAN--------------------

Yours in Safe Diving!

Scuba Slut

 

Cheers,

Limbo

 

Laissez le bon temps rouler!

 

 

Post Extras:

[lembeh]

 

No offence here mate, but, as some one who has only recently taken up diving (within the last year) I am not getting a lot here from you except "diving in Thaland is crap and dangerous" (to paraphrase slightly). Given that i am *in* Thailand, you, with your 40 years of experience may like to be a little more positive, and, just maybe, offer a little more constructive advice.

 

After all, given that I am (slowly) working my way through the PADI certification levels, some one who has "won awards from PADI" might like to take the time to support the organization and its newer members na?

 

>As to evaluations good consultants with many many years experience usually fetch about 1000USD per day!

 

If thats the way you see it, make sure you don't read and get info from any of the other threads on the board eh?

-j-

[Guest]

No offence here mate, but, as some one who has only recently taken up diving (within the last year) I am not getting a lot here from you except "diving in Thaland is crap and dangerous" (to paraphrase slightly).

*** Didn't say any of the above, I consider it 1 class diving, not world class of which I attribute it to both market develmonet and the diving resource.

Given that i am *in* Thailand, you, with your 40 years of experience may like to be a little more positive, and, just maybe, offer a little more constructive advice.

*** What info would you like of diving and I'll certainly be very constructive if you'd just givie me somthing to discuss.

 

After all, given that I am (slowly) working my way through the PADI certification levels, some one who has "won awards from PADI" might like to take the time to support the organization and its newer members na?

**** I think that PADI is certainly the best system of diver training and I'm sure that I have offered significant support of PADI.

 

>As to evaluations good consultants with many many years experience usually fetch about 1000USD per day!

*** Well, lets just say that I like to go out a have a day of diving with out putting on the critical eye but just haveing fun.

But clearly I'm not about to spend a week working with the staff of a dive shop for the reward of some free boat dives.

 

 

If thats the way you see it, make sure you don't read and get info from any of the other threads on the board eh?

-j-

Where abouts in Thailand are you getting your training? I would reccomend working with a PADI CDC but let me just say that a good insttructor is a good instructor no matter where the work. The advantage of a CDC or IDC is that you can have lot's of courses offered on a regular basis. If possible, try and intern with as many different instructors as possible, dive with different operations, and obeserve as many DSD's as you can. The most artful trainging professionals conduct is the dives with out certification and minimal training. Openwater Diver students have lots of pool dives prior to openwater.

 

I trust that opens up some info for you as your questions about my posts seem to have more of a perjorative tone as I hadn't really addressed your needs as part of my post. I suppose we could use this mini forum to discuss training.

Looking forward to chatting about diver training in general and specifically yours.

Good luck and I hope you have a lot's of fun and who knows you might be very successful (and rich)... To that question that I hve had many time over the years, " diving is a business and if you'll be successful will depend alot more on you abilities in business than your love of diving. As a poster mentioned he finally got tired of being poor, after 15 years......

[lembeh]

 

Thanks for your post and info, seemed more "positive" this time. Agree with the bit about different instructors, and I have learnt as much again about diving (not too much!) by seeing the differences between instructors as working with one instructor (if that makes sense!).

 

For me diving is, and always will be a hobby, not a career. I am currently rescue with one speciality and by choice and working toward "master scuba" rather than Divemaster (although purely for the *learning* I may change that later).

 

I will be off the boards for a while (couple of weeks) so will not be able to pick your brains till then, but will look forward to picking up the thread later

cheers

josh

[Guest]

Before you go....

Although MSD is a much different program than DM PADI does have a concept know as the spher of awarness where at the rescue level we begin to think about things other than self and at DM you think about others. Remember how much you learn when you are not thinking about just your own safety.

Both have a good value and are good paths. Make sure you Spec's incl, Night, Deep, Enax and believe it or not Nav. It covers more that just how to swim in a triangle....Most divers have the early problems diving without a guide because the are having so much fun the forget to monitor location changes. Remembering location really enhances the dive as you'll also get an orientation to underwater topography that you can reflect upon during other dives! Remember, topography supports the marine life..... See ya underwater!

[Guest]

Who staffed yourCDTC, I'm just wondering because they have down graded the staff over the years and I expect more since the passing of J.C. leaving the helm in the hands of non diving professiona; Even thought a few at PADI enjoyed imaculate ascentions and some who came in from the field did so without alot of real life work I'm please diving was good enough to me so that I'm no to be plagued with the above! Me....let's just day that my current professioal crediental required no getting wet???? Yeah it's true! In fact I made 1 academic teaching presentation required to make a 3.0 which was the old standard.......That's then end of talking about me....lets just talk about diving and diver training..

PADI/DAN stuff is really the major thingo so let's stay with that! How many OWSI, MSDT's MI's and CD's on the board..

You all can vote for my status.....but it ought to be very clear!

How is Bill up in Pattaya.....the only remaining DCD. Shite that paid ok!

[limbo]

SoiSlut said:

Let the Good Times Roll! Let me look at this piece by peice

 

Hi you naughty Bibblemaker, ***Who says I'm naughty

 

[color:"blue"] Sorry mate, must've overlooked your boardname [/color]

 

Thanks for the contribution.

 

A few points though, I do think that Thailand has some first class dive sites, especially in the Similans. Best way to experience them is on a live aboard.

***Agreed , First Class not World Class

 

[color:"blue"] The Similans are rated among the top 10 sites in the world, what would that make them than? Calling them World class is totally legit in my book. [/color]

 

Comparing everything with Mike Ball standards may give you some negative experiences possibly all over the world, not only in Thailand. How many times do you meet a service like that?

***I did mention more than Mile Ball but that would be the standard and I have had that in the "Seven Seas of the World"

IN all fairness the cost in Thailand don't reflect that level of service but none the less it is lacking.

 

[color:"blue"] Correct, amongst others you mention Cozumel. Isn't that where, during the 8tees there was a very bad safety record, and up till today, the safety standards aren't the best there still?

Your remark about pricing in Thailand makes sense though. In order to get Mike Ball c.s. standards, you do tend to pay a lot more than for an average dive trip in Thailand. [/color]

 

It's the same as some divers complain about the visibility since at dive site XXXX they had 40 meters. If that's your standard, a lot of your other dives are gonna be disapointing.

I know for a fact that on our custom build dive boat on Koh Samui, we do put an effort in to give good customer service, so come on over and join us for a day. To the dive site sare far away though, nearest would be Koh Tao. 1 hour and 20 minutes by speedboat.On customer service, how about this story fromSF. I called a shop and asked about diving, they said I could come to the shop, rent some equipment and a tank, go to a certain beach and wait there for another diver to show up and ask him if I could be his buddy.

Any shitty dive boat in Thailand beats this IMHO.

****

I am not nor did I ever refer to San Francisco althoughI did

so lets jhust drop you little attempt to put me on the defensive as I haven't set foot in a dive shop in San Fran for more tht 10 years! With the exception to the PADI dive at Catalina for a very special group of memebers in 1993 I haven't made a dive in California for many years!

 

[color:"blue"] It's just an example. You mention Mike Ball for outstanding customer service, I mention a dive shop in SF for absolute crap customer service. Both examples are valid IMHO. Doesn't matter wether you ever were in SF or not. Who cares. [/color]

 

*** I would say my info speaks for itself, at the CD update in 1084 the presenters were the Training Manager at that time, John Stewart, the RTC's (Now) RM's and Jeff Mondale!

BTW the biggest changes in the IDC for the early years was to reduce the candidate writing and then computer use for class training too over and niow CD's should be editing their programs to fit the specific candidates needs. In the early days PADI was run by the late JC, who doubled as the USDivers Pres for s few years, Al Hornsby and Jeff Nadler

whpo are both with PADI today. Also there are a number of other longtimers still there with numbers like CD-32 etc.

 

[color:"blue"] Sorry, I'm not really getting your drift here. Can you explain your point please?

I know PADI members who have 3 digit membership numbers. What does that prove.

BTW, PADI in the 1084tees was a very dark and secretive sect in the middle of dark Europe!! [/color]

 

Referring to your CD Update in 84, are/were you a CD? Interesting, I'ld like to know more about it, if you feel like elaborating, by all means do so.

***No thanks, I won't take you long to see I'm very real!

 

[color:"blue"] Why being secretive about your PADI rating? Are you still a PADI member? [/color]

 

 

However, what's your point, you make it sound like a bad thing that only one of these original fellows is still in Thailand. Come on, it's 20 years ago, how many CD's from that original Update in 84 you think are still around world wide? Does it make Thailand better or worst if none or 20 of those original fwllows would be here, or for that matter any where else in the world?

*** You would be supprise how many of that group are millionares***from diving

Anyway, I'm looking forward seeing some more input from you.

 

[color:"blue"] You're not really answering my question. Fine by me.

In respond to your remark, I'm sure they're not the only ones who amde good money out of diving. Good on them. [/color]

 

My input will be based on your posts. As to evaluations good consultants with many many years experience usually fetch about 1000USD per day!

 

[color:"blue"] What do you mean by evaluations and consultants fetching 1k USD per day? Is this relevant to what we are discussing or rather what you want to discuss? [/color]

 

BTW, I totally agree on the fact that novice divers should refuse going on deep dives if they are not qualified or don't feel comfortable with this. ****Thats comforting

 

[color:"blue"] Pfffff, what a releif, you give me credit for that. That'll make my nights sleep more comforting. [/color]

 

Since King, Shark, and Ano Reef are all deep let me tell you that I have had to organize lost and panic divers a few times whom fell into that problem due to poor Divemasters. IN addition to the long boat ride the engine smell on most day boats is make people, not I, very sick!

 

[color:"blue"] Can't really comment on these remarks, since I work and live on the 'other side' so to speak. However, in all my dives in other locations in Thailand I never experienced the things that you mention. I'm not saying that they don't exist. [/color]

 

****I do think that Similans are OK, need more dive sites. Thailands greatest asset is their people and the Thai dive staff are very good. It is generally the German and French staff who are terrable and very poor dive guides.

 

[color:"blue"] Do you have an issue with Germand and/ore French or just personal experience?

Please elaborate.

Do you think the current standard of teaching (DM level) is not up to what it should be? [/color]

 

You tell me more of what's good and I will give you my spin!

One that is based on 39 years of diving and many many awards from PADI and DAN--------------------

Yours in Safe Diving!

Scuba Slut

 

[color:"blue"] As a matter of fact, some of our staff has had these rewards as well.

 

Anyway, your original post does come over as being a bit negative, as Josh already noticed.

There are many good dive operations in Thailand and I'm sure there are a few shady ones as well. Guess that's the same worldwide. IMO the good ones will outlive the bad ones.

 

Therefor that Thailand is currently one of the biggest certifaction markets in the world, I think it's a really positive thing to notice the safety aspect, standard and record in Thailand.

It's one of the best.[/color]

 

Cheers,

Limbo

 

Laissez le bon temps rouler!

 

 

Post Extras: