How do people feel about China Airlines?

[spirit_of_town_hall]

Cabin crew are good, attentive and friendly throughout journey. Planes leave on time, although pilot standard like most far east airlines is poor.

 

STH

[UAL875]

Planes leave on time, although pilot standard like most far east airlines is poor.

SOTH ? others have questioned you before on statements like this but this time around you have aroused my curiosity. Can you list out the far east airlines whose pilots? standards are poor, as you say. I want to know since I live in the Far East, fly Asian carriers regularly, and have a girlfriend, friends, and business associates in the aviation industry out here and back in the States, all of whom are knowledgeable and I trust. Since I use the services of several Asian airlines often and am confident in their pilots? judgments based on experience and personal research I would appreciate finding out who I should have been avoiding all these years. BTW ? I am not Asian so I do not have a bias in any way.

 

(to the original poster ? apologies for taking this thread off-track but SOTH has me concerned that I may be in danger since flying on planes operated by sub-standard pilots may be in my horizon)

[Guest]

Well I have to disagree with STH for the most part.

 

The Major airlines hire mostly foreign pilots and ALL of them pass their update tests on a regular basis. In fact in some areas local knowledge of the airports is very valuble. Many of these tests are now done in Kunming where I used to work, at the state of the art Being Flight Training center. Many of the regional carriers send there pilots there for certification.

 

On the otherhand there is a list of 'black listed' airlines that the pilots themselves won't fly on and people such as UN staff are NOT allowed to fly on. I used to have that list but it would be a couple of years out of date. I do remember airlines such as Lao Aviation, Vietnam Air and a couple of the Russian carriers on the list as well as Phillipino national carrier. This list changes every few months, perhaps someone with a UN connection could 'bribe' it out of them

 

In the old days, and certain Thai carrier with a name the same as a capital city was on my personal 'no fly' list as a goodly number of their pilots and mechanics used to drink in my bar and I could not ignore some of the horror stories. I'm sure they have cleaned up their act by now though. ::

[Sukhumvit]

Yeah, Vietnam Airlines used to have Aussie pilots I recall. Nice Viet trolley dollies too in traditional Ao Dais.I was in a boozer in downtown Hoville a few years ago and a gang of them were in there, pissed as farts and dancing on the bar top.

 

Mind you it was New Years Eve.

[spirit_of_town_hall]

Hi there, happy to answer... from what I have been told by various reliable people in the airline business, some of whom are commercial pilots....

 

Korean Airlines, China Air, Malaysian Airlines, Garuda, JAL and Thai have poor Pilots when compared to the likes of say Air France, SAS, Cathay Pacific, Singapore Airlines, EL AL etc...

 

 

I am talking specifically about pilot ability and not aircraft safety records or maintenance.

 

STH

[UAL875]

SOTH - I consider Cathay Pacific and Singapore Airlines to be Far East carriers (I understand their western ties). I disagree with you 100% on JAL - in fact the Japanese standards are quite rigid with regards to flight safety and pilot training. I am probably most comfortable on ANA, JAL, and JAS. Landing in heavies at several of the regional Japanese airports - particularly in Kyushu - confirmed to me that these guys have a strong skillset. My industry sources (and I) have no issues with Thai either. None whatsoever. So, as you are entitled to your opinion about most far east carriers' pilots being poor particular compared to their Western counterparts, I am entitled to mine and still hold firm that a good portion of the majors out here do employ pilots who are top notch.

[spirit_of_town_hall]

I use various yard sticks, skill isnt my only variable. Only the other week a Japanese co-pilot on JAL left the cockpit to help the (all-female cabin crew) subdue a drunk causing chaos, leaving the cockpit door WIDE open. Would you want to be on a plane where the co-pilot leaves the cockpit door open, this is especially pertinent as Japan is on heightned alert as they have contributed some sort of force to Iraq, as have Thailand so they are both legitimate targets to terrorists.

 

This was personally witnessed by a good friend of mine. A good pilot is a combination of skill, common sense and initiative or that grotesque phrase "thinking outside the box."

 

Very rarely will you encounter all three on an Asian airline exceptions being Cathay and Singapre airlines.

 

A remark made to me by a very handsome American pilot in Big Dogs springs to mind, take away China Air pilots, spectacles and spot cream and the whole airline is grounded; that still makes me chuckle.

 

STH

[UAL875]

Would you want to be on a plane where the co-pilot leaves the cockpit door open, this is especially pertinent as Japan is on heightned alert

The incident you describe will have no impact on me flying JAL in the future. I was on a Lufthansa flight where the A340 pilot acted similarly (leaving the cockpit door open) when he came out to chastise a smoker who had been lighting up in the toilet. In a way, I think both gentlemen were thinking outside the box. I thought nothing of it and I, personally, am constantly on heightened alert after having a few colleagues die on 9/11.

 

Given your opinions, I guess my friends, associates and I out here in Asia have been extremely fortunate over the years because the industry personnel we know and, in some instances, are related to (several pilots in the mix) or have had the pleasure to fly with possess pretty broad bandwidth and certainly appear as capable and confident as their Western counterparts.

[carew66]

I was talking to 2 pilots in Bangkok. I'd love to say where but it really would be unfair (!) and they were ripping the piss out of Ryanair*! Neither of them flew for that firm and the talk was getting a bit 'technical' but I got the distinct impression that Ryanair was shite. This was not due to their pilots though - just the pressure that they were under (turnarounds, fuel etc).

 

Vietnamese Airlines is one of my favourite.

 

I flew 2 legs with them. Danang to HCMC firstly. We (statesman1954) believe that the pilot was Dutch or German and he was doing the meeting and greeting at the cabin entrance together with the cabin crew. It was like going into a rather strict History teacher's lesson. I was freaking myself out at the time as I was reading 'Dispatches' and 'The Cat from Hue' and had a mental image of a photo that I'd seen of a Boeing leaving Danang during it's fall with people hanging onto the undercarriage and falling off into the sea. The existence of all the old US blast pens and dispersal areas was adding to my mood...

 

A lovely flight though in one of the smaller Airbus (Airbii??). The food was not just edible; it was really good! (I may have been especially hungry though).

 

One thing about these aircraft - and I've done some miles in them in various marques - is that apart from the flap and wheel deployment with all the attendant whirrs, clicks and clunks there is very little drama on landing. They 'fly onto' the runway. I want more drama! I want engines spooling up and power being chopped and the whole shebang. Airbus landings are boring! (Except for Kathmandu** - but then everything is different there!)

 

*Budget firm, Irish based, run by a bloke called O'Leary I think, who is a right tight arse. 737 fleet with a Guinness logo on the tail (well okay it's not - but that's what it reminds me of).

 

** And Knock Airport in Co Mayo. A strip of tarmac on the bog.

[UAL875]

Carew, fellow disciple ? glad to see this thread getting a bit lighter. Never flew Vietnamese Airlines but am happy that your experience was favorable.

 

By the way, Airbii is actually the plural for Airbus e.g. "I flew two Airbii on my journey to Brussels, an A-340 and an A-300." The smaller Airbii ? models A-318, A-319, and A-320 are commonly referred to by those in the know as Airbu [AIR ? boo] e.g. "did you see the steep takeoff of that Airbu on runway one three?" Now for the proposed super-jumbo A-380 - which God only knows how many the Japanese are going to integrate into their 500 daily flights between Osaka and Tokyo - will be known as Airboom-for-real, once and for all dispelling the myth that there is not a market for a doubledecker that can transport all of NEP, all of Nanaplaza.com, the average bargirl's village including livestock and still have room to spare for a fleet of tuk-tuks, their drivers, and families as well as space on level two for an in-flight tattoo artist (known as the "FJ factor"). All clarification provided by my gf who is certified as a flight attendant for the Airbus 300-600 series. Up to you to figure out what, if not all, is bullshit in this post.

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