Guest Posted May 9, 2004 Report Share Posted May 9, 2004 Hi Fly, >>>>>what i am saying here is that the term 'farang' is perfectly neutral, it simply describes a person of western descent<<<< I agree. I've know many Thai's to speak very affectionately about someone who was a farang, and use the term. No venom in their voice at all. The term simply means 'non-Thai'. But of course, can be used in a deragative nature, as in 'that fucking farang'. But the same could also be used in ....'that fucking Thai'. In, and of itself, is not a bad word. HT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soongmak Posted May 9, 2004 Report Share Posted May 9, 2004 and yes, people and cultures are different. what is important how that difference is dealt with - respectfully or disdainful. the term farang itself does neither - how it is used matters. Exactly. If thais talk about farangs as a group, I don't have a problem with it. Do they call me farang to my face, I feel like I am reduced to one single common denominator - my skin color - and cease to be an individual to the other. I am just a farang, a white skinned foreigner. The fact that the word may have an interesting etymology that is in no way racist, doesn't mean it isn't a racist word. They still single me out on my race. Do you call a black a black to his face, or would you ask him what his name is? Cheers, soongmak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 9, 2004 Report Share Posted May 9, 2004 it all just depends. my mates call me by name (or farang when they take the piss, and i have ample opportunities to use the word as well during pisstakes, like when somebody doesn't understand something technical, i have the opportunity to say a joke with "sayasaat farang" (farang magic). what can we do? our western background (skincolour, education, culture) does single us out in a thai setting. it has its advantages, and it does has its disadvantages. and if it comes to interpersonal relationships, well, i guess it's like everwhere - you have some who don't make a fuss and respect you as a person, and other who will dislike you on account of your superficial differences. i would even say that the very nasty and extreme cases as they happen unfortunately too often in the west such as racially inspired violence is still very rare here (which doesn't mean that one day it won't be increasing dramatically - i am convinced that it will due to several factors: the continuous dive of nationalism in politics, the hopelessness of the average thai population, and partly by the respectless behavious of many farang here). lets take for example the netherlands. racism based on skincolor seems to be a very minor issue there, even though being staunchly protestant the netherlands has achieved the maybe most tolerant society in europe and i do really admire what has been reached there in terms of social justice. but, well, there is one problem for me there: i am a german. i have had numerous incidents there, and with dutch people in foreign countries which have soured my experience of the netherlands. starting from people who told me that germans are genetically predisposed to be nazis, going over to dutch people who refused to speak german with me even though they were absolutely fluent etc. constant comparism and tirades about the "bad" germans (yes i know they do exist, but i am not one of those arrogant pompous nationally proud twats), refusals of dutch my age to converse with me on account of the nazi times (we both haven't even been born during those times). personally i think this is very sad, as i do like the nethlands and their system, a lot. but i have been exposed to way too many incidents of personal racism to have much fun there. of course institutionalised racism in thailand is far worse here than in most western countries. and the separate prices based on our race are a very annoying, but compared to other things, such as the increased difficulties to get long term visas and workpermits, or the shabby treatment of ethnic minorities, very minor. and that is where thailand has a real problem: institutionalised racism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lazyphil Posted May 9, 2004 Report Share Posted May 9, 2004 If/when a Thai calls me a falang I take it as NOT an insult or slur, I couldn't care less. Whats the big deal, not exactly like the *N* word used on blacks now is it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaad Posted May 9, 2004 Report Share Posted May 9, 2004 Some people do not take 'farang' as an insult, some do. For me it mostly depends on how it's used. Anyway, no matter how many threads we spend on this, we'll never agree on its definiton, simply because we all use and hear it in different ways. Just think about words such as negro, asian, skinhead, whore... The latter for example has been discussed here and IMO none of the above mentioned words should be used in public out of respect for those who DO find it insulting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALHOLK Posted May 9, 2004 Report Share Posted May 9, 2004 Hi! I think that practice has been discontinued in Sweden. Some years ago Swedes married to, or living with a Thai national would recieve a subtantial discount but friend married to a Thai lady told me that this ceased several years ago. regards ALHOLK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 10, 2004 Report Share Posted May 10, 2004 >>>>Just think about words such as negro, asian, skinhead, whore... The latter for example has been discussed here and IMO none of the above mentioned words should be used in public out of respect for those who DO find it insulting. <<< what is insulting about "asian"? i am a "european", and even though for some "americans" that seems nowadays to be a term to insult us "europeans" i don't see anything remotely insulting in either "european" or "asian". and as it concerns the term "farang", well, hard luck, thais will most definately not give up that term. and if someone is insulted by the bare term "farang" then he should better spend some time to get to understand the language, and the root of that term before making an ass out of themselves by being insulted by a term which clearly is not meant as an insult. that way we could go on and start banning the term "fuck off". that is one of the beauties in english language, "fuck" can be used for almost anything. that way i can say to my best friend "fuck off" without damaging our relationship, and i can also use it as one of the most demeaning terms availale during an argument. all depends in the context i use it. and surly most here would agree that modern english would be a lot poorer with the term "fuck" and all its uses. so basically, knowledge earns respect, and knowing what the term farang means, where it comes from earns respect. i do not respect anyone by not using the term "farang" who appearantly has neither the linguistic skills nor the empathy to understand its meaning as a perfectly neutral description, and is offended by what he/she wrongly interpretes as a racial slur. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaad Posted May 10, 2004 Report Share Posted May 10, 2004 what is insulting about "asian"? IMO There's nothing insulting about "asian" or "farang", but it can be given an insulting touch/smell by pronouncing or using it in a certain way. Personally, I don't like to use such terms as it *may* show lack of interest to familiarize oneself with another person's name etc. What also concerns me more is one's facial expressing after pronouncing such words and this is definitely not only a Thai thing. For me the word itself is innocent. and if someone is insulted by the bare term "farang" then he should better spend some time to get to understand the language, and the root of that term before making an ass out of themselves by being insulted by a term which clearly is not meant as an insult. It can clearly be used to piss a person off as you explained with another term.. i can say to my best friend "fuck off" without damaging our relationship, and i can also use it as one of the most demeaning terms availale during an argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattaya127 Posted May 10, 2004 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2004 I read this discussion and I realize we really miss having a few more thais on the board, who could speak from the thai side, about farang, racism, XXX pricing. Jasmine could help, here, but she oftens has the same POV as us, for living so long in the west. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 10, 2004 Report Share Posted May 10, 2004 "I've been many places around the wrold but haven't had children pointing at me on the street calling out "foreigner, foreigner" as I have here" I've definetely seen that kind of thing happenning in several countries, including western ones. But there at least people are usually spared most of the institutionnalised part and the systematic rascist slants. On a side note how is it thais seem to be considered a waaay underpar culture and race by most former members of the expat community and a considerable bunch of the current one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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