Ethnic groups attack citizenship test

[Steve]

Not wanting to start a debate (hmmm, maybe I do? lol )but should Thais expect falangs to make an effort to learn Thai? A lot of us don't bother or think we should be made to. Frankly, I can't see how I could stay long term without trying.

 

I have mixed feelings about the 'learn english this is oz' or 'learn english this is america' thing. The reason is that most cities have a chinatown and in the states no one would want the chinatowns of San Francisco or NY, the two most famous ones to lose their 'charm' by having their signs in chinse taken down or them being forced to do all their business in english. There is a Little Italy as well and even though they are a few generations removed from their original settlers, the cafes and shops are tourist attractions like Chinatowns as well.

 

So, to be fair, if some of us want everyone to adopt the 'muvver tongue' of Oz, the states, or where ever, should we also demand that these long time ethnic enclaves like chinatowns also go away? I'm a bit of a hypocrite in that regard. While I don't like people coming in and demanding that they be catered to in their native tongues and don't want to learn englsh, they can point to the chinatowns that are accepted.

[Julian2]

I'm from the UK originally, OH, my family were immigrants to Australia in 1954 so I suppose I'm Australian. Three years in Thailand, three in the Philippines, one in Lao.

Immigration is a historical fact of life, only those who's ancestors stayed in the Great Rift Valley can claim indigenous rights. And might and right won't prevent it, the people from less productive, poorer countries will go to the richer, and if they are determined they will succeed. That's what succeeds, determination, eventually the less determined possessors of the land will attempt to evict them, then breed them out.... do your bit OH, and usually get bred out themselves. The states in the US that have the illegal immigrant problem are those that once belonged to those people, who took them from the Amerindians. Your ancestors took them by purchase, war or outright theft and are squealing now because they are being reclaimed. Sure their way of life is different but when they get the goodies they came for their college educated children will living in nice houses, having weekend BBQs and their black sheep sons will be heading to Thailand to meet some 'real women' who know how to treat a man properly.

[Steve]

No doubt the indians got royally screwed. Its a shameful part of the history unfortunately the land can't simply be given back nowadays.

 

There is a misconeption that the Mexicans here have had parts of the U.S. for a long time. Actually Spain had the lands in California, Texas, etc. Mexico got its independence in 1821 and America took parts of it in the Mexican American war in the 1840s. So, California was part of prresent Mexico for only about 25 years. Spain and France (briefly under Napoleon) had ruled the region. Although it could be argued that the Mexican people were still living there if not autonomously.

 

Anyway, off on a tangent. I'd like to try my hand at Aussie speak. That would crack a lot of people up. Gidday mite (is that how you phonetically pronounce it?)

[Old Hippie]

Julian, Tanks for your replies. But I will maintain that Mexicans have NO right to be here illeagally, demanding anything. Plan and simple. I also thibnk any group that comes here, should assimilatye, and accept that the culture is different than that from which they came. Of course we should make tolerences for them to a resonable point.

 

Steve,

 

China town SFO...? yes...full of illeagle Chinese, and MEXICANS! Here you see signs in Chinese restaurants saying "necesitamos ayudar de cuchine" (we need/are hiring kitchen help) Don't tell me they speak Spanish in China now?

 

Ethnic communities are indeed great, and they do add value to our cities and lives. But outside of those communities, they need to accept the fact, that the culture is different, and respect that.

 

As for speaking Thai in Thailand. Yes, I think Farangs who liver there should be able to speak the Language. This is why I go to Thai language classes now. Will I be fluent? doubt it, but I do o.k. getting around. A lot depends on how bad the Thai person I am talking to wants to understand me.

 

But I will say, I don't think I have any right to immigrate to Thailand, that is a privilidge. Yes, I some day hope to live there. This means being able to support myself, (no help from Thai tax payers)speak the language at a functional level, and not demanding that Thai culture bend and twist to accomodate me. I essentially have no right to demand anything from Thailand or any other country I visit or live in.

[Flashermac]

Big difference was in numbers. There were only a few million American Indians when the evil white devils came to swap them beads for Manhattan. (They can have NYC back, for all I care.) The Abos in Oz are estimated at from half a million to a million when the first convicts came. Rightly or wrongly, could the indigenous folks have expected to hold onto an entire continent? (The Celts couldn't even hold on to England.)

 

But too many immigrants now come to a well developed country with a high standard of living to share the benefits of living there -- but only on their terms.

 

p.s. See-oh, ta-heej. (That almost exhausts my Cherokee, not that many Cherokees speak it either these days.)

 

 

 

[Flashermac]

Here ya go, Steve:

 

http://www.textfiles.com/humor/strine.txt

 

 

 

[Steve]

I think the problem in the U.S. is Mexican American, not Latino. All past immigrants had their enclaves but encouraged their children to learn english and integrate. There is a growing amount of Ameiricans of Mexican descent who feel California and Texas is theirs and feel no need to integrate. They envision a spanish SW called the 'reconquista' by the more millitant ones. This view is not shared by Latinos of non Mexican heritage. They are like the immigrants of the past. They want their kids to become American and integrate and be successful Americans. Same for Asian immigrants as well. A lot of people group Latinos in the SW as Mexican when there are a very large number of Salvadoreans and a growing number of Guatemalans and other central american immigrants.

 

As far as Oz it seems its becoming a polyglot mish mash of people like the U.S.

[Lusty]

Isn't Oz history similar to American history. 'Muvver Engerlund' sent their prisoners and social outcasts to Botany Bay, Plymouth, Massachusetts and Pennsylvania. lol.

 

Funny thing is Oz gets the reputation for prisoners and America got a whole lot of them themselves who a few generations down were calling themselves the social elite...lol...

 

 

 

Do they voters there get to have their ballots in different languages like they do here? We have just about every conceivable dialect or language on government forms.

 

Just as a point of interest,the prison hulk barges used to be moored up in the River Medway estuary just a stones throw from where I live.

Also a question to the Aussies on this board.Someone asked in one of the papers how New South Wales got its name when its bordered by territories with much more illustrious` names like Queensland and Victoria.No one knew the answer.

I've been to both the old and the New South Wales's and the old one is a real boring place.

So how did NSW's get its name?Thanx

 

 

[Old Hippie]

Steve,

 

I agree with your comments concerning some factions of Mexican immigrants. But, I will disagree with the interrpretation of Latino immigrants as a whole. In generel, Latinos seem to have less interest in assimilating, be the Mexicans in Texas, or California, Puerto Ricans in the East, Cubans in the south etc...like it or not, Spanish is the unofficial second language now.

 

I will add, many Asian groups seem to be uninterested in integrating/assimilating as well. At least here in the Bay area, no ideas how it is in other parts of the country that are predominently white, other ethnic group dominated.

[Flashermac]

I imagine when NSW was named England had no queen and Victoria hadn't even been born ...

 

Still doesn't explain why it was NSW though. But then how did the New Hebrides get their name???