cern and blackholes

[Guest lazyphil]

if you're not you youtube you're nobody. end of. :smirk:

[Julian2]

Hmmm... Most Medieval scholars believe in the existence of Christ and Mohammad.

The christian writings that refer to Jesus are from sources too diverse to doubt they are based on the same man.

 

Many gospels (lives of Christ) are lost though, and popular scholastic opinion is that they were destroyed, not because they doubted his existence, but because they never placed enough emphasis on his divine nature.

 

Mohammad is a well recorded historical figure, there's no suggestion of a divine connection here, he and his followers have only ever referred to him as a prophet, "There is one God Allah and Mohammad is his prophet".

 

[Flashermac]

if you're not you youtube you're nobody. end of. :smirk:

 

 

Aw, shucks.

 

 

[Flashermac]

<< Many gospels (lives of Christ) are lost though, and popular scholastic opinion is that they were destroyed, not because they doubted his existence, but because they never placed enough emphasis on his divine nature. >>

 

Not so lost anymore. Many have been found amongst the scrolls at Nag Hamadi. I recall that one book of around the 1st century BC was quoted from by Jesus in the Sermon on the Mount. The early church would rather have people believe Jesus was speaking new ideas, not quoting sayings well known to most of his listeners.

 

The so-called Dead Sea Scrolls have been available since the 1940s, but churches have not been exactly eager to let their contents be known to the general public. No sense rocking the boat.

 

p.s. Muhammad is well recorded posthumously. Almost nothing about him from his lifetime.

 

[elef]

Gospel of Mary is often forgotten

[Julian2]

Whatever.

When Constantine the Great decided to make Christianity the official religion he had a serious talk to the churches leaders.

 

He pointed out the citizenry weren't going to be too impressed with what was on offer and they had better get their shit together and make sure that Christ was seen as divine.

 

Around that time there was a very popular god called Mithras, and "surprisingly" the reinvention of Christ incorporated a number of his mysteries.

 

The later Christian Councils had considerable difficulty defining the Holy Trinity against the One God policy. Heresies such as Arianism led to considerable blood letting.

 

[shygye]

It's all very simple. The Bible and early Christian documents cannot be trusted, since the Romans didn't write about Jesus.

 

...

 

... and Jesus never wrote anything.

[Julian2]

The Christian documents were written by men who knew men who knew Christ.

Secondhand for sure, but the Apostles and most of the disciples moved on and spread the word.

The death of Saint Peter is recorded and his teachings of the life of Christ would have been passed on also.

Once again, I'm supporting Christ as a historical figure rather than as a religious one.

[Flashermac]

It's all very simple. The Bible and early Christian documents cannot be trusted' date=' since the Romans didn't write about Jesus.

 

...[/quote']

 

... and Jesus never wrote anything.

 

Yes, he did. He wrote in the sand.

 

However, there is an anonymous gospel type book that some scholars have speculated could have been written by Jesus himself.

 

p.s. http://www.thelostbooks.com/

 

This is the wierd stuff ...

 

http://www.thelostbooks.com/anom.htm

 

And other non-traditional notions. So much for the "hippie" stuff:

 

<< Was Jesus Wealthy or Poor?

 

Matthew 2:1 Wise men (not just three but, perhaps, many wise men) from the east bearing gifts of Gold. How much gold? A hundred pounds? More? A caravan of camels can carry a tremendous weight of gold. They knew they were searching for a King. The queen of Sheba (I Kings 10:2) brought â?? a very great train, with camels, that bear spices and very much gold..â? Solomon. A little gold went a long ways in those days.

 

[color:red]Jesus earthly father, Joseph, had a (relatively) good high-paying profession.[/color] He had money to provide a house for Mary and Jesus to live in for two years in Bethlehem. (Mathew 2:11, â??And when they (the wise men) were come into the house, they saw the young Childâ? not baby). Part of the wise menâ??s gold financed the trip to Egypt and 3-5 years living expenses for the family.

 

Jesus had a ministry team of 12 core staff and numerous fulltime and part-time followers. [color:red]The ministry had to be prosperous and properly funded to support 3.5 years of evangelism.[/color] The ministry headquarters was at Capernaum on the Sea of Galilee.

 

[color:red]Mark 2:1[/color] says Jesus â??was in the houseâ?Â. Couldnâ??t Jesus own a house? One big enough to provide rooms for His staff? Lakefront property! When He stayed at other peopleâ??s houses the owners were identified by name, Zacchaus (Luke 19); Mary, Martha, and Lazarus (Luke 10:38-42). Matthew owned a house, Luke 5:29, big enough for a â??great banquetâ? with a â??large company of tax collectors and othersâ?Â.

 

Peter owned lakefront property too, Matthew 8:14, and at least one â??shipâ?Â. [color:red]Fishing was at least an upper middle class business. Fully equipped fishing boats, today and they, are very expensive.[/color]

 

Peter, Matthew, James and John, and the others were â??astonished out of measureâ? at the teaching of the difficulty of the rich man entering the Kingdom of God (Mark 10:17-3). There were two reasons they were astonished. 1. They were, themselves, â??rich menâ?Â. 2. They did not yet understanding that Jesus was teaching about loving money being evil. We are to love God and to love people. Having money and using it to serve others and to finance the expansion of the Gospel is good.

 

[color:red]Jesusâ?? followers, included the very wealthy and very powerful.[/color] Joseph of Arimathaea and Nicodemus (John 19:38-42) were secret followers as were the aforementioned Zacchaus (Luke 19); Mary, Martha, and Lazarus. Also, according to Josephus, Pilateâ??s wife (Matthew 27:19) was a follower.

 

[color:red]Jesus ministry had a treasurer, Judas, the keeper of the bag. Jesus ministry was constantly giving money to the poor.[/color] At the last supper, John 13:29-30, Judas left unexpectedly and the others assumed that Jesus had sent him to give alms to the poor. Evidently this was a commonplace occurrence because they did not find it unusual at all.

 

[color:red]Jesus wore designer clothes![/color] In John 19:23-24 the solders cast lots for His valuable tunic. It is described as â??seamless, woven (in one piece) from the top throughout. Roman soldiers would not argue over a worthless item of clothing.

 

Philippians 2:7 says that Jesus took on the form of a servant. Rich people can serve others too. He came to serve, to teach, and He came so â??that we might have life more abundantlyâ?Â. 2 Corinthians 8:9 For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sakes He became poor, that you through His poverty might become rich. When the Prince of Heaven became a man he became relatively poor. He had to have significant financial resources to travel and to minister effectively. >>

 

http://www.egospel.org/Jesus_Wealthy.htm