Thailands reputation

[Guest]

>>>>>I said the problem (again, if any) of prostitution on a large sacle, as an industry, is deeper than just 2 people consenting. It took many factors to congregate so many girls in one place like Pattaya or Nana, or else, the industry was not started because some girls wanted to meake a buck with her ass.<<<<<

 

Nesessity is the mother of invention. Where does the most rampant prostitution rates occur in the world? In countries with shit-poor economy, or are in political turmoil, leaving young girls with little alternatives. Africa, has both, at the moment. Does Thailand have a shit-poor economy? For Issan dirt farmers, it sure does, hense a large souce of the sex-trade there.

 

The prositution rate, in any country, is directly related to it's ability to provide viable alternitives to it's participants. Thailand does very little in this regard. And I feel that if you take a close look at any other country with a high prostitution rate, you find very similar similarities present.

 

As Thailand comes into its own, in regards to becoming a 'world force', it will most certainly clean up its 'mess' along the way. Hell..time to wake up, fellow punters.....it's already started, as we all know. There will be blimps on the screen, along the way. But in the not-too-distant-future, Thailand, and its 60 million citizens, will demand that it become 'respectable', as it makes inroads into the global community. They simply, will not, as all other emerging economy's have done, stand for a stain on their fabric. Look at Singapore....THE hotbed of asian sex, not that very long ago.

 

Time changes everything, and so, it will, with Thailand's image. Right now they need every $$$ from the sex industry they can bring in. They understand that it is providing the social security benifits for its millions of citizens up north, because they are unable to do so, right now, along with pumping cash into a multitude of other venues. The minute that they are able to stand on their own two feet, as a viable world power however, is the day that the sex trade, as we know it now, dies.

 

Will it continue within the culture itself? Of course. Just like most SEA cultures. But...that is not what all the fuss has been about, has it? Thailands image problem does not come from with how it handles prositution internaly, but from how it handles it externaly.

 

They have looked the other way, because it has been benefitial for them to do so. That will simply not be the case, further down the road. The simple fact is that Thailand is all too aware of its global image. But it simply cannot afford to economicly eridicate it, at this point in time. You don't think they want to?????They would love nothing better, especially within a culture that has saving face, such an important part of their image. Let's be realistic.....how rotten is it for a GTG to try to enjoy what the outside world has to offer for her, only to have to hang her head in shame, because of the stigmatism attached to her, through the reputation of some of her 'sisters', back home. That is a horrible thing, and terribly unfair.

 

Anyway, just my thoughts here. Just trying to look at things from the big picture. I'm certainly not an expert, but enjoy things while you can, because I do sniff the winds of change. It's not going to happen overnight, but it will happen. 10 years from now, Thailand will be a much different place, as we all know it now.

 

HT

[bibblies]

Says HIGH THAIED:

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Let's be realistic.....how rotten is it for a GTG to try to enjoy what the outside world has to offer for her, only to have to hang her head in shame, because of the stigmatism attached to her, through the reputation of some of her 'sisters', back home. That is a horrible thing, and terribly unfair.

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Hmm, there are worse things in the world. I'd tend to look down on GTGs more on suspicion of them being complicit in corruption and beneficiaries of unfair privilege. Logically, there's no reason why prostitution should be stigmatised. Corruption affects the lives of more people in far worse ways. But sadly, it benefits the ruling elite and they probably care more about what someone thinks about their daughters.

 

And enough of this bending over backwards in ridiculous comparisons to try to excuse this corruption! If you're in any doubt then simply take a look at any of the many reports compiled by bodies such as Transparency International (e.g. corruptions perception index: Finland top with 10/10, UK 10th with 8.7, US 14th with 7.8, Thailand 60th with 3.2, Nigeria bottom with 1.2).

[Guest lazyphil]

<<how rotten is it for a GTG to try to enjoy what the outside world has to offer for her, only to have to hang her head in shame, because of the stigmatism attached to her, through the reputation of some of her 'sisters', back home. That is a horrible thing, and terribly unfair>>

 

I understand where your coming from, however from what I've seen and heard with my mrs mixing with other Thai females socially at Thai parties, summer bbq's and at work with both ex bg's and non bgs or gtg's if you like, they are Thais together abroard and can close ranks to others at times. In England there are so many other issues regarding illegal immigrants from Iraq and Afghanistan, Kosovo etc that your average person doesn't give a rats arse or even know the distiction between a non bg/bg, I think reading this site too much ends up making you think people spend there time worrying if a thai they see was ever a prostitute, WAKE UP THEY DONT! . Sure the odd group of hi-so young Thais I sometimes see on holiday/uni in Cambridge wouldn't give any of the Thais I know the time of day, some, like my mrs came via me, others met fellas at dating agencies some are relatives of girls who have be given jobs and sponserships at Thai restaurants to work at, a whole host of reasons they came here, mostly thru being tenacious rather than having some high level of education and status or high standing is los. However one Thai lady I know whos uni educated is married to some college professor who owns a beautiful restaurant, she hosts Thai parties now and then and is quite charming, a really lovely lady (in her 40's I guess) and invites as many Thais as she can to her 'do's' and I watch they way she mingles with all with a wonderful graciousness and seemingly without this hangup about Thai bg's.

[Guest]

I hear what both you and Akarr are saying, but I will point out this: sometimes it's easy to feel like this entire society here is about buying and selling. Those same people in our "Thai families" who may feel uneasy about being associated with P4P took sin sot from us, right?

 

My intention is not to open up a debate about the merits of sin sot, etc, but merely to point out that commerce seems to have a place in fairly intimate areas of relationships here. The sprawling nature of prostitution just kind of seems to fit in with that.

[Guest]

Well said. If you don't know how to interact with women in the first place Thailand won't save you.

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Hmmm.

 

One morning eating breakfast in a cafe fronting Beach Road in Pattaya, and watching the sometimes motley collection of freakish farangs and their thai prey may convince you otherwise. ::

[Guest]

To further back up my point, what does the 2 am curfew, clamp down on nudity in bars and drug testing on farangs mean?

 

It means that there already is a less forthcoming Thailand to the farang sex scene.

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I'm not sure these things really do support your point.

 

* The 2AM curfew was much more broadly targeted than just at the farang-oriented sex venues.

 

* Clamp-down on nudity: this one of the three things you mentioned works best for your purposes. But even this has eroded to the point where it's not difficult to find nudity.

 

* The drug testing on farangs has thus far been in places like Q-Bar -- not part of the "farang sex scene" (this was recently discussed in another thread)

[Guest]

this is why one should not blame the guy or the girl, but the factors that lead to ...

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If you are even talking about "blame", aren't you starting with the assumption there is something worth blaming something or someone about? If so, what is that something? What's to blame? I don't see anything blameworthy.

 

When you start talking about blaming the "factors" - whatever that means - discussions become hopelessly muddled and confused. And out of that muddled thinking and confusion you start getting all sorts of proposed remedies to questionable "problems" that generally involve more government control over our lives and less personal freedom. Is that a path we really want to take?

 

Finally...

but the factors that lead to girls laying on their back rather than getting an education or being able to be working and live with their kid(s).

If you ask a guy in a gogo, where would he like to be at that very moment, he'll tell you "Here! Are you kidding". try to get the same answer from the girl he's BFining.

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Try asking that of any woman that has to work for a living in any job: would you rather be at home right now with your kids or at work? And then consider the alternative. Its a f#*$ing job - of course they'd rather be somewhere else most of the time! Where would you rather be right now: at your job working or on vacation in Phuket?

[Guest]

Its was rather a reflection that Thailand might be less forthcoming to the scene in the future,

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Maybe, but there is a tremendous amount of money tied up in the industry. And much of that money goes to vested interests, such as the boys in brown. In other words, can Thailand afford the luxury of being so puritanical? A Catholic country like the Philippines might be willing to pay that price, but a Buddhist country like Thailand?

 

I think KHMarried did an excellent job of addressing the examples you raised that purport to demonstrate that Thailand is becoming less tolerant of pay for play. No need to revisit that issue, other than to say I will admit that the New Social Order did muck things up without fixing anything that needed fixing and causing more than a small amount of economic hardship for many of those who already suffer the most here.

 

I agree with you on the corruption issue. That is the problem. Bibblies cite to transparency international is spot on, but a bit old. In the more recent survey Thailand's ranking is worse. Transparency International now rates Thailand 64. When you reach that sort of ranking these days (and this is very recent), it triggers all sorts of reporting requirements to headquarters if you work for some multinationals, making the country even less attractive for FDI.

[pattaya127]

aren't you starting with the assumption there is something worth blaming

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nope, just IMO. I wrote "the problem of prostitution, IF ANY". free for you to see there's no problem.

I think you are being disingenuous about: "at your job working or on vacation in Phuket?" (though i do not care for Phuket, wrong choice, try Issan next time!!!). I mentionned the kids that a girl may not see often, but still you had to make it a choive between a rock and a paradise/vacation.

I have nothing else to say. get to meet girls from the trade, other than chatting over a dring or a pillow the morning afer, and believe me, you will understand it's a job that can take a lot away from you. Not that I do not admit there are some floozies out there, who are so addicted to the lifestyle, that there is no return. far from it, but that too, i find regrettable. IMO: I hope it's OK with you

[Guest]

get to meet girls from the trade, other than chatting over a dring or a pillow the morning afer, and believe me, you will understand it's a job that can take a lot away from you. Not that I do not admit there are some floozies out there, who are so addicted to the lifestyle, that there is no return. far from it, but that too, i find regrettable. IMO: I hope it's OK with you

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There are many jobs that take a lot away from you. There are weeks where I feel like I have aged years. I appreciate that you honestly believe there is something regrettable about girls entering the trade and appreciate your low key response to my straightforward views on the subject, but I see absolutely nothing wrong with play for pay per se. No one has ever been able to articulate what that regrettable "something" is about the trade in any fashion that is even remotely persuasive. Having been here over eight years now, I have had the pleasure of meeting many p4p woman, and while I may not have the depth of understanding and empathy others here claim, I think I know a little about the 'trade' and the girls in the trade. I see nothing unique.

 

I agree that there are plenty of BGs ["floozies", to use your term] "out there, who are so addicted to the lifestyle" that it goes beyond just making a living, but I also see nothing regrettable about that. It's perfectly understandable why they enjoy the excitement and attention; it's more fun than working in an office, and when you are 18 or 22, you have the stamina for that kind of lifestyle. Never forget the most important point to this entire discussion: it's their life and their choice; not yours or mine.