MaiLuk Posted December 12, 2003 Report Share Posted December 12, 2003 Dr Abraham Maslow is considered one of the greatest psychologists of the 20th century. Maslow theorized that the journey thru life could be represented by a pyramid, with the basic need to survive at the bottom, and self actualization at the top. One must overcome the first step before moving to the next. 5. Self Actualization 4. Esteem 3. Love and belonging 2. Safety 1. Physiological The most basic needs of all beings are physiological ? food, water, sleep, etc. Maslow believed that ? until these needs were met ? people could not develop to the next level. The next level involves needs for safety and security. This is the need for protection from various threats ? floods, tigers, robbers and so on. Once secure in these basic needs, people will seek to satisfy the higher growth needs. The first of the growth needs is love and belonging ? being part of a circle of friends and family. If this need is satisfied, then people feel free to meet esteem needs, like achievement, recognition and self-respect. Once self-esteem is assured, then ? and only then ? we can reach the ultimate level, self-actualization ? the full development of our personal potentials. However, Maslow believed that many people never reach that ultimate point, because they get stuck at one of the lower levels. Lacking esteem, you may forever seek it. For example, it becomes very important to be addressed with a specific title ("Sir," "Doctor" or "Captain"). You may refuse to explore new areas of life, because they may require that you start again as a low-status beginner. Likewise, lacking love or a sense that you belong, you may do almost anything to attempt to get it. Giving extravagant gifts, offering yourself sexually, or making a fool of yourself to entertain others ? all these behaviors can be attempts to get the love and belonging you need. While you are striving to meet the lower-level needs, you are unable to work toward self-actualization. Those who reach the top step share similar characteristics. First, self-actualizers tend to have an acceptance of themselves, others and nature. They learn to accept their own human nature with all of its shortcomings. They look at the shortcomings of others and the contradictions of human nature with humor and tolerance. Actualizers identify deeply with others and with the human situation in general. They tend to develop profound interpersonal relationships marked by deep, loving bonds. In contrast to many people, actualizers are spontaneous and have a nonhostile sense of humor. This means that jokes are not made to hurt anyone. In addition, they learn to laugh at themselves and their own human shortcomings. My travels in Thailand have led me to believe that most thai people exist at the lower steps of the pyramid. They have no chance to develop to the higher steps of the pyramid because their time is pre-occupied with meeting survival needs. From the ranks of these thais come many thai woman looking to satisfy their survival needs, as well as their needs for love and belonging. The needs of the higher steps are not even something to dream about, let alone achieve. Enter Mr Farang. Mr Farang long ago conquered his survival needs, and has many many years of development and experience on the higher steps of the pyramid. His character was forged in leadership positions in the western industrialized world, or in the universities deemed the greatest the world has seen, or in lifelong positions in very old and stable corporate megoliths. He has been through serious relationships, and in the course of his development outgrew them, or himself was outgrown. No matter, undaunted it is thought by many that he will choose a mate from the same step of the pyramid to which he belongs. Upon wading onto the shores of thailand, Mr Farang chooses a lovely thai lady from the lowest steps of the great pyramid. Onto which step of the pyramid has Mr Farang ascended? MaiLuk [attribution: some of the maslow theory paraphrased from a paper by Dr David Gershaw] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 12, 2003 Report Share Posted December 12, 2003 >>>Onto which step of the pyramid has Mr Farang ascended?<<< of the ones who come here? i guess most have a bit of a problem in the love and belonging sector. those theories go only as far as theories go, and all those points are still only to be individually applied. practical example: a smallscale thai farmer with a bit of land, respect from his fellow farmers, a loving family might have reached the selfactualisation stage without ever owning any more than his land, a clothes and a few utilities, while a relatively wealthy person from the west might be stuck in the love and belonging stage, running forever after esteem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
think_too_mut Posted December 12, 2003 Report Share Posted December 12, 2003 >might have reached the selfactualisation stage without ever owning any more than his land, Selfactualization does not mean being happy with your life, your family, your job or all of them. It's rather about doing/investing an extra effort and/or money into things for no tangible gain. For example: skydiving, surfing, volonteering at elderly homes over weekends. Put into perspective, one hardly considers doing good things out of good heart while (s)he is out of job or money. That disadvantaged layer is where bgs are sitting at. Their thainess and appearance make farangs mistake it for something higher than that. IMO, that's the root cause of most of troubles farangs experience with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 actually, as it's a theory by an psychologist i would assume that selfactualisation has more to do with a certain inner balance and peace than with material gains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattaya127 Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 Is this the correct section? To me, my experience is that most thais, so far, are doing quite well at the 3rd level. IMO, more than many westerners, who tend to "disbelong" more than belong, as far as their families, but then again, more in US than France, so it's all very subjective. Anyway, because of that subjective aspect (what counts in life?) I pretty much disagree with the elaboration from that psychologist, and for LOS, I think esteem is as much lacking in farangs than thais, at least from what I see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dvarpala Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 MaiLuk said:5. Self Actualization 4. Esteem 3. Love and belonging 2. Safety 1. Physiological Upon wading onto the shores of thailand, Mr Farang chooses a lovely thai lady from the lowest steps of the great pyramid. Onto which step of the pyramid has Mr Farang ascended? It depends, if he "chooses" her as a GF then Mr Farang, though he would probably like to think otherwise, is ascending to step 3 ( Love and Belonging ), from whence he can then attempt the giddy heights of step 4 ( Esteem ). But if he chooses to ST / LT her, and leave it at that, then he may not be moving levels at all ! Though I suspect that, in his case, condition 3 of the Pyramid has not been totally fulfilled... :: ................. The Maslow Pyramid that I saw once on a management course ( I failed, I must add...! ) went something like this.. ( From the top, down )... 6. Self Actualization ( Being all that you can be ) 5. Personal Development 4. Self Esteem 3. Love and Belonging 2. Having a Home 1. Food & Health ...the idea being that all the lower conditions had to be satisfied before one could move on to the next higher step, and crucially, if anything on a lower step went wrong, like a failed relationship, ill health etc., the attributes on the higher levels would start to fail as well. ( The point of this being on my course was to try to understand why a good employee might suddenly start to show poor performance, and to offer help etc., rather than writing him/her off. ) Great post, really thought provoking... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soongmak Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 No matter, undaunted it is thought by many that he will choose a mate from the same step of the pyramid to which he belongs. Upon wading onto the shores of thailand, Mr Farang chooses a lovely thai lady from the lowest steps of the great pyramid. Onto which step of the pyramid has Mr Farang ascended? Mailuk, Sorry, but I don't get the point of your post. After all people are not placed in a hierarchical order, but needs are. The whole theory of Maslow is flawed if you look at it as a static model, i.e. that through your life you progress through the pyramid and at a time, you are only at one stage of that same pyramid. Rogers and Goldstein however came up with an interesting take on Maslow's pyramid and stated that self actualisation was the driving force in every person's life. So almost everybody is at one time or another involved in self actualisation. However, the more problems we have, the less time and energy we can devote to reaching our full potential. If we are hungry, are jobless or have a broken marriage, or if we have no confidence in ourselves, we may continue to survive, but it will not be as fulfilling a life as it could be. We will not be fully actualizing our potentials. I like their take on the Maslow pyramid a whole lot better, as it is more dynamic than Maslow's static Pyramid. Also, it is a much more democratic and less snobbish approach to human psychology. So do I think that we actually descend to a lower step of the pyramid when we get involved with a thai girl? No, I think it has nothing to do with it. Cheers, soongmak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lazyphil Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 wtf is this mumbo jumbo ::....have a beer its much more easy than all this carry on.......cordially Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaiLuk Posted December 14, 2003 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2003 a smallscale thai farmer with a bit of land, respect from his fellow farmers, a loving family might have reached the selfactualisation stage without ever owning any more than his land, a clothes and a few utilities, while a relatively wealthy person from the west might be stuck in the love and belonging stage, running forever after esteem. Many systems of thought (such as zen or hinduism) would agree with your example. Some would even say you need to live in poverty and starve yourself in order to 'self actualize'. One common thread seems to be that there is a progression from ignorance to enlightenment. Still wondering what level of progression mr farang is at based on his choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaiLuk Posted December 14, 2003 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2003 Fly said >> of the ones who come here? i guess most have a bit of a problem in the love and belonging sector.< dvarpala said >>if he "chooses" her as a GF then Mr Farang, though he would probably like to think otherwise, is ascending to step 3 ( Love and Belonging )<< Alot of farang come here just for sex, not love/belonging. Then you have retirees, alot of whom were married for 20 years or more and have raised kids to adults. They have a 'maturity' that goes beyond their tg's realm of experience. Their not hooking up with tgs because they had no love or sense of belonging. Something else at work here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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