Is cheating justifiable?

[soongmak]

It is obvious from your post that you are not in favour of said activities but life is not as black and white as you paint it.

Your suggestion that it is okay to spread your seed if you seek your wifes approval is just not practical for some people.

 

I am not opposed to cheating. Everybody is free to do with his life what he/she wants and I am not the one to judge you. What is mindnumbing for me is this need to sugarcoat the term in order so that the offenders can feel good about themselves.

 

Since marriage as we know it is an exclusive, monogamous relationship, when you go fuck around on your wife without her knowing it, it is certainly "cheating". And everybody has an excuse why he's doing it, and maybe a valid reason as well. Heck, I even admit it might be the wife's fault! That still doesn't mean we have to come up with a new word for it. extramarital activities just sounds ridiculous, at least to me.

 

Off course it is never "practical" to discuss your infidelities with your wife, because most likely she will not like it and may divorce you and sue you for all that you have. She'd probably get it, too. And why? Because you "cheated"on her.

[gummigut]

"But I believe that talking doesn't always resolve differences," No it doesn't, but it does let off steam and is a lot better then letting the pressure cooker build up and sex is one of the prime movers of people and a huge pressure cooker!

 

"that only applies when the 'straying' is purely a sexual act" Sex involves emotion. For men it seems much less so than for woman. Which might be part of the problem of decreasing frequency in marriage as it is much more mental for the woman. But in any event, as a guy, I find sex involves emotion even in the smallest degree. So using this as additional justification wouldn't hold for me.

 

rompan...

"not sure where self esteem fits in though..Can you explain?"

 

"Self" equating to one's self. "Esteem" is judgement or opinion. So it is one's opinion of one's self. A person who is honest with himself and others is a better person than one who is honest to himself but not to others. Thus not being honest to the person who is supposed to be closest to in life hurts one's self esteem. No big leaps of logic. Thought it was pretty clear. Obviously I was wrong.

 

"too much honesty tolls the death knell..." There's a fallacy in my opinion if I ever heard one. There's not enough honesty in the world. If everyone could be man/woman enough to be honest, we wouldn't have half the problems in the world. Now someone is going to come up with the example that you're best friend died in your arms, and his wife asks, what were his last words. Are yah going to be honest and say, "fuck it hurts", or say, "Tell my wife I love her". In all honesty, you know your best friend would want you to say the later. It doesn't negate the fact that people really should be more honest. And frankly, should start with themselves.

 

"Marriage is much more about tolerance and harmony, which may involve 'honestly'"

 

I think this statement reflects your state of mind. "May" involve honesty? Tolerance and harmony goes hand in hand with honesty. That's what communication is about. That's what marriage counselors talk about 99.99999% of the damn time. Communication. In order to communicate, you've got to be honest, because if you don't, what's the point of talking about lies?

 

"the searing stuff is best for juvenilia and therapy IMHO"

 

Now there's a point of too much information. Let's not equate this with honesty. It's incredibly important to talk about sex. To not talk about it is tantamount to stearing the boat without a rudder. Especially talking about wants and needs and fun stuff from past experience. But there's no need to talk about every single person and every single sexual act one has performed (well, unless your SO is really into that stuff).

 

"Marriage is much more about tolerance and harmony...[than honesty]" I find this is the attitude of those who have lost the magical ideal of marriage and settle for what they've got. The one's who I know who are happiest in marriage are extremely honest with one another and the work ALOT at their marriage. The reason their marriage is harmonious and that they can "tolerate" [love] each other over time is because they are honest with each other and talk a lot. Successful marriage is not about longevity, which is what tolerance without honesty is about.

 

Zaad:

"is the only way to get a mutual acceptable solution but there's no guarantee in realizing this."

 

True, but it does help to find out if you are with the person you should be with for the rest of your life.

 

<<burp>>

[Guest]

CHEATING IS UNJUSTIFIABLE! (until I get married)

 

Oneye

[gummigut]

This is such an important question:

 

"Is there anything wrong with extramarital sex?"

 

In my opinion, a resounding NO if it is understood by everyone in the marriage. Yes there are additional dangers and factors, but that goes with anything extra that one does.

 

To me there is nothing wrong with anything that consenting adults do to and with one another as long as it doesn't harm another. If a couple reach a point where outside sexual services are needed to sustain the balance in the relationship, there should be no stigma attached to it.

 

Participating in extramarital sex without disclosure is cheating. I've heard a number of guys over here talk about their thai/asian wives saying the wife "knows" but just pretends it didn't exist because that's asian culture. Horse shit!

 

<<burp>>

[the_numbers]

Dealing with cheating is a game that is played differently in different societies. A caucasian woman may know her boy is out having a shag get steaming and take the bastard to court for all the cash [an alternative in her society]

 

A Thai girl may stay because she's better off, along with her baby than getting stiffed on her on... plus dealing with the stigma of being 'damaged goods'.

 

She has little possibility of legal recourse. I know a girl in this situation right now. A sweet-sweet one who made a mistake and runs a small business on Sukhumvit's lower sois.

 

She doesn't throw pots and bloody pans at him when he comes home like the lasses you see on that dodgy American TV show cops either because she doesn't want to leave.

 

Gummigut - I hear you about the 'asian cliche'. I've heard it waxed philosophical about b4 particularly by the sagely types who sit on all Nana barstools Its orientalism plain and simple to treat it that way. Not to mention obnoxious.

 

However, there are some differences that have to do with the legal issues that I think may define behaviour in this society.

 

I have certainly seen those at work.

 

the_numbers

[cardinalblue]

Wow, I think the opposite. Cheating which i call sustainability actually maintains my current GF relationship. If not, I would break it off.

 

Now if being married, I wouldn't practice sustainability (i.e. cheating) so maybe that is why I haven't yet been married? Marriage has to be all everything which another partner just can't offer in my eyes....

 

Is having paid sex only outside of your relationship more justifiable compared to having an affair?

 

Cardinalblue

[soongmak]

Cheating which i call sustainability

 

I never heard that one before. Can you explain this term to me, because I never thought this word has anything to do with cheating.

 

Thanks!

[MrX]

you obviously have strong views on what constitutes cheating and the nature of a "good" marriage.....

 

Concerning those parts of your post which were addressed to things that I had written...

 

Thank you for explaining your how self esteem is based on honesty in your view... forgive my previous obtuseness.... I had always thought self esteem might be based on many things eg sexual prowess, successfully fooling the public or whatever!

 

you wrote: "too much honesty tolls the death knell..." There's a fallacy in my opinion if I ever heard one. There's not enough honesty in the world. "

 

what you quote of mine ("too much honesty tolls the death knell) was restricted to marriage specifically.

Honesty and the world is not a joust I would appear at!

 

""Marriage is much more about tolerance and harmony, which may involve 'honestly'"....I think this statement reflects your state of mind'

 

Here you effectively misquote me by omission.... The original finished " may involve "honestly" not entering certain private spaces of the other ( or words to that effect) so what follows when you write about my state of mind is conjecture based on something I didnt intend.....

 

 

"Marriage is much more about tolerance and harmony...[than honesty]" I find this is the attitude of those who have lost the magical ideal of marriage and settle for what they've got. The one's who I know who are happiest in marriage are extremely honest with one another and the work ALOT at their marriage. The reason their marriage is harmonious and that they can "tolerate" [love] each other over time is because they are honest with each other and talk a lot. Successful marriage is not about longevity, which is what tolerance without honesty is about."

 

I find this interesting...but how many do you know who are happy..or for that matter how many marriages do you know at all?...In my experience marriages are often rather private things and diificult for outsiders to understand..but then again maybe you have the good fortune of many special intimacies...

 

 

Finally isnt successful marriage exactly about longevity?..isnt it predicated on "til death do us part" Or do we not even have this notion in common?

[JJsushi]

Is cheating justifiable? Depends on the scenario. I will cheat in a heart beat if that is what I want to do. All that confusion of love=sex is a pile of hogwash. Love is love and sex is sex. Love can be expressed with sex but they can be mutually exclusive.

 

Now if I do cheat, I keep my trap shut and i don't go sharing it with the woman or seeking her permission. Why complicate matters even more? Bottom line is cheating is lying and if you are going to lie then lie without remorse. Don't cheat and then decide u want to come clean or confess nonsense. All your doing is sharing your self-imposed pain.

[Guest]

Cheating to me is what the person beside me was doing in Calculus class when I was in high school.

 

Cheating, in respect to how it is being used on this post, seems to be carrying distorted Christian views. I look at having more then one woman a normal 'thing'. In Judaim, the FaTHER OF JUDAISM, Moses had a Midianite wife and it speaks of him having an Ethiopian or depending on translation, a black woman for a wife also. Many Jews after Moses followed in his foot steps in that many of them had several wives. One of my favorite men of this catefory was Solomon. Some claim Islam came from a Judo/Christian culture, and I think many will agree that they believe in multiple marriages. Buddhist are acceptable to multiple wives. As for Christians, they read in there scriptures where it says a Deacon or an Elder must have only one wife. There are other places were it says a man should only have one wife. What is interesting with these expressions is you do not tell somebody they can not have something if they all ready do have it. This implies that early Christians, in some cases, had several wives. What people forget to do when reading these scriptures is to look at why such scriptures were given. If today things were as bad as they were for early Christians, I think most sane people would say you can have only one wife. In this case, the scripture fit the time period but is not necessary applicable in today's text of things.

 

In Thailand, I have come across several Thai ladies that have multiple husbands. what I find interesting is that none of the husbands seem to have a clue what their princesses may be doing.