Coss Posted September 2, 2012 Report Share Posted September 2, 2012 ROME | Sat Sep 1, 2012 3:01pm EDT (Reuters) - The former archbishop of Milan and papal candidate Cardinal Carlo Maria Martini said the Catholic Church was "200 years out of date" in his final interview before his death, published on Saturday. Martini, once favored by Vatican progressives to succeed Pope John Paul II and a prominent voice in the church until his death at the age of 85 on Friday, gave a scathing portrayal of a pompous and bureaucratic church failing to move with the times. "Our culture has aged, our churches are big and empty and the church bureaucracy rises up, our rituals and our cassocks are pompous," Martini said in the interview published in Italian daily Corriere della Sera. "The Church must admit its mistakes and begin a radical change, starting from the pope and the bishops. The pedophilia scandals oblige us to take a journey of transformation," he said in the interview. In the last decade the Church has been accused of failing to fully address a series of child abuse scandals which have undermined its status as a moral arbiter, though it has paid many millions in compensation settlements worldwide. Martini, famous for comments that the use of condoms could be acceptable in some cases, told interviewers the Church should open up to new kinds of families or risk losing its flock. "A woman is abandoned by her husband and finds a new companion to look after her and her children. A second love succeeds. If this family is discriminated against, not just the mother will be cut off but also her children." In this way "the Church loses the future generation", Martini said in the interview, made a fortnight before he died. The Vatican opposes divorce and forbids contraception in favor of fidelity within marriage and abstinence without. A liberal voice in the church, Martini's chances of becoming pope were damaged when he revealed he was suffering from a rare form of Parkinson's disease and he retired in 2002. Pope John Paul II was instead succeeded in 2005 by Pope Benedict XVI, a hero of Catholic conservatives who is known by such critical epithets as "God's rottweiler" because of his stern stand on theological issues. Martini's final message to Pope Benedict was to begin a shake up of the Catholic church without delay. "The church is 200 years out of date. Why don't we rouse ourselves? Are we afraid?" Martini was much loved and thousands paid their respects at his coffin in Milan cathedral on Saturday. http://www.reuters.c...E87U10220120901 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coss Posted September 2, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 2, 2012 Interesting that this was not published before he died, maybe they would have had to take action against him, had he published this whilst alive. And, 200 years? only 200? It is worth noting that the spread of knowledge to the masses, has an inverse proportionality, to the numbers of people who follow religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashermac Posted September 2, 2012 Report Share Posted September 2, 2012 That is still about 800 years ahead of Islam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huumlaar Posted September 2, 2012 Report Share Posted September 2, 2012 That is still about 800 years ahead of Islam. Depends, average Islam allows contraceptives, except for some loonies, then again most Xtian churches allow contraception too, so I guess I could say the same of Xtian religion. Maybe all religions are a bit nuts but the basic messages are inherent, be nice, do good, don't an arsehole? Let's bring back the old Gods! Their a lot more fun, (unless your the one getting sacrificed) (err, depending on the ritual, maybe you want to loose your virginity in a orgy devoted to Pan) Woman can marry again, so not quite sure what the Milan guy was going on about. To be totally fashion obsessed and not at all gay, for a moment though, Milan is the head of Italian fashion, I agree with everything he says, but find it BLASPHEMOUS that the Archbishop of Milan would say "and our cassocks are pompous" Didn't he see that this years Summer Milan Fashion scene ended with a THEATRICAL NOTE! http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/27/fashion/milan-mens-season-ends-with-a-sense-of-theater.html http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_RjIxzirEA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashermac Posted September 2, 2012 Report Share Posted September 2, 2012 << Woman can marry again, so not quite sure what the Milan guy was going on about. >> But not within the church, unless things have changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BelgianBoy Posted September 2, 2012 Report Share Posted September 2, 2012 << Woman can marry again, so not quite sure what the Milan guy was going on about. >> But not within the church, unless things have changed. yes you can, but quite cumbersome as needs to be approved by Rome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kamui Posted September 2, 2012 Report Share Posted September 2, 2012 Interesting that this was not published before he died, maybe they would have had to take action against him, had he published this whilst alive. And, 200 years? only 200? It is worth noting that the spread of knowledge to the masses, has an inverse proportionality, to the numbers of people who follow religion. In Europe the Catholic church is def. on the way down. The current pope is a hardcore conservative, the same as the previous pope, but without the ability to connect to the people and unable to control his administration (see so called Vatileaks). The well being of the people is not of real interest for him, as his fight against condoms in HIV ravaged countries in Africa shows. Moral purity of his flock is of higher importance. But this doesn't apply to his priests. Paedophile priest are still supported and protected by the church. In Germany we currently have the scandal of a bishop who is building a new residency (including a private chapel while the Cathedral is just 100m from his house) for 5.5 mio EUR while asking his parish to cut money and positions. Recently he flew first class to India for to take a look at projects for poor Indians... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kamui Posted September 2, 2012 Report Share Posted September 2, 2012 yes you can, but quite cumbersome as needs to be approved by Rome. 99% can't. The process can take years, you need really good knowledge of hundreds of years old church laws and you need to be well connected within the church. Annulling the first marriage is used for example by royals who need in a Catholic marriage for what ever reason. In Germany the Catholic church is one of the biggest employes. It pays low wages, is against unions and in many positions it can and will fire people who marry a second time (the funding of most of the jobs comes from the German government...). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashermac Posted September 2, 2012 Report Share Posted September 2, 2012 I thought when they chose Cardinal Rapsinger, they expected he wouldn't be around that many years and would be sort of an interim Pope before someone more liberal. He's still here after 7 years though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BelgianBoy Posted September 2, 2012 Report Share Posted September 2, 2012 99% can't. The process can take years, you need really good knowledge of hundreds of years old church laws and you need to be well connected within the church. Annulling the first marriage is used for example by royals who need in a Catholic marriage for what ever reason. but you can. thats the whole point. ex brother in law did it over 25 years ago, was easy to do, but took over 2 years. and remarried as a virgin BB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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