Anti-foreigner sentiment runs high

[shygye]

JJ,

 

We were talking about immigrants in the USA. Look, you can be born on German soil. Grow up in Germany and be denied citizenship.

 

 

 

Stay in the US for 5 years, pass a simple test, and you are a citizen. Contrast that with Germany or Thailand and tell me which country makes it easy.

 

 

 

Fly,

 

 

 

The simple answer is the demand for visas is much larger than the supply of visas. Plus there is a preference for family unification, bringing over parents or brothers or sisters, etc.

 

 

 

I think it was about 15 years ago that most of the illegal Mexicans at that time were given legal status to stay and work and obtain citizenship.

[pattaya127]

IMO, USA and Thailand are 2 different countries. All i see is that there are very few farangs working in LOS having been forced to accept the assignment. Not in reponse to you, but one can argue that Thailand is more unfair to foreigners than USA and European countries undefinitely, but then all i have to say is: doesn't anyone enjoy himself better in LOS than in The USA? Why do people want to work or start a business in LOS? Because of the pro-farang climate and great opprtunities for a hard-working individual? Who are we kidding?people who have come to stay in thailand, any decade, have acknowledged in very little time, the downsides of it, and assumed there would be unknowns problems to be dealt with along the path. Either one makes it part of a new life experience or one can whine "look what they did to us/me!" forever.

[Grabii]

ShyGye

 

 

 

The hard part is getting an immigration visa.

 

 

 

It's not exactly easy to get an immigration visa for Thailand, either.

 

 

 

Preferences are given to certain occupations, like nursing,

 

 

 

Same as Thailand. There are preferences given to occupations where the natives are in short supply, and roadblocks to occupations where the natives are numerous.

 

 

 

and for family unification.

 

 

 

Being the spouse of a Thai citizen qualifies one for an immigrant visa in Thailand, also.

 

 

 

Once in they can get a green card and can work in most any profession.

 

 

 

This I will agree is a significant difference between the US and Thailand, a difference where the US is quite liberal. Being a Permanent Resident of the US is almost as good as being a citizen if one does not care about the righ to vote. And although becoming a Permanent Resident of the US isn't easy, I understand that it is easier than getting permanent residency in Thailand.

 

 

 

A lot of people that come in on student visas, stay and can change their status while in the US. A lot of nurses have come over to the US from the PI.

 

 

 

Depends on the occupation, already addressed that issue.

 

 

 

Regards, JEff

[Guest]

Good summary. I agree with most of what you say, but a few clarifications.

 

 

 

Overall, I think it is harder to get an immigration Visa to Thailand than to the U.S. You are correct that: "being the spouse of a Thai citizen qualifies one for an immigrant visa in Thailand," but there is a big difference between the U.S. and Thailand.

 

 

 

In the U.S., if the marriage is bona fide, you will get an immigration visa and a green card, which allows you to work. Not necessarily so in Thailand. Permanent Residency is still at the discretion of an Immigration Department commitee.

 

In reply to:

---

Once in they can get a green card and can work in most any profession.

 

 

 

This I will agree is a significant difference between the US and Thailand, a difference where the US is quite liberal.

---

 

True, and the difference goes further than that. In the U.S., if you have permanent residency (a green card), you are allowed to work. Not so in Thailand. You have to separately qualify each year for a work permit, and as the article above illustrates, the rules for issuing work permits can change. In other words, you can have the right to permanently live here, but not the right to work at all. I know two people who have fallen into this crack. I have also attended Foriegn Chambers of Commerce meetings where complaints about this anamoly have been aired.

 

 

 

It is an odd system since if someone lives here you would think the government would want them to be able to work to support themselves and their family. That is certainly the attitude in the U.S. Not so in Thailand.

 

 

[pattaya127]

That is certainly the attitude in the U.S. Not so in Thailand.

 

-----------------------------------

 

Yep. 2 different countries. Which one do you like best NOW?

[Guest]

Pattaya127,

 

 

 

Please don't take offense, but this is not a Thailand vs. the U.S. (or anywhere else) issue. It is a question of proposed changes in Thai law that: (a) demonstrate that at least some Thais have a very negative view of farangs working in Thailand, ( will unfairly wipe out legitimate, small foreign business owners, and © is harmful to the Thai economy as a whole. A criticism of a Thai law, or in this case a proposed new law, a Thai policy or even various aspects of Thai culture, is not an attack on Thais or Thailand as a whole. It is not a question of where you would rather live or whether Thais are good or bad people? I mention the latter specifically because I seem to recall a thread with that precise heading, which was seriously intended to be a response to comments made in other threads about specific issues of Thai culture and policy. Seriously, no offense intended, but anyone who views the discussion in such simplistic terms is missing the point.

 

 

[Guest]

are you telling us now the perimeters of what is allowed here in that thread and not? anything not fitting in your viewpoint is "simplistic" and "misses the point"?

 

 

 

>It is not a question of where would you rather live or whether Thais are good or bad people?<

 

 

 

sorry, but those factors do fall in the equasion here, obviously not in the simplistic terms you put them here, but in a wider range of interdependency.

 

the points i have made about misbehaving farang you so conveniently ignored are at least part of the whole problem.

 

 

 

 

 

>A criticism of a Thai law, or in this case a proposed new law, a Thai policy or even various aspects of Thai culture, is not an attack on Thais or Thailand as a whole<

 

 

 

excuse me again, not in that discussion here right now, but in many others you so much like to post your viewpoints concerning the "unusual suicides", where you automatically deem every farang suicide as "suspicious", even though, if i may guess so, you have never ever been at any crime scene investigation, and another poster points out to you that some of your suspicions are not justified, you either ignore, or accuse the poster, me in that case, as a lyer, i do summarise your attitude of those threads and the one here as rather pompous, patronising and insulting, not only towards thai society, but as well as to other farang living here.

 

don't you think that thais start having enough of farang trying to tell them how they should run their country?

 

 

 

and, we having a saying, i think to recall, the one about the glasshouse and the stones...

 

as long as our countries are far from perfect, it is a bit funny to demand things from thailand, which we, much richer and more modern, have not fully solvet yet as well.

 

 

 

and, thailand has a few way more urgent problems to solve than some laws concerning the expat population, as thai people have way more serious problems. but i guess those problems you won't see from your office window.

 

 

 

 

[Guest]

Do you have, like, a permanent chip on your shoulder? My comments weren?t even directed to you.

 

 

 

And what is with the repeated references to: ?crime scene investigations? ?unusual suicides??? This is a thread about proposed changes in work permit rules . Although you direct insults at me in your rant, I haven?t a clue what you are talking about. Even the comments that seem to relate to this thread (?wider range of interdependency? ? what the hell does that mean?) don?t make any sense.

 

 

 

I have a suggestion: you ignore my posts, and I will ignore yours. For my part, I don't intend to respond further since I am not going to waste time trying to respond to rambling, insulting rants that simply don't make any sense.

[pattaya127]

the discussion in such simplistic terms

 

----------------------------------

 

I just asked you a question, that's all. As for the discussion itself, I never denied it was hard to do business in Thailand, just that as long as you want to apply rational thinking in the highly uncertain context of a 3rd world country, you will make a lot of clever sense, but you will miss the point, not me. It may be different in 10 or 15 years, but brace yourself, for now it is still: TIT out there. If thailand wanted to be a highly efficient, logical capitalist economy, it would have to think "a la Singapore" and not be what it is now. But hey, Vive la "not so simplistic" difference!

 

 

 

 

[Guest]

Fair enough. Perhaps I shouldn?t have singled out your post to make the point (as you obviously do get 'it'), but I find it disturbing that when someone here criticizes or questions a local practice or law, the response from some quarters tends to be cast in antagonistic black-and-white terms of pro-Thai vs. anti-Thai. Having read your last post, I think you understand the problem and will agree that casting the issue in such terms is misleading and simplistic.