Ashman Posted August 16, 2001 Report Share Posted August 16, 2001 Does the new curfew on the Bangkok night scene go as far as Saphan Kwai? If not why doesn't everyone relocate. That would be hilarious, I can see it now, scores of farangs pouring into the bars in this area. Just an unrealistic thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattaya127 Posted August 16, 2001 Report Share Posted August 16, 2001 quote: Originally posted by Alexander Turner: Sorry to skip back to the beginning a bit but I've just been reading this thread and enjoying it. I recently (well not that recently) got into a thread at The Nation's discussion board and got into correspondance with a middle class Thai lady about prostitution in Thailand. I can't comment with any authority or accuracy on the economic realities affecting Thai people but as a result of this correspondance and meetings with well off Thais in the UK I do understand why there might be larger forces than economics involved here. At the moment Thailand is a country and a culture stepping up the ladder of respectability. At the time I first became aware of Thailand the towns of the UK were not filled with Thai restaurants and Thai goods had no particular marquee value. The average guy in the street probably thought it was still called Siam. Now despite having real social problems, poverty and illiteracy Thailand is starting to be a country that has a respected culture and Thais, about the most nationally proud people you can meet, find the idea that some still view it as a brothel very upsetting. Beyond upsetting. They see it as a national embarrassment. From what I understand the existence of prostitution is not what bothers them. It is the profile it has. I got into a friendly quarrel pointing out that the option of work in a bar was perhaps the only real chance women born into poverty had to better themselves. The response was that by "bettering themselves" financially they were ruining themselves and their country. The truth is I don't think the average Thai would give a monkey's if tourists were slipping away, going to brothels and massage parlours and not announcing the fact. What causes the problem is the very obvious and high profile nature of the sex industry. This is what has endured crackdown after crackdown. And though the lady I communicated with this on the most never said as much, I got the impression that the real issue was a matter of face and reputation. If Thaksin closed down Nana Plaza it would probably improve his standing with middle class Thais. It would be great public relations for him. Of course, while no-one is likely to publicly admit it, I think such an action taken would damage the Thai economy in subtle ways not naturally connected to the tourist industry. Why would a Western business choose to invest it's resources in Thailand when those resources might be better spent in one of the republics of the former Soviet Union ? Perhaps the fact Thailand is a nicer place to visit has an economic impact in many ways, and that face losing bar scene does kind of make Thailand a nicer place for a good deal of businessmen and investors. Of course I'm just guessing. I'm sure large company executives would never go to the Nana... THis is exactly what seems to be going on. Thailand is coming of age in a world where big stains on the face of a country cannot be ignored. I know that 1 milliom men+ think it is not a stain, but that is not enough to shift the balance in favor of sanook sex vs "respectability".The difference is that 10 years ago, the thai middle-class as a large and influential force was only being created, but now it can put its weight on things for a lot more than just economics. Which brings to smile at the posts that seem so concerned about the thai economy, as if it was really what they care about, rather than losing the privilege to party freely and as late as possible. can I say it again: it is not our country. And a country is also more than just economics. I know enough thais over here to know that they are quite bothered about the constant image of Thailand as a sex destination. being thai, they do not always voice it, or publicize their feelings, but none the less, they mind. It is not uncommon to hear of a thai woman ashamed to say she is thai for fear of attracting a certain kind of glance reflecting the prejudice that all thai women are prostitutes and came here after "marrying a wallet". Now,of course, the contradiction is that thais feel very nationalistic, but have refused to really work at the problem while acquiring middle- class wealth instead of generalizing accession to a better education for the poorest. And we truly don't know if they are serious about doing something as a nation or just implementing cosmetic or mediatic solutions like police raids and closing times until the next big tourist season. Anyone having a hint this is for the long run? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2001 Report Share Posted August 16, 2001 See seperate post in General Discussion about what happended at Lumphini today. I have a lot more information but am confirming tomorrow. Absolutely no idea what has hapened at Saphan Kwai....Have you ever been there? Farnags not welcome...yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elation Posted August 16, 2001 Report Share Posted August 16, 2001 Could it be that the Farang (American/European) oriented sex scene is the primary target because it has the most visibility in terms of the Media and the Internet? Like wildfire, it is difficult to contain a sterotype if allowed to go unchecked. I would bet that the economic benefit from the loss of Farang only dollars would be less painful, knowing that the void would be filled with other visitors that are more discrete in "touting" about how great this scene really is. At the same time, Thailand would gain much needed "respectability" as the Western Media Machine (the most powerful on the planet" is reporting how the government is taking such strong measures. As for expats, they are living in Thailand because its cheap...not necessarily all that great a contribution to the economy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BkkShaggy Posted August 16, 2001 Report Share Posted August 16, 2001 quote: Originally posted by shygye: Where do you get your numbers from that millions of tourists decide not to go to Thailand due to the sex scene? I have not met anyone that said this is the reason they do not visit Thailand. The reasons I hear are the plane ticket costs too much, it takes too long to get there, it is too polluted, language barrier, or the water is unsafe to drink.[/QB] Well..I talked to a Dutch guy while I was in Europe and when I asked him if he would like to visit Thailand. He said because of its negative reputation, his wife and himself decided not to go there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2001 Report Share Posted August 16, 2001 quote: Originally posted by nepfan: See seperate post in General Discussion about what happended at Lumphini today. I have a lot more information but am confirming tomorrow. Absolutely no idea what has hapened at Saphan Kwai....Have you ever been there? Farnags not welcome...yet. Â i go there once a while, haven't been in a long time. but as far as i can remember the bars there always closed much earlier than the farang areas. they are also very tame compared to farang bars, no wild groping, when you enter girls wai to you, sit then nicely next to you. farang are not unwelcome in general, but if one does not speak thai it will be difficult to have a good time. also visiting farang should have certain knowledge how to behave in a thai setting, should be able to adapt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2001 Report Share Posted August 16, 2001 You may read about this in the papers tomorrow morning (or maybe not): Yesterday at midnight, a police posse locked the doors of the coffee shop in Siam Hotel and took all the women present to the police station; there were more than a hundred. After paying a fine of 500 Baht each they were set free. This is not the first time, but things seem to be heating up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashman Posted August 16, 2001 Report Share Posted August 16, 2001 I went in one go go style bar in Saphan Kwai a couple of years ago and it was the seediest place I've been in Bangkok. I drank up and made a very swift exit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattaya127 Posted August 16, 2001 Report Share Posted August 16, 2001 quote: Originally posted by Scum_Baggio: Open message to Mr./Dr.Thaksin, PM: Crack down on corruption in your country (preferably starting with yourself first!), then you may have a chance to make Thailand a prosperous country; and when that is achieved, most of the prostitutes will disappear by themselves. Everything else is a load of crap, your honour! I Rak Thai, SB. Scum my alter ego ami. been saying that for the past 15 years.but nobody listens...LOL. What are the chances Mr T logs on to Nana and reads it? re-LOL [ August 16, 2001: Message edited by: pattaya127 ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palatkik Posted August 16, 2001 Report Share Posted August 16, 2001 quote: Originally posted by Ashman: I went in one go go style bar in Saphan Kwai a couple of years ago and it was the seediest place I've been in Bangkok. I drank up and made a very swift exit. Sounds like my kind of place, I'll have to check 'em out again. Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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