lembeh Posted July 19, 2001 Report Share Posted July 19, 2001 quote: Originally posted by FlyBoy: Techincally these girls are whores (they have sex for money) and technically we are all whoremongers (we associate with whores), -FB Technically we are *not* whoremongers. The term "monger" means : to sell. Ironmonger :sells iron ware Fishmonger :sells fish whoremonger : *sells* whores -j- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 19, 2001 Report Share Posted July 19, 2001 quote: Originally posted by josh_ingu: Originally posted by FlyBoy: [qb]Techincally these girls are whores (they have sex for money) and technically we are all whoremongers (we associate with whores), -FB Technically we are *not* whoremongers. The term "monger" means : to sell. Ironmonger :sells iron ware Fishmonger :sells fish whoremonger : *sells* whores -j-[/QB] You mean everyone here doesn't sell whores? I guess I'm the only one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lembeh Posted July 19, 2001 Report Share Posted July 19, 2001 quote: Originally posted by FlyBoy: You mean everyone here doesn't sell whores? I guess I'm the only one. ..that may explain a fair bit.. -j- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lembeh Posted July 19, 2001 Report Share Posted July 19, 2001 quote: Originally posted by db_sez_aloha: Originally posted by josh_ingu: [qb]Technically we are *not* whoremongers. The term "monger" means : to sell. From Mirriam-Webster OnLine http://www.m-w.com/ : Main Entry: whore·mon·ger Pronunciation: -"m&[ng]-g&r, -"mä[ng]- Function: noun Date: 1526 : WHOREMASTER Main Entry: whore·mas·ter Pronunciation: -"mas-t&r Function: noun Date: 14th century : a man consorting with whores or given to lechery Main Entry: 1mon·ger Pronunciation: 'm&[ng]-g&r, 'mä[ng]- Function: noun Etymology: Middle English mongere, from Old English mangere, from Latin mangon-, mango, of Greek origin; akin to Greek manganon charm, philter Date: before 12th century 1 : BROKER, DEALER -- usually used in combination <alemonger> 2 : a person who attempts to stir up or spread something that is usually petty or discreditable -- usually used in combination <warmonger> db[/QB] Exactly. A broker or dealer. One who buys and sells *as an item*....unless I asm greatly mistaken none of us here *buy* the girls.. -j- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 19, 2001 Report Share Posted July 19, 2001 You state the very obvious. Dan, what you call the very obvious is what i figure to be the crux of the whole argument: person who provides sex for money = prostitute = whore. Nowhere i seek a definition of the word shows me any different. It appears harsh, but in the literal sense it is irrefutable. It just astonishes me that people so entrenched and enamoured of the scene are unwilling to call it what it is. The very verb "to sanuk" used in your closing remark is a euphemism used to put a different spin on the act of contracting sex for money. IMHO all these terms are just words and I don't give a toss who uses them. It's the attitude that counts. Treat them like trash and they will treat you like trash, a human reaction. Treat them nice and you might be surprised. These girls (with the odd-exception) deserve respect for what they do. Agree or not? In the sense that they are living, breathing, feeling people, they deserve respect, even kindness. But they do not deserve respect on the basis of the job they do. As someone on this board said, it is the girls with the same background who do not choose to lie down to make money that deserve the real respect. Whether i believe it is right or wrong (and i do believe both) there are other options, albeit not as lucrative or, at first, so seemingly easy. This is also not to say that i do not recoginise the shades of grey in which the issue is bathed: the university student who "needs" a mobile phone, the professional girlfriend, the bangkok bank teller supplementing her income, or the nana vet wrapped around a brass pole - all deserve respect certainly , but they have all given something up and they have given it for money. That cannot be denied, irrespective of what use they put their (very)hard earned dollars to. I would not call any woman a whore without extreme provocation and, even then, probably not at all. But my point is academic. That is what they are. Yes, there are a thousand words for snow in the Inuit language, but they are all - and i defy you to to find me an Inuit to disagree with me - snow. I don't have to convince myself of anything. For me it's very healthy (and fun!) and it never was innocent. Also, I have no illusion of taxi fares to 'alleviate squeamishness' with my involvelment in this 'game'. I am a happy player, and I'm sure I'm not the only one. Unfortunately, it wasn't your health that concerned me. It is the health (in particular mental) of the individuals you contract that i was referring to. As for the "I'm not the only one" remark why even bother with it? Whether these women are at all affected by the label whore is completely inconsequential in terms of the damage the lifestyle causes. yes we have all enjoyed thai whores, although i have tired of the game. the truth be told i find it depressing. There is little new under the sun in Thailand's night scene and after a few years the kid in a candy store appeal just dissipates. also stated that you have.. "..no disrespect intended to anyone trying to make a buck" Well...So maybe if we all try and show a little respect, starting with a more respectable term than 'whores', then there would be none of your 'squeamishess to alleviate, none of your 'denial' to face, and none of your 'unhealthy' feelings about the situation. Can you truly tell me that the life style is beneficial to these women in any sense beyond the financial? If your answer is no, then where is the "respect" you speak of? Respect is demonstrated through action, not in arguing sematics or even applying cute labels to stark realities. No one (or very few) who have lived in Bangkok are untouched by the scene, punters and girls alike. To quote the movie 8mm: You dance with the devil, the devil don't change. The devil changes you" Either way, i must say, i respect the girls infinitely more than the punters who travel thousands of miles to see them. Especially those who wouldn't be caught dead with a 'whore' at home. I would also like to say that i don't really have any strong feelings in this matter, but the longer i live in Thailand the more i see people's perceptions becoming skewed and distorted. I am not endorsing western or christian morality, nor am i saying that sleeping with a bargirl is immoral. I am simply asking where is the joy in repeatedly pulling a girls off the stage to take them home (or better yet to a hotel room) to fuck them silly, pay them and be done with it. It all seems rather hollow to me. yes gents i am playing devil's advocate but there are so few here who do. i am also getting way off topic so cheers, bkk_nsr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lembeh Posted July 19, 2001 Report Share Posted July 19, 2001 quote: Originally posted by bkk_nsr: You state the very obvious. Dan, what you call the very obvious is what i figure to be the crux of the whole argument: person who provides sex for money = prostitute = whore. bkk_nsr Chinese citizen=chinaman=***** Afro-American=coloured=****** Cuacasian=white=******* Differently abled=handicapped=****** This arguement is nonsense. We are *all* aware that words can have significant emotional weighting. Mostly however, it is the user of the word who shows much, much more about himself than about the target of the word. Just reading the posts shows that the inveterate "whore" users display a hard, uncharitable outlook on the other board members as well as on life in general. If I was to share a beer with some one off the board, I would much rather it was with someone who though of them as b/g's than some one who delights in the usage of the term "whore".... -j- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 19, 2001 Report Share Posted July 19, 2001 Reply to Josh Ingu: Very well articulated. Words and "how" and "when" and "which context" they're used are extremely important. It's the nature of human verbal communication. Sensitive, polite, and considerate people realize "whore" is in the dictionary and fully understand its definition, but refrain from using it because of its insensitive, impolite, and inconsiderate connotation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sukhumvit Posted July 20, 2001 Report Share Posted July 20, 2001 quote: Originally posted by bkk_nsr: You state the very obvious. Either way, i must say, i respect the girls infinitely more than the punters who travel thousands of miles to see them. Especially those who wouldn't be caught dead with a 'whore' at home. You've made a lot of interesting, sensible comments. You mentioned that whatever the girl is called doesn't affect her half so much as the damage done to her by her actual occupation. I agree. Then again, a later poster who said something along the lines that guys who continually refer to the bgs as WHORES may be saying more about themselves than the chicks also has a point. With regard to the above quote, I think that it's a bit flippant. Okay, that may be your view but it seems to be a bit silly. It is as if you are saying that you will not make judgments about the ladies involved in the scene but will make judgments about the guys that partake. Why? Why do you have more respect for one group above the other? I've seen handicapped guys, dwarves, chronically obese guys, extremely ugly men in Pattaya. These blokes would have little or no chance of getting laid back home. But with a bar girl who may not be so discriminating the bloke gets a chance at normality, as the rest of "perfect" society knows it. You can look down on particular punters and think that they are sad fuckers if you wish but they equally have reasons. Divorce, failed relationships etc. The list is endless. In the UK we don't have an easily accessible go go/bar scene. It just isn't on the agenda. The few lap dancing clubs that there are do not end up in the same sort of sanuk as in LOS. Prostitution is rife throughout the country, as most countries, but it is not as blatant or seemingly acceptable as in LOS. Besides British street hookers make the worst Sukhumvit Katoey look delightful. I've told people in the UK about the bar scene in LOS. People who have had no experience of it and they are repulsed. They imagine that it's all about underage girls chained to beds. I've even had a guy who was formerly a heroin dealer & user give me and a friend a lecture on morality. (perhaps 'cos he was with his wife at the time.) If there was a bar scene in the UK which was similar to LOS I'd be there. There isn't. Simple as that. I know that people here wouldn't respect me for patronising courtesans and quite frankly I don't give a damn. Adult prostitution is mostly about choice. I accept that there are certain individuals who were coerced into it that couldn't break out of the vicious circle but what percentage are they in the farang scene? bkk_nsr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sukhumvit Posted July 20, 2001 Report Share Posted July 20, 2001 Originally posted by Sukhumvit: Originally posted by bkk_nsr: [qb]You state the very obvious. Either way, i must say, i respect the girls infinitely more than the punters who travel thousands of miles to see them. Especially those who wouldn't be caught dead with a 'whore' at home. bkk_nsr [/QB] You've made a lot of interesting, sensible comments. You mentioned that whatever the girl is called doesn't affect her half so much as the damage done to her by her actual occupation. I agree. Then again, a later poster who said something along the lines that guys who continually refer to the bgs as WHORES may be saying more about themselves than the chicks also has a point. With regard to the above quote, I think that it's a bit flippant. Okay, that may be your view but it seems to be a bit silly. It is as if you are saying that you will not make judgments about the ladies involved in the scene but will make judgments about the guys that partake. Why? Why do you have more respect for one group above the other? I've seen handicapped guys, dwarves, chronically obese guys, extremely ugly men in Pattaya. These blokes would have little or no chance of getting laid back home. But with a bar girl who may not be so discriminating the bloke gets a chance at normality, as the rest of "perfect" society knows it. You can look down on particular punters and think that they are sad fuckers if you wish but they equally have reasons. Divorce, failed relationships etc. The list is endless. In the UK we don't have an easily accessible go go/bar scene. It just isn't on the agenda. The few lap dancing clubs that there are do not end up in the same sort of sanuk as in LOS. Prostitution is rife throughout the country, as most countries, but it is not as blatant or seemingly acceptable as in LOS. Besides British street hookers make the worst Sukhumvit Katoey look delightful. I've told people in the UK about the bar scene in LOS. People who have had no experience of it and they are repulsed. They imagine that it's all about underage girls chained to beds. I've even had a guy who was formerly a heroin dealer & user give me and a friend a lecture on morality. (perhaps 'cos he was with his wife at the time.) If there was a bar scene in the UK which was similar to LOS I'd be there. There isn't. Simple as that. I know that people here wouldn't respect me for patronising courtesans and quite frankly I don't give a damn. Adult prostitution is mostly about choice. I accept that there are certain individuals who were coerced into it that couldn't break out of the vicious circle but what percentage are they in the farang scene? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grabii Posted July 20, 2001 Report Share Posted July 20, 2001 I'm wondering... If bargirls = prostitutes = whores, and we're gonna call 'em what they are, then sanuk'ers = ? Call 'em what they are, guys, it works both ways. Regards, JEff quote: Originally posted by Simon Hughes: Don`t call them whores` Well what are they then ? Here in the USA we call them ho`s cos thats what they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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