Profoundly Superficial

[Chillers]

I've just been reading a Stickman submission entitled "BG102 â?? Caveat Lector (Circles)". The submission describes 5 distinct levels (circles) of Thai social interactions. These are (loosely):

 

1. Immediate Family

2. Extended Family

3. Thai brother in laws, sister in laws, etc.

4. Workmates

5. Everyone else

 

According to the submission a Thai girl cares more about 1 than 2, more about 2 than 3, etc.

the author then goes on to say that husbands generally fit into circle 3. Actually, there have been quite a few submissions that say similar stuff.

 

Ok - so I have something to say about these submissions...

 

I find them PROFOUNDLY SUPERFICIAL and insulting. They assume a level of Thai intellect that is animalistic and subhuman. They assume an almost single minded simplistic "rip off" mentality and deny that real love exists in Thai society.

 

The author(s) seriously think:

 

Oh no - none of that silly "I would die for you" crap for those crafty Thai girls. Sure They'll be nice and maybe even a little caring but in the end Mum, Dad, Grandma, and Aunty Noi are more important than the sweet ATM farang hubby

 

Well authors, you guys are welcome to your empty, vacuous, one-way lust driven relationships but you can keep your sweeping generalizations.

 

I'm far from being a love doctor but I do know one thing for certain. What follows is a variation on a universal truth that has no cultural boundaries:

 

If you are in a long term relationship and not in circle one then she is not in love with you.

 

Ok - and if you arenâ??t in circle one then you are being fuckin' played.

[..]

Bravo. Well said!

 

But prepare for many flames from the guys who cannot/will not accept that truth!

 

Rationalizations: more important to health than sex. Ever go a week without a rationalization? (thanks to the movie: The Big Chill).

 

Cheers,

SD

[Guest]

I agree with your post 100%....and that's from experience....i am circle 1...if i wasn't then there would be no relationship happening...sure the family thing is important but so am i! My GF places me above all others, as shown by her actions, i do likewise. End of.

 

Again i'm reminded that most farang do not ever experience a relationship with a 'normal' thai lady....why do they settle for less????

[playtheblues]

The whole concept of the Stickman and similar sites is based on a greatly exaggerated perception of some sort of collective difference between "them" (the Thais) and "us" (the farangs).

 

I don´t identify myself with "farangs" as a group. I only see individuals. I might feel closer to individual Thai (or eskimo) A than German B, but closer to German B than Italian C and so on.

 

Some times I worry that sites like the Stickman one create unnecessary frictions between groups of people.

[Stickman]

That article was written by one writer and is not necessarily representative of other views found on the site, or other writers to the site. Do discuss it at length and analyse it, disagree with it, whatever. But please, do not suggest that everyone who has written for the site feels the same way and that one story and its viewpoint are sdhared by all who contribute to, or read the site.

 

It would be sort of like someone on here saying all of the people here are whoremongers, when in fact quite clerarly they are not.

 

Stick

[MaiLuk]

I don´t identify myself with "farangs" as a group. I only see individuals.

 

 

How do the thais see it?

[playtheblues]

"The Thais" again...which one of them?

 

Maybe we are talking about difffent layers of perceiving others.

On one collective level a Thai person might perceive a farang as repreresentative for a group. But on another level he might judge him as an individual subject in his own right.

 

The goup approach is static, the individual approach is dynamic and unlimited. Which aspect is the more relevant and interesting to us - the category "princes of Denmark" or the individual Hamlet with his astonishing development from the the first act ro the mass slaughter in the fifth? An absurd example, I agree, but just to highlite my point of view.

 

But of course, social antropology, including the study of Thai national traits, has it own merits, only that diffences tend to be exaggerated in web sites discussions.

 

Stickman, my impression after some reading is that most submissions to your site focus on perceived and in my view exaggerated differences between the group of Thais ("them") and group of farangs ("us) and tend to exaggerate the relevance of those differences in human interaction.

 

However, it is beyond my capacity to discuss each submission as such so maybe I should shut up since I cannot prove my point.

 

So I shut up.

[MaiLuk]

>>On one collective level a Thai person might perceive a farang as repreresentative for a group. But on another level he might judge him as an individual subject in his own right.<<

 

Granted we are talking in generalities, but are you sure about this? Lets say a thai has never personally met a farang. Lives in a village. Might have a village/tribal type of outlook that sees "us" and "them". Outsiders are them. Not trying to draw a big conclusion here, more like i'm just rambling. I'm good at that :smirk:

 

[drogon]

As humans we all make (some more often than others)

broad generalisations.

 

We have to categorize things.

(sociology and ethnology agree about that, they just fight over to which extent)

 

I can agree that some thais have to make broad statements about farangs (we do the same when talking about thais or thai culture)

 

But from my own limited experience:

My lady (and some of u know that I spoke a lot about how I was mad on this board)

 

Has no close family member, not one.

 

She takes care of her mother and that is all.

(put that on the cultural issue)

 

She left the bar to live with me.

Sure it is a kind of dependance in a certain way, she gives up her beloved independence to stop working in a job she hates but she has to rely on me for some things (support for her studies etc..)

 

She considers me as reliable enough and loves me enough to decide I am her number one priority.

(and God or Buddha knows that with her qualities she has the mean to find a "more healthy man etc..

in the market")

 

Sure, money plays a part in the relation (could someone give me a relation without the materialistic issue at some point? And do not quote Shakespeare's Romeo & Juliet please)

as I will support her for some time although indirectly.

 

So what are her priorities?

Of course she comes first (I do not believed in someone totally dedicated to others) with her needs etc...

After that, this is me.

So maybe some thais (and not only them) will put the family and even the soi dogs as their main priorities and you (the farang) will be last on the list but some do not think like that.

 

Why these theories about "circles", some people

(not only thais) will place their family high on the priority list (and I admit thai culture may

encourage this behavior) but please they are not all the same......

 

Painting people of a country with the same brush

is utterly stupid.

[panadolsandwich]

I think the article is basically saying that you are excluded, *forever* from Thai culture; by nature of being a foreigner.

 

Circle 3 at best, maybe 2 (if we are really lucky) is all we can accept; whilst the marrying Thai male ascends to number 1, naturally being Thai.

 

It offends Western minds to think that your wife doesn't consider you circle 1.

 

I'm not in any position to comment on the accuracy of the comments by the article's author. But if they do happen to be accurate then I don't think I could comprimise and live under those terms. It's the 'thin edge of the wedge' so to speak.

 

Nice oxymoron btw, profoundly superficial, deeply shallow.

 

Perhaps, perhaps...