Fidel Calls it a Day

[drogon]

Not talking about US.

 

Only time I went to Cuba was for visiting a friend living there and I ended up playing the sex tourist (was prior 2001)

 

I never (even in Asia) butterflied so much for so low prices.......by prices I mean that it was really nothing.

 

Unfortunately, I also witnessed the fact that more than a few pedos understood that it was a golden mine.

 

Health care? Yeah sure they were free and dental care were so good that some girls gladly accepted (in addition to some dollars) colgate toothpaste coming straight from the US........

Except in Russia/Ukraina I have never been in a country where (almost) every girl was available and if you did not fancy going with them they suggested their sisters might be more to your taste.

Even in Africa I never witnessed such a poverty and eagerness (on the part of the female population) to bed you just for a few bucks.

(and as usual I was overpaying)

Even in Cambodia back to the years 2002 you could not walk straight to a woman in the street and ask her how much (especially Cambodian women).

But in Cuba, what to expect from a country which had been known for its rhum and sugar cane and that had by the end of the Soviet era to import sugar just to be able to buy more weapons...

 

Batista was certainly an ass$$$ dictator but Castro was not better.......(except at being a better orator and dictator)

[Steve]

So, there was no good that Castro did at all? As the saying goes, Mussolini at least got the trains to run on time (and took a lot of power away from the mafia).

I'm not saying Castro was a saint, far from it. But he did do some good things for the people. And we have to share some culpability with the situation down there due to the embargo. All I am saying is that the best way to change things for the people is to engage Castro. Its not even an option to be explored because of a Florida voting block.

Nixon went to China after all with its dodgy human rights record (which still continues).

Lets address the reasons why we don't talk to Cuba. Its not based on Castro being evil incarnate but voters in Florida which is no way to run a foreign policy.

No one comments on the hyporcracy of maintaining good relations with a country like Saudi Arabia which has done far more than Castro ever did in undermining the U.S. economy and domestic safety.

 

[rogueyam]

No one comments on the hyporcracy of maintaining good relations with a country like Saudi Arabia which has done far more than Castro ever did in undermining the U.S. economy and domestic safety.

 

Dude! The only thing more tedious than a guy spouting off shopworn leftist boilerplate is the guy who says "Nobody ever talks about..." and then goes on to repeat some bit of leftist dogma that evey experienced person has heard scores of times.

 

[Guest lazyphil]

did you know the landed gentry mistreated english peasants too?did you know the upper class law courts sent peasants to a penal colony that is Australia for stealing bread to feed hungry children?â?¦.my point is, yes, what happened in the irish republic was cruel but it was not much better over here in someways, its over,its history, in the same vein the mistreatment of native Americans and land theft by irish (and others of course) migrants cant be undone now â?¦. but it irks the hell out of me phoney â??irish americansâ?? sticking their snouts in business that doesnâ??t concern them but you turn a blind eye it seems to semi state usa sponsored uk mainland terrorism buy a country you despise because it suits your agenda, have you considered so called state sponsored murder and terrorism committed by the usa in Pakistan or wherever suits another persons agenda?..... ok its old ground Iâ??m covering but hey you are guilty of certain mantras too :smirk:

 

 

[Guest lazyphil]

cuba/castro was different, its 90 miles from florida and castro did try to import nuclear weapons from russia to point at america

[Steve]

...Dude, so is the guy who actually agrees with some things but refuses to admit it just to argue.

Castro is bad.

Where do we disagree on this?

 

And me a leftist? LOL..you MUST be new to this forum.

 

 

[Steve]

[

There is a fundamental, qualitative difference between a constitutional republic and a communist dictatorship. All humans are flawed and all human systems are imperfect but Castro was a murderer and a tyrant and a liar in ways that are qualitatively different from the shortcomings of any American President in history. To ignore this is to embrace evil.

 

So a constitutional republic can't have leaders that sanction murder, be tyrannical or lie?

 

Again, Castro is bad. What I'm debating is what is best for the people of Cuba who can't leave their own country or determine their own lives. If engaging Castro is 'embracing evil' in your opinion so be it. We want the same thing (liberating the people of Cuba), we just disagree on the means. Your method hasn't worked in well over 40 years. Doesn't common sense dictate looking at alternatives? Do you or do you not concede that our foreign policy towards Cuba is dictated at least in part by Cuban American voters in Florida? Foreign policy should be based on its own merit and not if it can win you the white house.

 

The Cuban missille crisis was due in part to America trying to invade Cuba in the Bay of Pigs incident and Castro trying to avoid being invaded again. Yes, he is evil and yes, we did the right thing by forcing their removals but the planned invasion initiated the other.

 

 

[chuckwoww]

Careful there Steve. Next you'll be saying 911 was related to US policy in the Middle East.

[rogueyam]

1. So a constitutional republic can't have leaders that sanction murder, be tyrannical or lie?

 

A leader of a constitutional republic can be as bad a person as might exist anywhere but his range of action is constrained by design. Our founders assumed the worst reagarding human nature and designed institutions with this in mind. Castro took an entirely different approach. Whatever our chief executives have done, for over 200 years we have enjoyed co-equal legislatures and judges, freedom for the electorate to associate and communicate as they chose, and regular, fair elections.

 

2. What I'm debating is what is best for the people of Cuba who can't leave their own country or determine their own lives.

 

The Cubans need freedom. Nothing else substitutes for this.

 

3. If engaging Castro is 'embracing evil' in your opinion so be it.

 

I said nothing of the sort. Get in the game here.

 

4. We want the same thing (liberating the people of Cuba), we just disagree on the means.

 

I want America free and strong above all. Leftist praise of Castro is not about helping Cubans but rather about weakening America. I will have none of that.

 

5. Your method hasn't worked in well over 40 years. Doesn't common sense dictate looking at alternatives?

 

I don't know what you mean here by my method. President Bush offered years ago to lift the embargo immediately upon the Castro dictatorship instituting freedom of speech and association and holding fair elections. Castro has been in power for almost 50 years. Any number of leftist jackasses have pronounced Cuba a people's paradise. Maybe it's time to simply allow the Cubans themselves to choose. Maybe I'm simpleminded, but it seems to me that if Cuba is as wonderful as Michael Moore et al. say it is the old goat Castro ought to be able to win one little ol' election after fifty years!

 

6. Do you or do you not concede that our foreign policy towards Cuba is dictated at least in part by Cuban American voters in Florida? Foreign policy should be based on its own merit and not if it can win you the white house.

 

Our policy toward Cuba is dictated in part by the opinions of Cuban Americans. That's how democracy works. People vote their interests and concerns. If a candidate fails to attract sufficient support to win office, then he has no foreign policy worth speaking of since he has no office through which to implement it.

 

 

 

 

[Julian2]

And probably go away with it, many observers consider that after all the smoke and noise died down they were sneaked in the back door anyway.

 

The trouble with reading anyone's story is that it's always written with bias. A neutral biographer is virtually nonexistent.

 

How many refugees fleeing Castro's brutal regime actually got a call from their uncle in Miami... "Eh Pancho, I'm doing 50k of blow a week over here, get your ass over, I need good men I can trust!"

 

I presume that many were as much economic refugees as the thousands pouring over the Mexican border every week. However Mexico is one of the good guys so nothing is said about their human rights record.