Gadfly Posted October 18, 2009 Report Share Posted October 18, 2009 You asked if there ia anything new on the topic of scams against foreigner in Thailand, suggesting we should ignore the subject altogether unless we have some new insight on the subject. I disagree (scams are always worth raising on board like this), but no need to argue that point now, because I see several new issues here. First, scams here have become so routine and acceptable that scamsters are now willing to be filmed scamming foreigners? I think that says alot. It also answers your question about why JJ and company allowed themselves to be filmed. Or, second, how about this: it’s so routine and the authorities are so blasé about it and participate in it to such a great extent that the scamsters and the authorities are dumbstruck when the filming of a scam draws any attention or causes any controversy. Third, the threat of arrests and use of security forces to intimidate those reporting on scams? I find this interesting, but perhaps others believe this is acceptable and not worth a mention. Finally, Wandella also had an excellent and insightful observation and question. The observation: he unbelievable amount of denial and misdirection surrounding scams in Thailand. The question: why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckwoww Posted October 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2009 Because it's endemic? Because we're seen as walking ATMs? Because a lot of Thais don't really like us? All of the above? You seem to have a knack of answering your own questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gadfly Posted October 18, 2009 Report Share Posted October 18, 2009 You really don't want to discuss the scam angle and its implications, do you? Pretty obvious from your prickly and unresponsive response to the questions raised in my post. Wandella asked an excellent question: Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckwoww Posted October 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2009 Discuss it? How? I don't have anything new to add to the scam angle. Do you? What implications? The effect on tourism will be minimal IMO. There haven't been any new developments in the Big Trouble documentary either that I know of. JJ goes to court in Phuket on the 28th. I believe. You want to do a poll on whether he gets off or goes to jail? That would pass the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckwoww Posted October 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2009 I forgot to mention that they worked out some kind of insurance scheme for jetski rentals in Phuket. I don't know the details but perhaps it will stop some of the scammers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khun_Kong Posted October 18, 2009 Report Share Posted October 18, 2009 How many bogus claims will the Thai insurance companies pay? Zero. About the same number of legitimate claims they'll probably pay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTO Posted October 18, 2009 Report Share Posted October 18, 2009 Maybe JJ like many people liked the idea of 15 minutes of fame - why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallenda Posted October 18, 2009 Report Share Posted October 18, 2009 The impression I got of JJ from his interview and his behavior at the confrontation was that he likes to think of himself as a tough-guy. He obviously sees his victims as the enemy. I don't think it's an accident that he phoned up the director of the show at the very moment he'd snared a young marine in his net. I think he chose that particular victim as his setting of choice for the show he planned to put on. I'm pretty sure he knew what to expect: the C.O. would show up at some point. Keep in mind: he's been through all this plenty of times before. In those situations, facing guys surely far tougher than himself, he probably would have lost out either completely or at least was forced to accept a far lower 'damage fee'. If he rents jetskis every day, he knows how it plays out. As Cavanami pointed out, yes you could expect the marines to be a lot tougher in a situation like this than they showed in this one. He probably experienced that before. (With British marines who are only there for a short stint, I'd say it's a fair bet he's had his ass kicked by them before for pulling this on them.) But this time, he knew the cameras would be on them, British cameras, so they wouldn't be able to do anything they wanted. This time, he must have thought, he'd definitely have the upper hand. So in this sense, no it certainly wasn't the "reality" that would have happened with no cameras. But it did have its own particular reality. I think JJ set this situation up the way he wanted it. I think he wanted to play the big man in a scene, on tv even, where the marines would play the little defeated men. Maybe it was a revenge fantasy for previous unfilmed scenes where it didn't work out as face-saving or lucratively for JJ. Maybe this was JJ's big revenge. I think at least he had in mind that he was going to make the marines look like pussies on tv. All of it shows, to me at least, JJ as a macho-wannabe racist. Or xenophobe, whatever. The fact that he came out with a gun, knowing he was being filmed, says that he feels extremely secure that he's above the law, that he won't possibly face any punishment for it. That could only be because he knows who he's related to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallenda Posted October 18, 2009 Report Share Posted October 18, 2009 You really don't want to discuss the scam angle and its implications, do you? Pretty obvious from your prickly and unresponsive response to the questions raised in my post. Wandella asked an excellent question: Why? I honestly don't get why. It seems to make different people feel uncomfortable for different reasons. To the British here, they don't like seeing their boys embarrassed like that -- doesn't square with the marines they know, tough characters who don't take shit. But they showed up in a place where the scammer had called in a film crew -- so they had to proceed far more carefully than normal. I dont' think there's training for what to do in scenarios where film crews show up unexpectedly. They had to be thinking that the crew was going to be more partial to JJ's side, since he was the one that brought them there. They had to be thinking that they were being goaded into doing something they'd later regret. They were on guard. And to me that seems like a wise move in this situation. Others who want to think it was faked because it shames Thais (either because it shows Thais scamming people or because it shows JJ 'talking too much') -- well, to me it seems they're apologists. I mean, the idea can't be taken too seriously that the jet ski scams don't exist, or even that this guy wasn't one of them. The why I don't get on the last one is why foreigners would want to join up in the more understandable Thai denial of it. The denial looks to me like it's based in xenophobia. Why join up in xenophobia when it's being directed against people like yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckwoww Posted October 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2009 I think you're making far too much of this. Basically you're saying anybody who suggests the movie was faked is condoning scams in Thailand. That's much too simplistic. As I said already we all know scams exist in Thailand. Those that don't should heed the warnings. I'm more interested in the way the media, any media, distorts reality....but that's just me. If you aren't interested in the JJ episode why keep coming back to it? You actually seem more interested in a few isolated reactions than the you do in the scams. Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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