Flashermac Posted June 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2008 The US had no business in WWI. Wilson had been reelected on a promise to keep the US out of the war, then he turned right around and got the US in. Yes, there had been provocation - mainly the unrestricted submarine warfare in the waters around Britain. American lives were lost, but the victims should have known the chances they were taking. The German embassy had posted warnings in all of the US east coast papers. The ships the passengers were sailing on were known to be carrying munitions for the Allies. But Wilson got the US in and ended up getting over 100,000 GIs killed in just a few months of combat. And for what? The US should have let Europe finish off the war and come up with whatever peace treaties they wanted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julian2 Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 I suppose it was the beginning of a foothold in Europe. The former great powers of Europe were bankrupt with millions of dead while the US economy had boomed. It's hard to say that Wilson foresaw the rise of Communism but the start of the Russian Revolution must have got his attention. He would have been totally opposed to everything the new Soviets stood for. After the war the US sent troops to assist in Russia but I believe there was some confusion as to who was fighting who. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashermac Posted June 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 Wilson was an idealist, son of a Scots-Irish Presbyterian minister. He was a Southerner and was old enough to see first hand as a child the destruction the Union Army caused in his homeland. Thus he was anti-war. But somehow he'd got it into his head that Imperial Germany must not win the war. However, he did not forsee the sudden German collapse in Nov 1918, not the chaos that would follow ... with the dissolution of the Austro-Hungarian Empire and the harsh terms that would be imposed on the defeated by the victors. He had meant to return Europe more or less to the former status quo, but with more democratic governments. Instead, post WWI Europe was a disaster. Germany had surrendered on the basis of Wilson's famous Fourteen Points, which respected the rights of the defeated. France and Britain especially were responsible for "dictated treaties". In former wars, the defeated nations had usually had a say in the peace agreement. Not WWI. The terms were dictated to them and they had to accept them, no matter how unfair. Wilson - for all his good intentions - was responsible for American isolationism and a feeling of disillusion after the war. This was the so-called Lost Generation in America. People turned to materialism and the "Roaring '20s" came about. Wilson is a fascinating case of a good man making things worse by trying to make them better. He was deeply religious and felt he had a mission to fulfill. Oh, dear ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Hippie Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 ... Remember' date=' if it were not for people like me, you and or your parents would be dead a long time ago.[/quote'] Who exactly are "...people like me..."? All American citizens? Or are you trying again to over glorify your small part in the group effort? "People like me" are the millions of men and women that stood up and swore to fight for your freedom against those that would take it. Canadian, British, Irish, French (Yes I said it!), American, Thai (We remember the Thai Air force in WWI!), and all those I left out. And yes, I am a very small part of it. But I am proud of the part I play and honored to serve. As you should be sir. For it is the contribution of persons such as yourself, that give others the right to descent and vocalize it. A far cry better than the chicken hawk pussies who run their mouths about going to war, while they would never go themselves. "...for those who fought for it, freedom has a taste and feeling the protected shall never know..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khun_Kong Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 Hey OH- I'm sure that neither you nor Mr. Corinthian are saying that an American such as myself or my son or my grandmother, none of whom has worn a uniform, has made any less of a contribution towards American freedom than you guys have. I'm probably just reading it wrong, but TheCorinthian's post here and his slightly off-base post in the Memorial Day thread seem to imply that he has somehow done more than other Americans. I resent that as much as I'm sure he would resent his contributions being dismissed out of hand. Remember guys, we are one nation, united, standing together, not a bunch of individual glory-deservers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teddy Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 As a matter of interest. If any of you guys who are eschewing the virtues of the military have children, sons or daughters, would you let them enlist in the military or would you talk them out of it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Hippie Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 Yes, you are reading it wrong...sort of, my comments are basically aimed at those who demand more war, more invasions etc, all the while being too chicken shit to sign up and go fight in those wars themselves. It is like saying "...my neighbor is an asshole, and he really pisses me off, I want to see him gety his ass kicked, and see him with 4 flat tires, you go do it while I sit here inside where it is safe..." Kow Jai mai? People contribute to society in different ways, some never do, and are just a waste of life. But people who answer the call, and fight for our freedoms do deserve a certain respect. Let's face it, if it weren't for the guys who fought and those who died fighting in WWII, we might all be living a different life now, if we were living at all. Likewise those who fought to establish this country, their contributions are worth a lot. Are they worth more than mine and yours? debatable I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teddy Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 Yes, you are reading it wrong...sort of, my comments are basically aimed at those who demand more war, more invasions etc, all the while being too chicken shit to sign up and go fight in those wars themselves. How is Rogueyam today Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashermac Posted June 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 Busy campaigning for Alf Landon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCorinthian Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 Hey OH- I'm sure that neither you nor Mr. Corinthian are saying that an American such as myself or my son or my grandmother, none of whom has worn a uniform, has made any less of a contribution towards American freedom than you guys have. I'm probably just reading it wrong, but TheCorinthian's post here and his slightly off-base post in the Memorial Day thread seem to imply that he has somehow done more than other Americans. I resent that as much as I'm sure he would resent his contributions being dismissed out of hand. Remember guys, we are one nation, united, standing together, not a bunch of individual glory-deservers. I would hope that nothing I have ever said is implied to mean I take more credit than the millions that have either come before me or will come after me. (I am willing to bet I honor them more than 90% of the people here.) When I speak "for the group" as it were, that is just it, for the group that is not represented here and is often revilled here. "From all of us, to all of you, thanks, you deserve it." {Memorial day thread quote} Is to convey that we, the people that serve and value you all, feel you deserve your freedom and we, the group, are proud to serve you. (Not just me alone, though that is true also. I am proud to serve you. Even the ones that are bone headed morons, you are still better than the Talaban.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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