Oh you're kidding me, Homeland Secretary Wants Criminal Aliens Out of

[mainsail]

I completely agree. I may be a liberal but I own guns to protect my home and have always thought the fence was a waste of money. Why not just put up a guard tower every quarter mile with a sharp shooter in it. Illegal crossings would go to zero. I thought we were supposed to be at war? Isn't the first rule of security to protect your perimeter? I always thought Vicente Fox must have had photos of GW in a compromising position with a mule or something they way he bent over for him. I do not support paying to incarcerate illegals in our prisons.

[Steve]

We can all pound our fists in anger but the truth is its all a non starter and NOTHING will happen.

 

Two reasons : Politics and Money

 

Democrats see latinos as their consituency and are not willing to risk alienating (no pun intended) the vote and the Republicans for a myriad of reasons (being seen as racists, xenophobics; possibly courting religious latinos to the religious right, etc.) won't as well.

 

Vincente Fox is bold because he knows this all too well. Furthermore businesses, banks, check cashing, food industry, etc. rely on immigration from south of the border. Banks now accept Mexican (and other central American) drivers license as valid IDs to open a checking and savings account. Western union, check cashing places are immigration friendly in their services. The restaraunt, farming and other industries offer steady job opportunities.

 

If you come here illegally and live in California and just work, basically live a normal life and stay out of trouble, there is little chance of being caught and sent home. There are thousands of illegals with mortgages, kids in school, bank accounts, cars, etc.

 

Every Mexican illegal has a relative here and with that an infrastructure to ease transitioning to the states. These relatives house them and can find them employment.

 

Its the Salvadoreans and other central americans recent to the 'game' that one sees outside of Home Depot. Mexicans have been here for decades. Getting through Mexico is rather difficult for those south of Mexico and then to cross.

 

The war is over fellas. They won.

[Al]

I hate to interrupt the party, but

as long as this desribes the state of affairs

there will be illegal immigrants.

 

You want to end illegal immigrants? What if we had a mandatory death penalty or some other draconian penalty to those who are hiring illegals. Oh, you hired an undocumented worker to do your lawn or be a nanny? You just lost your house!

 

Do that, and you will get rid of illegal immigrants. Otherwise, it is hard to take you all seriously.

 

Of course, these are jobs that "no American wants to do". I would bet if they paid $100,000 a year, you would find plenty of people who would take those. So the free market argument should be that these jobs do not pay enough, that is why they cannot be filled by Americans.

 

Oh but I forgot, this is 2009, and free enterprise is doctrine that has been discredited.

 

[Central Scrutinizer]

"Of course, these are jobs that "no American wants to do". I would bet if they paid $100,000 a year, you would find plenty of people who would take those. So the free market argument should be that these jobs do not pay enough, that is why they cannot be filled by Americans."

 

I've been saying this for ages here in this discussion on this. It is complete BS that Americans will not do these jobs at a decent wage. Plenty of Americans would be willing and able to work as nannies, cooks, groundskeepers, pool cleaners/workers, farm hands, construction labor, whatever jobs the illegals are filling, etc. IF THEY RECEIVE APPROPRIATE COMPENSATION.

 

They will not work for crap money breaking their balls at the wages the ones hiring the illegals want to pay for their employees.

 

If these employers could not fill the jobs with illegals they would either have to pay more, or go out of business.

 

Like you say, if the government would attach high costs/fines and punishments (serious jail time) for those doing this illegal business practice of hiring illegal aliens it would not be going on and the illegals would have no work to come to here and would stay in their own countries. They come to the US (and elsewhere in the world) because they CAN get work in the states.

 

The employers hire them because THEY WORK CHEAP and are afraid to cause problems because they are ILLEGAL.

 

It is totally the US government's fault that this continues. There is no need for a fence except to keep criminals and undesireables and terrorists out of the country. The illegals come because they can and they can make money and get jobs and free education for their kids and free health care, etc. It is a gamble for them (and dangerous) but if they get here they have a good chance to live a better life than where they came from. Who can blame them? It's not their fault it is our fault for not forcing our own government to solve this problem, which it could easily do by making it not worth these unpatriotic, slimeball, traitorous employers to hire illegals (that ought to get a response). :smirk:

 

Without jobs the illegals will not come. As we can see just recently from the latest reports that illegal entries are falling. Why? No fucking work for them, that's why.

 

The solution is simple, easy, effective, and MUCH LESS COSTLY for the taxpayers of the United States. No work to do, no jobs to be had, no reason for these people to come there.

 

They just need to either pass the laws needed, or just enforce the laws already on the books, and increase the penalities for the Americans breaking these immigration laws by hiring, aiding, housing undocumented illegal aliens, etc.

 

Oh, and since this is a federal offense (if not it should be - I'd have to look that up) and the feds do have death penalty options, the ones found doing human trafficing of illegals should face the death penalty as the ultimate penalty for this disgusting crime. It should be an option for the worst of these criminals and repeat offenders.

 

JMHO.

 

[Hugh_Hoy]

:thumbup: :thumbup:

The link said: About 113,000 criminals who were in the U.S. illegally were deported last year, Immigration and Customs Enforcement said. The agency estimates there are now as many as 450,000 criminals in federal, state and local detention centers who are in the country illegally.

 

If we had an effective immigration strategy which included protecting not only our borders from illegal crossing but those that enter on temp/vacation visas and never leave, we wouldn't have to deal with 450k criminals would we?

 

We individually take measures to protect our homes from someone entering it uninvited. The government should be using that same mindset to protect the country.

 

Someone tries to break into my place, they will be met with the full measure of my second amendment right. :smirk: ...and its got a hair trigger so BEWARE. :nahnah:

 

 

 

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

 

HH

 

[cavanami]

The US gov must get off its azz...

1. enforce the laws regarding illegals!

2. big fines and prison time for companies hiring illegals.

3. NO farkin free medical, etc for illegals!!!

 

The illegals come to the USA for all the benefits and work. Take those two away, guess what, not much of a problem with illegals!!!

 

Sooooo, the US gov must be getting pressured to keep the illegals in the USA, otherwise why not have a REAL crackdown on illegals

[Bangkoktraveler]

I live near the border. Last weekend I bought some 8 gauge shotgun shells which contain 3 ounces of lead in each round! So this week, I went looking for an 8 gauge shotgun and it appears they are illegal to own. Shit!

[Steve]

I hate to interrupt the party, but

as long as this desribes the state of affairs

there will be illegal immigrants.

 

You want to end illegal immigrants? What if we had a mandatory death penalty or some other draconian penalty to those who are hiring illegals. Oh, you hired an undocumented worker to do your lawn or be a nanny? You just lost your house!

 

Do that, and you will get rid of illegal immigrants. Otherwise, it is hard to take you all seriously.

 

Of course, these are jobs that "no American wants to do". I would bet if they paid $100,000 a year, you would find plenty of people who would take those. So the free market argument should be that these jobs do not pay enough, that is why they cannot be filled by Americans.

 

Oh but I forgot, this is 2009, and free enterprise is doctrine that has been discredited.

 

The government grants special visas that are eaten up by the tech companies here.

 

Given time to plan, these farmers with the help of the government could have special visas and import seasonal workers from latin america. Florida did it for years with caribbeans (Jamaicans, Trinidadians, etc.) to work the sugar cane crops and other crops in Florida for a season and then go home.

 

Given the present economy, I think there are plenty of Americans who would go there for the season.

[Flashermac]

Get a black powder muzzle loader - say a replica Brown Bess (.75 cal) or a .69 calibre smoothbore percussion replica. Load them with buck and ball.

 

[Old Hippie]

"Of course, these are jobs that "no American wants to do". I would bet if they paid $100,000 a year, you would find plenty of people who would take those. So the free market argument should be that these jobs do not pay enough, that is why they cannot be filled by Americans."

 

I've been saying this for ages here in this discussion on this. It is complete BS that Americans will not do these jobs at a decent wage. Plenty of Americans would be willing and able to work as nannies, cooks, groundskeepers, pool cleaners/workers, farm hands, construction labor, whatever jobs the illegals are filling, etc. IF THEY RECEIVE APPROPRIATE COMPENSATION.

 

They will not work for crap money breaking their balls at the wages the ones hiring the illegals want to pay for their employees.

 

If these employers could not fill the jobs with illegals they would either have to pay more, or go out of business.

 

Like you say, if the government would attach high costs/fines and punishments (serious jail time) for those doing this illegal business practice of hiring illegal aliens it would not be going on and the illegals would have no work to come to here and would stay in their own countries. They come to the US (and elsewhere in the world) because they CAN get work in the states.

 

The employers hire them because THEY WORK CHEAP and are afraid to cause problems because they are ILLEGAL.

 

It is totally the US government's fault that this continues. There is no need for a fence except to keep criminals and undesireables and terrorists out of the country. The illegals come because they can and they can make money and get jobs and free education for their kids and free health care, etc. It is a gamble for them (and dangerous) but if they get here they have a good chance to live a better life than where they came from. Who can blame them? It's not their fault it is our fault for not forcing our own government to solve this problem, which it could easily do by making it not worth these unpatriotic, slimeball, traitorous employers to hire illegals (that ought to get a response). :smirk:

 

Without jobs the illegals will not come. As we can see just recently from the latest reports that illegal entries are falling. Why? No fucking work for them, that's why.

 

The solution is simple, easy, effective, and MUCH LESS COSTLY for the taxpayers of the United States. No work to do, no jobs to be had, no reason for these people to come there.

 

They just need to either pass the laws needed, or just enforce the laws already on the books, and increase the penalities for the Americans breaking these immigration laws by hiring, aiding, housing undocumented illegal aliens, etc.

 

Oh, and since this is a federal offense (if not it should be - I'd have to look that up) and the feds do have death penalty options, the ones found doing human trafficing of illegals should face the death penalty as the ultimate penalty for this disgusting crime. It should be an option for the worst of these criminals and repeat offenders.

 

JMHO.

 

 

 

When I was a kid, we cut lawns or worked for landscapers, worked fast food, car washes etc...now those jobs are all taken but recent immigrants, many of them here illegally. There are people who will do these jobs at a decent wage, maybe even the lower wages these illegals do it for, but the kids just can't get the jobs.

 

Take away the illegals, and the kids will do these jobs. As for picking lettuce? the same people who have been doing it, LEGALLY documented guest workers. Or poor uneducated Americans can do it if they want to eat and make a living...of course you'd have to cut welfare, but that is another issue.