Malaysian Mh17 Ams To Kul 777 Suspected Shot Down Over Ukraine

[Mekong]

high tek weapons in the hands of low tek nut cases

 

Same could be said about Iran Air Flight 655

[Flashermac]

I knew an ex-Navy guy who was on the USS Vincennes at that time. He says they were on combat alert following an encounter with Iranian gunboats and were absolutely convinced it was a hostile aircraft attacking them. Somebody screwed up big time. But most disturbing is that both Papa Bush and Bill Clinton later refused to apologise for it, even though the US paid reparations to the victims' families.

[Flashermac]

Rebels 'destroying evidence'

 

 

The Ukrainian government has claimed that "Russian-led terrorists" are destroying evidence at the crash site of Malaysia Airlines flight MH17.

 

The government said in a statement that "the terrorists" had taken 38 bodies from the crash site to a morgue in the city of Donetsk, "where the 'experts' with Russian accents claimed they intend to perform autopsies".

 

It said separatist groups were trying to move remnants of the aircraft to Russia. "We urge the international community to oblige Russia to withdraw its terrorists from Ukraine and to allow the Ukrainian and international experts to hold a comprehensive investigation."

 

The Ukrainian government also accused pro-Russian separatists of hindering investigation into the passenger plane's downing in the east of the country.

 

Deputy Prime Minister Vladimir Groisman said experts from Kiev would only be allowed to stay at the crash site for 30 minutes under the supervision of armed rebels. He called on the separatists to give an international commission free access to the site, where the United States says flight MH17 was shot down by a surface-to-air missile, killing all 298 passengers and crew on board.

 

Monitors from the Organisation for Security and Co-operation in Europe (OSCE), who are not forensic experts, reached the crash site near the Ukraine-Russian border late on Friday but were denied full access to the debris field by the rebels who control the area, chairman Thomas Greminger said.

 

Members of Ukraine's Emergency Situations Service had also reached the scene but rebels were complicating their recovery efforts, said Serhiy Taruta, the Kiev-appointed governor of the Donetsk region.Ukraine's intelligence chief, Valentin Nalivaichenko, said the insurgents had formed a "security zone" around the wreck, adding that "we hope the terrorists disappear and allow us to work".

 

Separatist leader Andrei Purgin rejected the allegations and said the "people’s militia" were in the area to ensure an "objective investigation".

 

Emergency services said early yesterday that 186 bodies were recovered. The search for the other victims' remains was complicated by the fact that the wreckage was scattered over 25 square kilometres. About 170 emergency workers were near the site, including divers who were to search a nearby lake, a spokesman said. All the bodies were to be taken to a laboratory in Kharkiv, more than 250 kilometres north of the crash site far from rebel-held territory.

 

The Interior Ministry said hundreds of rooms have been reserved at a hotel in Kharkiv for relatives of the victims, and that translators and psychologists were also on hand.

 

US President Barack Obama has called the deaths of all 298 people onboard "an outrage of unspeakable proportions", joining the chorus of world leaders calling for an immediate investigation into the mid-flight disaster that struck the Boeing 777-200 as it flew on Thursday from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur.

 

Obama called on Russia, pro-Russian separatists and Ukraine to adhere to an immediate ceasefire to allow an investigation. "We know that these separatists have received a steady flow of support from Russia," he said. "This includes arms and training, it includes heavy weapons, and it includes anti-aircraft weapons."

 

The US ambassador to the United Nations told an emergency UN Security Council meeting that there was evidence the Moscow-backed rebels used an SA-11 surface-to-air missile to down the plane from about 10,000 metres.

 

"It is unlikely that the separatists could effectively operate the system without assistance from knowledgeable personnel," Samantha Power said. "Thus we cannot rule out technical assistance from Russian personnel in operating the systems."

 

In an overnight call between Obama and German Chancellor Angela Merkel, the two leaders "emphasised that Russia bears a clear responsibility to deny separatists in eastern Ukraine continued access to heavy weapons and other support from inside Russia," the White House said.

 

A purported recording of a militant leader boasting about the downed aircraft to a Russian military intelligence officer proved thatMoscow and the separatists were culpable, Poroshenko said. The unverified phone call was posted on YouTube by Ukraine's security service, which said the message was intercepted.

 

"Undoubtedly, the state on whose territory this happened is responsible for this terrible tragedy," Putin told a Kremlin meeting.

 

Malaysian Prime Minister Najib Razak has vowed that "no stone will be left unturned" in the investigation. Malaysia has sent a 62-member team to help in the retrieval of bodies and plane wreckage.

 

 

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/national/Rebels-destroying-evidence-30238969.html

[My Penis is hungry]

Falling from 30 000 feet they would be dead by the time they hit the ground or unconscious. That's a long fall in thin air. from 30 000 to say 15 000 feet

[khunsanuk]

Hi,

 

Falling from 30 000 feet they would be dead by the time they hit the ground or unconscious. That's a long fall in thin air. from 30 000 to say 15 000 feet

 

And of course, it's about -60C at 30K feet.

 

Sanuk!

[Flashermac]

Russian government edits Wikipedia on flight MH17

 

 

A political battle has broken out on Wikipedia over an entry relating to the crash of Malaysian Airlines flight MH17, with the Russian government reportedly removing sections which accuse it of providing "terrorists" with missiles that were used to down the civilian airliner.

 

...

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/news/10977082/Russian-government-edits-Wikipedia-on-flight-MH17.html

[Boo Radley]

Falling from 30 000 feet they would be dead by the time they hit the ground or unconscious. That's a long fall in thin air. from 30 000 to say 15 000 feet

I think you would also be overcome by hypoxia at that altitude and pass out within about 15 seconds due to lack of oxygen.

[My Penis is hungry]

<<I think you would also be overcome by hypoxia at that altitude and pass out within about 15 seconds due to lack of oxygen. >>

This has always baffled me, as I can like many people hold my breath for longer than this, not that it would do me any good

[cavanami]

When the military does a halo jump, they are geared up for it; oxygen bottles, warm protective clothing, etc.

[Flashermac]

Fury rises at Russia over MH17 crash site

 

 

Outraged world leaders yesterday heaped pressure on Russia to press Moscow-backed rebels in eastern Ukraine to allow investigators proper access to the crash site of the Malaysian MH17 jet.

 

A top Ukrainian rebel leader said the pro-Russian fighters would guarantee the safety of international monitors at the Malaysian jet's crash site - if Kiev agrees to a truce.

 

"We declare that we will guarantee the safety of international experts on the scene as soon as Kiev concludes a ceasefire agreement," Andrei Purgin, the "deputy premier" of the self-proclaimed Donetsk People's Republic said in a statement.

 

Rescue efforts were in disarray as armed guards in fatigues and balaclavas refused to allow international monitors full access and the grisly remains of some of the 298 passengers killed have yet to be removed.

 

Scores of bodies that had been gathered at the main Ukraine crash site have been removed, an AFP reporter on the scene said.

 

Pro-Russian rebels who had been guarding the impact site also appeared to have left, with about a dozen stretchers, paper masks and plastic gloves abandoned at the scene.

 

Poles marking locations where bodies had been found in the field had also been removed.

 

Local emergency crews, who were also absent from the site, declined comment when contacted by telephone but said the separatists would be releasing an official statement later.

 

European security body OSCE said on Saturday evening that 55 body bags and 55 markings indicating human remains were seen at the site.

 

Ukraine has warned that the rebels, who Kiev and the US have accused of blowing the plane out of the sky with a missile, were "hours away" from moving key evidence across the Russian border.

 

As fears grew that evidence was being tampered with, world leaders voiced their frustration with Moscow, pushing East-West ties to crisis point after months of discord over the Kremlin's interference in ex-Soviet Ukraine.

 

US Secretary of State John Kerry told Russian counterpart Sergei Lavrov that Washington was "deeply concerned" investigators were denied "proper access" to the crash site for a second straight day.

 

Kerry was backed by leaders from other countries - as well as Ukraine - in calling on Russian President Vladimir Putin to intervene in getting an international probe under way.

 

British Prime Minister David Cameron called for possible tougher European action against Moscow.

 

"If President Putin does not change his approach on Ukraine, then Europe and the West must fundamentally change our ap-proach to Russia," he said, writing in the Sunday Times newspaper.

 

Dutch Prime Minister Mark Rutte - his nation mourning the loss of 192 compatriots - said he had called on Putin during a "very intense" conversation to "take responsibility" for a credible investigation.

 

Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott said the crash site was "absolutely chaotic" as he sought to recover 28 bodies of his compatriots killed in the disaster.

 

Malaysia's transport minister expressed alarm before boarding a flight to Kiev over "indications that vital evidence has not been preserved in place".

 

 

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/national/Fury-rises-at-Russia-over-MH17-crash-site-30239033.html