pattaya127 Posted July 8, 2002 Report Share Posted July 8, 2002 I was mainly asking why people like GTG should hate the choice of profession when, after all, very few of us have noble altruistic jobs ------------------------------------- It is just that if it was a ok choice, then you'd have as pervasive a prostitution scene in western countries. And millions of western women in dire straits or a bad fix would consider it as an option? I doubt that the non-altruistic western jobs are ridden with the type of crimes related to the sex trade. If the job of a BG is to extract more money from men and lying to do so, as many think it is, does it mean that you'd contemplate having the same behaviour in a non-altruistic job? And if they do it without greed and lies, should we then, as i proclaim, give them the respect that thai society refuse to give them. Do the citizens in your country loathe people working in non-altruistic jobs? Thanks for the good reply to GTG. Your post was to the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattaya127 Posted July 8, 2002 Report Share Posted July 8, 2002 She was also somewhat conflicted about her family. Her father had divorced her mother, and was now living with a younger woman, and in many ways embodied everything she hated, but at the same time, she had a natural Thai respect and love of her family. ----------------------------------- that is what is called " having the rooster come home to croak" (if i remember right). Or seeing the needle in someone's eyes (BGs), and not the board in one's own (family). Most of us, thais and farangs, have homework to do before we can assail girls for being Bgs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattaya127 Posted July 8, 2002 Report Share Posted July 8, 2002 In fact these opinions are not much different to the way people in the West feel, prostitutes and the people who are associated with them are held in low regard and most times for good reason. ------------------------------------ on the face of it, this is understandable. But thais may sometimes ask themselves why prostitution on Thailand is more than a social stain, and more like a very high possibility of income, with the structural and social means to make it, as i said, a very pervasive industry. When these educated thai women, like your friend, GTG and Busakorn, claim rightly so, that they do not have to be servants to men, why do they care very little about the women who are still servicing men. Why, as women, as feminists, don't they feel for the Bgs, instead of blaming them for not trying hard enough? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 8, 2002 Report Share Posted July 8, 2002 Hi GTG, Class structure > I know what you're saying about knowing 'right people' to get the 'cream of the crop' jobs (not always, though). As I said, this does go on, but not same-same as Thai culture, particularly relating to poor people in both cultures, and opportunities afforded them on that level. No one learns anything with their mouth open. > Of course I don't want you to keep your mouth shut. That saying relates to listening to what others are saying, relating to the post in which it was written. But like you said, you knew that already. By the way, Belgian Boy is on his way over, and I think he may need a date while he's there. Know of anybody? HT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lembeh Posted July 8, 2002 Report Share Posted July 8, 2002 GTG I am not (nowadays) a regular poster on this board. I have however read through this entire thread. I think what I find most amazing about it is your complete lack of what I thought was a central Thai virtue : Compassion. Compassion for your less fortunate sisters. Because thats what many of them are. You are fortunate indeed that you have not had to make the choice between a child of yours going hungry or you entering the flesh trade, or between your virtue and a parent getting an operation.... If pure money for themselves was the only criteria, why are so many of the girls working in the bars single mothers? Why are so many from the poor parts of Thailand? Have you ever been to bed hungry? Ever had only rice to eat? Ever not had enough money for shoes as a child growing up? I can assure you that many of the girls in bars have had these experiences, and they do not want them for their children or their younger siblings. Indeed many of these girls basically write off their lives to pay for a better life for their sisters or brothers. Much of the improvements seen in up country villages (like running water and electricity) comes from the money that these girls send home. Yes, there are girls whose only interest is their own financial gain, but frankly, in my humble opinion, these are not in the majority. What you seem to have missed on the board, is that the peoples whose opinions you dismiss so readily are the ones who have *talked* with these girls, have been to their villages, seen the poverty there, which, I assure you is real. I hope that you do return, occasionally to your fathers village. Maybe a week or so cutting rice, sleeping on the floor and washing in outdoor jars of water would give you a new realization about the lives that many of your sisters live. -j- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goodthaigirl Posted July 9, 2002 Report Share Posted July 9, 2002 High Thaied >It seems that you are quite insular to what goes on in your own country concerning many topics that many board members here experience 30 minutes after landing at BKK Vice versa when I am in Western countries, I believe. GTG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goodthaigirl Posted July 9, 2002 Report Share Posted July 9, 2002 MadMax, >Hmmm, not a single answer. Interesting game you play, GTG. Seriously, didn't you get my answers? OK I'll spill it out loud again. (sign) >Do you think your time in America has affected your attitude? NO >Do you think that your attitude now is typically Thai? I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE TYPICAL THAI ATTITUDE IS SO CAN'T TELL. MAYBE A TYPICAL MIDDLE CLASS THAI ? >If you have adopted any western attitudes, how do you feel these have affected your life here in Thailand? I DON'T ADOPT ANY WERSTERN ATTITUDE. >I did not say your parents would sell you. >What I implied is that even if you were born with identical genetic make-up, but grew up in a poor Isaan village, it is quite likely your hardships would not evolve around almost having to leave school or getting a Master's degree overseas. And you might make the same career choice as thousands other poor Isaan girls who I don't believe are less virtuous or less intelligent than you. I don't think so. Money is not my main reason to chose my career. Funny, isn't it? I can make more but rather chose to stick to my job now for personal reason. And dignity is the key word here I think. Do you know what it means? I posted: "The point is we should be able to say ?I?m Thai? and be proud of it. Sadly, sometimes I feel the opposite." >Can you explain why? >It's not a trick question. I can make an assumption, but it would really be interesting to hear a first-hand explanation. I'll keep it short coz it's almost midnight I'm sure your assuption is right. 99% when a farang male knows I'm Thai, he says sth about Patpong and Pattaya and how he loves the girls and all that. That's fine. But the worst thing is that he thinks it's a compliment ! As if it's the only thing Thailand can offer the world. Haahaaa GTG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goodthaigirl Posted July 9, 2002 Report Share Posted July 9, 2002 pattaya127 >GTG, i wish you had more discerning. If her patronizing was just a comment, why don't you TGs ashamed/afraid of saying "i am thai" then take it as a comment on Thailand (wrong or right) when people jump to conclusions about what it mean to be a woman from Thailand? Why should you be offended to be viewed as easy girls and me not offended to have someone allude to easy sex in Thailand when I am meeting them to talk about thai culture and thai politics, as such was the case? Don'y be argumentaytive again, think abouit it and tell me if it is not the same, but in reverse? I don't know the situation between you two when you discussed it. But from what you wrote when translated to Thai, it's not a big deal/patronising at all. she just assumed that you have 'met' READ - NOT SLEEP OR HAVE SEX with them. As I said I don't know if she was smiling while saying it. >Why should we care to understand that middle class young thai women are afraid of say "I am thai"? It's your problem. for me I am not afraid to say i love and go to Thailand to anyone, and i don't hide it, on the contrary. When i think about thailand's problems, the perception that the middle-class women fear the outside world have of themselves is the least of them. So, yes, why should you be afraid to say it, because some imbeciles may react the wrong way? Yep. >The others will have an interest in you correcting their prejudices, if they have any. Not in the bar while they are a bit drunk. It's not a place and time to do so, don't you think? Actually I did that sometimes when it is appropreiate to do so. Please note my earlier post, I said SOMETIMES. >maybe this fear comes from really thinking yourself that thai women have nothing to offer the world but cheap sex. It appears to many farangs that way, unfortunately. >And if they don't offer that, well no interest in being or saying you're from thailand. I don't understand your sentence here (language problem again) ????????????? >Shall i gather by your last remark that there's very little incentive for us to meet and possibly become friends? Good move, GTG? YOU THINK TOO MUT. GTG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattaya127 Posted July 9, 2002 Report Share Posted July 9, 2002 HT, GTG sent this to me, above, erroneously: High Thaied >It seems that you are quite insular to what goes on in your own country concerning many topics that many board members here experience 30 minutes after landing at BKK Vice versa when I am in Western countries, I believe. GTG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattaya127 Posted July 9, 2002 Report Share Posted July 9, 2002 I don't know the situation between you two when you discussed it. But from what you wrote when translated to Thai, it's not a big deal/patronising at all. she just assumed that you have 'met' READ - NOT SLEEP OR HAVE SEX with them. As I said I don't know if she was smiling while saying it. ----------------------------------------- don't put yourself in a deeper hole. What thai? she has been studying in US for years, worked as an office manager in US for months, when she apeaks english, she means english. Don't assume anything, since like you said: you don' t know... Not in the bar while they are a bit drunk. It's not a place and time to do so, don't you think? Actually I did that sometimes when it is appropreiate to do so. Please note my earlier post, I said SOMETIMES ------------------------------------------- well, are you saying that a few drunks are the reason why thai women fear to say "I am thai"? What kind of nonsense is that? It appears to many farangs that way, unfortunately. ----------------------------------- Fuck'em (well, you know what i mean...) I don't understand your sentence here (language problem again) ????????????? ------------------------------------------------- It was, in context, saying that thai women are feeling unworthy to be "thai", interiorizing the fact that they will always be seen as sex fodder. (how's that for language problem?, ahah) YOU THINK TOO MUT ---------------------------------------- What a yummy little tongue sticking out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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