thalenoi Posted December 27, 2002 Report Share Posted December 27, 2002 [color:"blue"]Thalenoi, Do you mean that the BGs you refer to in Chumpon are no longer in the P4P scene? Do you attribute this to the success of their relationship? Harlequin [/color] P4P at Thung Wua Laen, Chumpon??? :: no have. Down-town Chumpon if you know where to look, you can find, it's certainly not in-your-face. I guess condition sine qua non is to get out of the scene and I do know from their talks they imagine all farangs are in Pattaya to find a wife :: The girls in question want to get out, I would even state they get in to get out... But yes, I suppose only those who manage to get out of the bar scene have a chance. I also have the impression these ex-bg's have a good understanding of what it takes to make a man happy. Unfortunately some of these guys are rather the assholes, I have more respect for most of the ladies I know here than for the men they are living with :hubba: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJsushi Posted December 28, 2002 Report Share Posted December 28, 2002 Says harlequinbkk: Jjsushi, I think you are getting a bit frustrated here. Try to calm down and stay focused on the matter we are discussing and refrain from making personal attacks on me. If you must attack me personally, use the PM feature of this board rather than post it openly. Harleq I am not attacking you personally, I am merely exposing your fallacies, faulty logic and inability to defend your arguments. Unfortunately, I don't have the time to have a proper discourse with you because I am in LOS right now and have checked the board for some quick info. Luckily for you you are always in my thoughts when I check the board. So I will reply quickly before I sign off. You are correct that I am frustrated with our discourse because you have the ability to shrug off the major crux of the debate if it does not fit your focus. You then counter with IMO very non-sensical banter with the purpose to deflect the counter points presented to you. I wish you would at least make an earnest attempt to stand by your statements and present credible arguments. Alas, you do not do that which leads to dissapointing discourse. I guess I will end our exchange on this thread. Happy New Year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gummigut Posted December 28, 2002 Report Share Posted December 28, 2002 "As far as I can remember, the long-term expats warnings do not explicitly say they have less respect for the women vs. a non-prostitute. I get the feeling that this is what they mean, but I am reading between the lines here." The warnings are largely surrounding issues of trust. This does not mean less respect. "I am just saying that these people can be regarded as a group by their actions" I believe this is the rationalization for racial profiling. Black people tend not to have money so they can't honestly be driving that beamer legally. Let's stop'em from driving dat white car. Hey bubba, put up da siren, we gotta anuda one to shake down. <<burp>> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kamui Posted December 28, 2002 Report Share Posted December 28, 2002 "As far as I can remember, the long-term expats warnings do not explicitly say they have less respect for the women vs. a non-prostitute. I get the feeling that this is what they mean, but I am reading between the lines here." [color:"red"]The warnings are largely surrounding issues of trust. This does not mean less respect.[/color] . Well said Gummigut. Harlequin seems to confuse the common P4P with a long term relationship. Except occasional overcharging or bad service the BGs act properly. They even provide more than many BGs in the west: the often mentioned friendship experience. The problems seems to start when a Farang wants a long term relationship based on the friendship experience he paid for before. This seems to be difficult for many reasons, but a main issue is trust. For me it is bad logic to conclude from problems in long term relationships with BGs that they deserve less respect. And as we can learn in another thread, there various shades of grey between full time BGs and chastely GTGs/non-BGs. IMHO his idea of "racial" or better in this case "professional" profiling is not well set up. I am still wondering how Harlequin came to his conclusions about BGs. Only to take the "society" as a claim for his stance is a very weak argument. What is the real reason for his idea of BGs? Own experience, which he tries to generalize? Traditional, conservative moral? Something else? :: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soongmak Posted December 29, 2002 Report Share Posted December 29, 2002 You are the one who is getting desperate, quibbling over the definition of a word. Harlequin, I don't think so, but hey, it's a free world out there. [color:"red"] Prejudice by your definition: a judgment or opinion made before the facts are known. Now, that's YOU and your views of prostitutes, as you so gracefully admitted yourself. [/color] Again, I don't have all the facts about prostitution and neither do YOU. Now we're getting somewhere. I do not have the facts regarding the BG in question and therefore I did not pass any judgement about her. But you self-admittedly did.. So don't try to turn the tables on me on this one. Do you understand that it is also a FACT that prostitutes provide sexual services for money? Haha, Now, that's a good one. I guess you know that the overwhelming majority of the punters who go with her, do so by their own free will. So what do we have here, consenting adults. Wow, call the police anyone! [color:"red"] By your so called abstract view of the term prejudice, everybody would be prejudiced all of the time because nobody can know ALL of the facts. [/color] Just to remind you, it is also the view of a respected dictionary as well, composed by, I dare say, people who have a better command of the English langauge than you or I. To a greater or lesser extent, we are all prejudiced because we can never completely know 100% of the facts about a group of people. I think when the word is used in everyday speech, what is meant is that a person is very prejudiced (i.e. the make a judgement based on very few facts or facts irrelevant to the judgement). Wow, so you know EXACTLY what is meant by prejudice. Well, I think not. If everybody would be prejudiced all of the time, the word would carry no meaning at all. [color:"red"] Come on, humor me and show me were I am prejudiced. [/color] See my previous remarks. Harlequin, you can do better than that! Just give me an actual example were I showed some prejudice. Not the psycho babble that we are all prejudiced to some degree when it comes to certain people etc. If you accuse me of being prejudiced, you should have the courtesy to come up with at least some actual proof. Cheers, soongmak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harlequinbkk Posted December 29, 2002 Report Share Posted December 29, 2002 [color:"red"]I guess I will end our exchange on this thread. [/color] Jjsushi, Small Loss. Harlequin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harlequinbkk Posted December 29, 2002 Report Share Posted December 29, 2002 [color:"red"] Now we're getting somewhere. I do not have the facts regarding the BG in question and therefore I did not pass any judgement about her. But you self-admittedly did.. So don't try to turn the tables on me on this one. [/color] Other members on this board passed judgement on the punter without having all the facts either. That is a big part of what this board is all about, to report what we observe in Thailand, form opinions on same, and debate the merits of our opinions. [color:"red"] Haha, Now, that's a good one. I guess you know that the overwhelming majority of the punters who go with her, do so by their own free will. So what do we have here, consenting adults. Wow, call the police anyone! [/color] I assume all punters go with her on their own free will; what is the point you are trying to make here? Just to clear up any possible confusion, I do not have much respect for prostitutes, but if it is between consenting adults, I don't think prostition is or should be a crime. [color:"red"] Wow, so you know EXACTLY what is meant by prejudice. Well, I think not. If everybody would be prejudiced all of the time, the word would carry no meaning at all. [/color] <sigh> still quibbing over word definitions? I have already explained what I mean when I use this word, and why we all, to some extent, are prejudiced. Let's move on. [color:"red"] Harlequin, you can do better than that! Just give me an actual example were I showed some prejudice. Not the psycho babble that we are all prejudiced to some degree when it comes to certain people etc. If you accuse me of being prejudiced, you should have the courtesy to come up with at least some actual proof. [/color] No, I cannot do better than this. I have never met you and know very little about you, so I cannot provide actual examples. I can't provide actual examples that you get angry, jealous, lazy or have a number of other negative traits either, but nonetheless I do accuse you of having all these traits because you are a human and all humans have these traits. Harlequin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harlequinbkk Posted December 29, 2002 Report Share Posted December 29, 2002 [color:"red"] Harlequin seems to confuse the common P4P with a long term relationship. Except occasional overcharging or bad service the BGs act properly. They even provide more than many BGs in the west: the often mentioned friendship experience. The problems seems to start when a Farang wants a long term relationship based on the friendship experience he paid for before. This seems to be difficult for many reasons, but a main issue is trust. For me it is bad logic to conclude from problems in long term relationships with BGs that they deserve less respect. And as we can learn in another thread, there various shades of grey between full time BGs and chastely GTGs/non-BGs. IMHO his idea of "racial" or better in this case "professional" profiling is not well set up. I am still wondering how Harlequin came to his conclusions about BGs. Only to take the "society" as a claim for his stance is a very weak argument. What is the real reason for his idea of BGs? Own experience, which he tries to generalize? Traditional, conservative moral? Something else? [/color] Kamui, Part of the reason that I do not respect prostitutes is that they demand money in exchage for "the friendship experience". I don't charge any of my friends for my time, or for any service I provide as a result of our friendship. I agree that lack of trust is an important reason not to get into a long-term relationship with a prostitute. But there is a close relationship between respect and trust. Can you respect someone that you do not trust? I am also curious about the personal backgrounds and motivations of people who post their opinions on this board. Some of the posters are comfortable discussing their own backgrounds and feelings as they relate to their opinions. Nothing wrong with that. Others prefer to keep them private; in these cases, my curiousity is left unsated. Too bad, eh? Harlequin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soongmak Posted December 29, 2002 Report Share Posted December 29, 2002 [color:"red"] Now we're getting somewhere. I do not have the facts regarding the BG in question and therefore I did not pass any judgement about her. But you self-admittedly did.. So don't try to turn the tables on me on this one. [/color] Other members on this board passed judgement on the punter without having all the facts either. That is a big part of what this board is all about, to report what we observe in Thailand, form opinions on same, and debate the merits of our opinions. Oh Harlequin, So first it's me and now it are other people again? Congratulations on your umpteenth U-turn and ducking the subject at hand again. I think it is time to leave you and this thread alone. Congratulations on your Pyrrhic victory. Cheers, Soongmak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kamui Posted December 29, 2002 Report Share Posted December 29, 2002 Part of the reason that I do not respect prostitutes is that they demand money in exchage for "the friendship experience". I don't charge any of my friends for my time, or for any service I provide as a result of our friendship. Another weak argument: Because you do not like a certain kind of service you disrespect the service provider. Come on Harlequin, your arguments do not become any better by adding another weak argument to another. Anyway, I will drop out of this discussion. We all know your stance now and we walk in an endloss circle without any new fact or insight. Next time better I hope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.