What's with these brits?

[cardinalblue]

Lets keep this thread away from the definition of "what is violence? as it will go nowhere. We have been down that road previously.

 

I do agree the LOS bar scene attracts a certain type of individual/personality from certain nationalities. It just comes with the territory and geographic proximity.

 

It doesn't mean other nationaliites don't have this type of person in their culture. It is just that they don't travel to LOS. These guys wouLd not know the difference between taiwan and thailand and could care less. They have their own little world back home and consumed by their daily struggles and battles there.

 

As an american, the equivalent of what one sees in the bars here just doesn't come to LOS from america. The closet one would get to that type of personality (really a different type of personailty but behavior is the same) is a US miltary enlisted guy but the vast majority pretty much behave and controlled by superiors/rules when on leave.....

 

Cardinalblue

[chuckwoww]

This picking fights for no reason is a British thing alright. There are some very aggressive genes in the British gene pool...(read Celtic, Viking, Saxon , Norman). When the British weren't at war the nobility took it out on each other with swords or chased foxes around. The Saturday night punch up is a tradition among the lower classes. (See Carew's post about soccer hooliganism 'Sad news'). Put on the old bovver boots and 'ave a larf like. We'll see 'oos 'ard...

 

Of course most British people are very decent and civilized but there are some who just can't do without a bit of the old aggro. Any excuse will do. We're not talking about gang fights in South Central. Talking about someone sticking their foot out when you walk into a Bangkok go-go bar. It's a pity that kind have started finding their way to Thailand. 'Ere 'oo do you fink you are?

[New Petchburi Pete]

I've had a problem with only one guy from the U.K.; and, man, what an idiot he was! I only saw him once ... one too many times for me! Apparantly, he owns the townhouse adjacent to the one we're now in. I was sitting in the passenger seat of the truck & playing with the little one

in the back seat. ...

Wife jumps in behind the wheel, starts to back up, and hit 's something ... the guy's bike!

But, it was a rented bike; and, luckily only sustained very minor damage. We didn't know whose bike it was. So, we spoke with the neighbor across from us (wife of Pattaya policeman) who saw the incident. The cop (very nice guy & a great neighbor!) told us he'd pass along contact info to the owner of the bike.

When we came back a couple of hours later, the idiot (now intoxed) asked me "why the fuck did I do what?" I replied "what are talking about?" He accused me of running his bike over. I explained that I didn't do it; and, I'd be happy to reimburse him for any expense incurred. He said it was going to cost him 850 Bt ... and, even though I offered to pay, he kept going with the expletives. Then, when he said he wanted to fight me (he was almost a foot taller & at least 20 years younger than I), ... the cop (off duty), who was listening to all of this, stepped in, and threatened to arrest the dude. I told the cop that that wasn't necessary ... I'd just go into my place and cool down ... now! ... my wife goes out to negotiate the 850 Bt cost estimate with one of the guys from the bike rental place on Sukhumvit ... just as he was saying "O.K., 500 Baht." the young Brit started jawing at the wife! He threw a 1000 Bt. note at the guy, and said he'd take care of it. But, (I couldn't hear him inside with the A/C, kid, etc) he got into shouting obscenities! This is a big 'no no' in Thai society at any level

 

It's unacceptable behavior to yell at a woman in public! Talk about losing face with the neighbors! ... a real moron;

and, very lucky my wife declined to press charges, which the cop said he'd be happy to proceed with if she so desired. (? assault ... I don't know)

 

? one's wife in their own home ... shit happens, and arguments can take place. Dare I even mention the Thai 'soaps' that are so popular on TV? ... but, one doesn't want to lose face with their neighbors. They like peace, and are genuinely warm and friendly ... but, if an individual's 'problems' (or domestic crap) disrupts their sense of the home being a sanctuary of peace (and they pray for that), then the warm smiles can quickly turn to cold shoulders and eyes of ice!

 

Do fights occur more frequently in England than here? ...

I really don't know. All of the gents I've met from the U.K. have been very decent people ... only one bad one ... o.k., maybe he was having a bad day? You know I'm older & retired ... so I seem to meet Brits of similar age. G, if you live as long as me, you'll someday come to realize (at that age) that most episodes/encounters aren't worth physical confrontation! ... it's just negative energy. Bottle it man, hit your most tempting GoGo, and expend your energy on the nicest gal within reach! ... make love, not war! ... best sex (for most) results from outflow of positive energy.

You must be familiar with Deepak Chopra spiel? It's a hell of a lot easier for him to say how to live and respond in certain situations, than it is for me to practice what he preaches.

... just be ready for anything. Then you're prepared.

 

I think most of the younger, troubled folks (from everywhere) need, and hopefully will do so, to outgrow their anger.

... not to mention 'feeling their oats' after a few beers in the belly!

[frogpatrol]

Having lived in all three of the aforementioned countries (England, Thailand, USA) (and leaving the Welsh, Scots, and Northen Irsh out if this), I would say that, beyond a doubt, the most # of fights I've observed has been by Thais.

 

Does that mean Thailand is the most "violent" culture, when your throw guns into the equation? No. But for fights on the average SAT night, which is what Gummi was discussing, none of the other two beat the Thais.

 

Part of the reason why some foreigenrs might not see this is is b/c most of these fights take place in Thai night spots, or just outside them. Foreigners don't tend to be around, and when there, most Thais just leave them (us) alone.

 

But as for the foreign bar scene in BKK, I would agree that the English patrons tend to be comparativey more hostile than their American counterparts.

 

Seems that fighting is somewhat more bred into sport culture there than in the States, and this spills over into bar culture. I know, if you have ever been to a LA (Oakland) Raiders game, you may disagree, but I agree that many English (NOT all) do seem to have more of an edge to them in public entertainment space.

 

froggo

[Guest]

Hey Gummi

 

Looking at the date, this happened Friday night?

 

The reason I ask is that a Scottish guy I know was telling me that he committed a similar act Thursday night in Soi Cowboy, regretted it immediately and went and aologised to the guy who was Australian. He said he was upset because he was due to leave Thailand yesterday and took it out on some undeserving fella. Anyway, he postponed his departure until today, so i am wondering if he repeated the behaviour last night.

 

Also I have to agree that anecdotally, Britain seems to be much more violent than Australia at least in terms of having a "fight culture". I know it probably depends on where you live, but I grew up in a suburb with a bit of a rough reputation and I have to say that it never struck me as being a particularly violent place. Britain seems a lot more tribal, people from places like Liverpool, Manchester and Newcastle tell me the streets are rife with brawls on a Friday or Saturday night. Some extremely placid people (Aussies and Brit's) that I know have been involved in big dust ups in the UK. Again though, I can only go on second hand knowledge.

 

This isn't a spray for Britain BTW, but if it's true could be why the place managed to dominate half the world for so long, with that kind of warrior mentality (choking on my words)

[sayjann]

the most fights i have ever seen in Thailand are when a certain Nation is having fun after the Cobra Gold exercises.

 

but i was the victim of an assault by an Englishman 2 Years ago which resulted in 2 cracked ribs and 18 stitches/sutures.

and all i was doing was preventing a 6' Guy beating the shit out of a 4' 10'' Thai Girl.

[Palatkik]

>But really, are fistfights that prevalent in the UK?

 

Almost in a fist fight? Spat at by a Frenchman! Perhaps you are living a little on the wild side?Cannot say I have ever experienced same. Such a sheltered life I must lead :-)

[ptyrider]

gummigut said:

 

What gives with these tourists (have no problems with any brit expats - except one guy, but that's because he treats girls like scum)? <<burp>>

 

"You can take the Brit out of the council estate, but you can't take the council estate out of the Brit."

 

I'd had a good and respectful opinion of Brits until I met them in Thailand. I'd studied a lot about Britain in school; I'd loved the old British pop music; I'd always liked the British sense of humor. Nor was I disillusioned by my brief holidays in Britain. I'm sad to say that all of that is now gone.

 

Thailand seems to attract the worst of all nationalities, it's true.

 

Yet the chances of encountering a vile, arrogant, snide Brit (English in particular) seem far greater here than for any other nationality. We've all seen how the yobs act on holiday here and we've perhaps walked by the bars where they hang out. But I don't exclude the Brit expats: not too long ago I had the misfortune of having to work with an ignorant fat old yob from Manchester who at age 53 was still getting pissed at company parties and pulling his pants down to moon the ladies and inviting them "suck THIS!" Being in a position of authority, he got away with such despicable behavior; the other Brits would condemn him behind his back, but not to his face.

 

Another Brit, a civilized bloke this one, told me that one reason he'd left Britain was because of all the yobs. He was happier, he said, living among Thais.

 

I think many Brits would agree that present British society isn't up to what it once was. Perhaps the decline coincides with rise of the mindless, silly football culture. I don't really know.

 

So here in Thailand I generally avoid the Brits. To me the Scandinavians seem to show the most sense of all; we should encourage more of them to come over.

 

And we should ask Thai Immigration to administer a psychological examination of British tourists and expats and require those who fail to attend a special Speech & Charm School, run by selected Oxford graduates, where they might learn to speak the Queen's English as well as how to dress and behave properly before they enter Thailand.

[Old Hippie]

Hey, I am a lover not a fighter (probably suck at that as well... ) BUt I do seem to think that a certain element comes to LOS. I could be wrong here, but it seems the young USA guys are guys who can't get laid at home, usually educated computer geeks. Smaller and not into fighting for fear of messing up their nice clothes or hair... The Euro guys seem to be pissed off working class types mad at the world, what might be "Holligans" at home. I have met a lot of guys who just work a shit job, save up cash, and then come to LOS for "holiday" and get pissed when anything interfers with it...of course there are exceptions...by far, the biggest wanker I ever met was from SOuth Africa, he ended up in Jail...

[Guest]

Its funny you should mention this because I had an incident last night, and I am British. I was leaving a club in Khao Sarn road and some little thai kid was trying to sell me flowers, to the point that it was really anoying. So after telling him many times in Thai I didnt want them I gently pushed him away.

 

Suddenly some Thai/Muslim guy appeared and started giving me verbal abuse about pushing him away. Now, when someone starts hurling abuse at me I dont take it well. However, I told him to mind his own business and bugger off. He just wouldnt leave it and started shouting and telling me he 'hated english', which was totally out of proportion to what we were talking about. I swear, I avoid fights as much as I can but this guy really was asking for it. Fortunately, he scuttled off.

 

So all this about the English being violent is complete bullshit in my opinion. There are mindless idiots from all nationalities, and it is too easy to stereotype people. And mindless football culture isnt just found in England. I would point your attention to an incident with Turkish fans when an England guy was killed after a football match. It got so bad that for one match English fans were not allowed to enter Turkey because of the Turkish Hooligans.