jxxxl Posted August 28, 2004 Report Share Posted August 28, 2004 HT, "This thread is about being hypocritical in your views, and in your actions, as an ex-whoremonger. My position is that changing your views/actions is not hypocritical. Let's turn things around. Is a former prositutute incapable of turning things around, because she will be a hypocrite for denouncing her former lifestyle? "Are ex-whores hypocritical"? Of course not. Same goes for punters. What disturbs me, is those who take offense at the slightest comments, regarding the dark side to the scene. What seems to be misunderstood here, is that you can speak of the many dangers/pitfulls regarding the scene, and still be an advocate, and appriciate it, and not have an overall desdain. This fact is totally lost on many. Say one bad thing about the scene, and you are forever labled as an enemy to the scene, and have a dislike for any involved. It's so ridiculous. But that is what I imagine Stick has to deal with every day. So sad. " You just don't get it. I must second what JJ said, and that is you will fail to see the hypocracy becuase you don't uderstand hypocracy. You just duck and weave and change the focus of the argument. I've made my point without superferlous bullshit. I suggest you make an attempt at the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lembeh Posted August 28, 2004 Report Share Posted August 28, 2004 >I insist that you stop this farce immediately You *insist*?? YOU *INSIST*??? -j- one sentence removed. TTM -mod. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJsushi Posted August 28, 2004 Report Share Posted August 28, 2004 josh_ingu said: >I insist that you stop this farce immediately You *insist*?? YOU *INSIST*??? -j- BTW - xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx you don't have the temperment or skills to debate your position skillfully. Two lines removed and reference to the previous post x-ed. TTM - mod. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cardinalblue Posted August 28, 2004 Report Share Posted August 28, 2004 HT, I think you really touched upon what really seems to be the main underlying issue here and that is one's self justification of choosing BGs as wives and girlfriends and lifestyle associated with that. There seems to be a Bush-like mentality with a certain set of posters who take on the attitude of "you are with us or against us". Any critisism of the scene at all is unwarranted. Similar to what recently took place with the chinese BB star who criticized his team's effort in a losing cause and the chinese gov claimed him as unpatriotic and won't send any more players to america due to their bad effect it has on our players' thinking. What happens? It lit a fire under the butt of the chinese team and they upset the defending world champions in the medal round. See, what is the hell is wrong with valid criticism? So the strategy becomes a deflection strategy that punters are this, stickman is that, ex-whoremongers are the worst of the bunch, etc when it all really is about trying to defend their own actions and choices. It takes on this "purification" mentality in that there isn't any crossing over allowed. If you are going to participaqte in the scene, you cannot unless you take on a 100% "no criticism" approach. "Bad is bad" and "good is good" so if you are going to be bad, 100% all the way but then if you accomplish this great feat, you then are in essence "good". Every single thread all boils down to this recurring theme. It always comes down to trying to justify one's position of taking BGs as companions which is a reaction to one's insecurity, self-doubt and paranoia. The approach is defend, defend, defend no matter what. It is always about trying to alter, distort, change the basic definition of prostitution, the buying and selling of a service. It is always some defensive stance like "it's like renting a gf, they are human you know". These aruguments are never what is being questioned... I have never figured out why a cetain group of posters cannot accept some valid scene criticism nor do they ever have an inkling of criticiam themselves nor can they accept that every person views the scene somewhat differently in relationship to their own set of values and beliefs.... Cardinalblue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorro Posted August 28, 2004 Report Share Posted August 28, 2004 I think that Stick is a little schizo about the whole P4P scene. When he came to Thailand originally he dabbled a fair bit in the P4P scene and enjoyed it. Now he is married and has a 'proper' relationship he has somewhat changed his views on the P4P scene. He recognises some of the problems that go with being or becoming a full on whoremonger and or getting into relationships with BG's. In my mind he still has an attraction to the P4P scene but can see the inherent dangers of overindulgence in this scene. What you see in his column is really a confusing mixture at times. Sometimes he seems to strongly condemn the whole P4P scene and then at other times he takes a more benign and accepting attitude. I wouldn't call him a hyprocrit unless i found out that he was still indulging in the P4P scene. However i do think that he sends out confusing signals as to his position on the P4P industry in Thailand. I think that this stems from his own confusion about P4P and his own inner struggle with the morality of the whole scene. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BelgianBoy Posted August 28, 2004 Report Share Posted August 28, 2004 BelgianBoy said:Guys, As long as Stickman has not posted here, I will allow the discussion about his column, as long as it is relevant to the discussion at hand, i.e. "are ex-whoremongers hypocrits ?" But no discussions about Stickman, nor getting personal in any post. Discuss, attack, dissect and rebute postings, not posters. BB Guys, My last post here and my last warning before this interesting thread has to be locked because some of you cannot behave. This is my second intervention as a moddie in 2 weeks in 2 threads, thats at least once too many..... BB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 28, 2004 Report Share Posted August 28, 2004 Really good post, CB. HT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 28, 2004 Report Share Posted August 28, 2004 Hi Jxxxl, >>>You just don't get it. I must second what JJ said, and that is you will fail to see the hypocracy becuase you don't uderstand hypocracy. You just duck and weave and change the focus of the argument. I've made my point without superferlous bullshit. I suggest you make an attempt at the same<< I do get it. And I do understand hypocracy, and the meaning thereof. I'm not ducking or weaving anything. It's meaning is very clear. Read through this thread again! HT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soongmak Posted August 28, 2004 Report Share Posted August 28, 2004 I think you really touched upon what really seems to be the main underlying issue here and that is one's self justification of choosing BGs as wives and girlfriends and lifestyle associated with that. CB, what on earth are you talking about? Is there a lifestyle associated with choosing a BG as a partner? Tell me, which lifestyle is that? I am curious to hear what lifestyle I do lead according to you. It is prejudiced generalisations like this that pisses me off. There's no reason to lump us all together in a group based on your highly biased predilections. Every single thread all boils down to this recurring theme. It always comes down to trying to justify one's position of taking BGs as companions which is a reaction to one's insecurity, self-doubt and paranoia. So any person taking a BG as a companion is either insecure, self-doubting paranoid or all three? Wow, I really would like to hear the FACTS on wich you base this far-out theory. I have never figured out why a cetain group of posters cannot accept some valid scene criticism nor do they ever have an inkling of criticiam themselves nor can they accept that every person views the scene somewhat differently in relationship to their own set of values and beliefs.... Likewise. I addressed some of the points you made earlier on in this thread and you still failed to answer any one of them. Why is that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jxxxl Posted August 28, 2004 Report Share Posted August 28, 2004 "There seems to be a Bush-like mentality with a certain set of posters who take on the attitude of "you are with us or against us". " What the hell are you talking about? You know, in your continued attempts to appear intelligent, you end up with long-winded posts that are completely nonsensical and divert from the topics. You should go post on some conspiracy theory site, that's way more up your alley. I am trying to argue a point about hypocracy in a logical manner. I don't give a shit what people think about whoring and whether they want to participate or not. It's just unfortunate that some people cannot be logical because they are overcome by their emotions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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