No more Ms Nice Guy

[Old Hippie]

Precisely! They NEVER wanted EQUAL treatment, they want SPECIAL treatment. If they were truly equal, they could meet the world on our terms. as they cannot, I say they need to shut the fuck up and stay where they belong.

[Steve]

I'll keep this thread alive as the '2008 Election' thread to spare the forum of repeated threads about the election.

I'm sure you've all heard Geraldine Ferraro's comments about Obama. She said he wouldn't be getting the attention he has if he were white. She is a Clinton supporter. She came under fire and fired back. Not backing down. I gotta give her some credit on that. She's been ill for a few years now so I think she has 'don't give a sh*t' frame of mind. Basically, I've fought a life threatening disease, this stuff (the controversy) is nothing. I will agree and disagree with some things. I think there is some truth to the gloves not coming off for Obama to some extent but I think having a name like Barack Obama and being black IS a detriment starting out. He got the attention because of his rhetoric NOT because of his race. Once he made a mark, perhaps the media were kinder to him so it wouldn't seem racist if they questioned his platform or him too much. I don't know. Geraldine is a fighter though and no matter what she's at least speaking honestly and you can't have any worthwhile debate without at least being honest.

 

Obama won Mississippi last night. No surprise there. The problem for him though was that while he got 90% of the black vote, he only got 26% of the white vote compared to Hillary's 70% (other 4% probably undecided perhaps).

 

One of the talking heads said the reason why he lost Ohio by that wide of a margin was because of the whites, especially males, making under 50k. Pennsylvania has a similar make up as Ohio and I would expect Clinton to win if elections were held today.

 

 

[chuckwoww]

It looks to me like everybody is trying to pretend that race isn't a factor. But with statistics like that it obviously is a factor. Makes for an interesting election is all I know.

[Hugh_Hoy]

Race is definitely a factor for some. But I think for most (and I include myself) other factors are more important. I'd never vote for Obama because he represents too many things that do not appeal to me. I did not vote for McCain for the same reason, but might've voted for Rice depending upon how she spoke to issues important to me. Clearly, if you read her biography, there can be no doubt in my mind whatsoever that she is "head and shoulders" more qualified to lead the country than any of the three left standing.

 

HH

[Steve]

HH, I hear ya on race.

Race is definitely a very much reduced factor with the young voters as well and pretty much a lot of folks. I mention young folks because they grew up with total integration in schools. 80% of rap is bought by white kids. Cosby was voted 'America's Dad' in the '80s, they are used to seeing diversity.

As for me, I'm leaning Obama slightly but its not on race. I voted Republican in '00, Libertarian in '04 (Democrat in the '90s) and while I like a lot of things about McCain, I lost a lot of faith in the Republican party over the past several years. I became very disappointed. McCain may be different but the party still has major problems for me. There is still time the party to convince but I have my doubts.

My vote as it stands right is heading toward a vote against something than a vote for something.

I'm still unsure.

 

[chuckwoww]

My guess is a lot of people like Obama because he isn't the typical 'black politician' (whatever that means). He's not another Jesse Jackson or Al Sharpton for sure.

[rogueyam]

I think a lot of people like Obama because he isn't the typical 'black politician' (whatever that means). He's not another Jesse Jackson or Al Sharpton for sure.

 

I heard a good explanation of Obama's appeal: People want to get past divisions. Obama is running as a man who can bridge the divides. Because he is a black guy not running as a black guy (the way Jesse and Al do) his supporters feel like they're getting past racial divisions simply by supporting him and he thus establishes credibility as a uniter going forward.

[Steve]

Jesse and Rev Al ran to keep their names current. They knew they had no chance.

Obama is definitely one that appeals across a wide spectrum. There are a few others out there. Harold Ford Jr of Tenn., was heading that way and got reigned in. He is a centrist and wanted to partner with some Republicans on a few bills that were just right of center and the CBC (Congressional Black Caucus) told him what side his bread was buttered.

There is a generational struggle going on with black politicians. The 'old guard' marched with MLK and are very left of center. The new guard (Obama, Ford) grew up middle or upper middle class, went to all white boarding schools or private schools, top Ivy league colleges and have a far more centrist point of view.

[Steve]

Partly that and he's regarded as a Washington outsider. Young people are the lifeblood of his campaign because they honestly think he doesn't want business as usual. Race is secondary in my opinion. Very secondary.

And his big plus, he opposed the war. HUGE with young voters.

[Flashermac]

Good ol' Matt Drudge dredged up Ferraro's quotes about Jesse Jackson when he ran. Virtually the same ... Jesse wouldn't be getting any votes if he weren't black! Maybe Geraldine has thrown away her bedsheet, but she still burns the cross at night. Imagine if a white MAN had said what she does!

 

 

 

Anyway, Camile Paglia's lastest take on things:

 

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Obama (for whom I intend to vote) has the patrician elegance of John F. Kennedy, but JFK also campaigned with the raucous bravura and taunting raillery of a Boston Irishman. (His grandfather, "Honey Fitz" Fitzgerald, had been mayor of Boston.) Obama has seemed tentative in countering the Clintons' trademark mudslinging, but perhaps coolness and poise are what the nation needs after eight years of George W. Bush's lurching braggadocio. Obama hasn't figured out how to stay classy while delivering wicked stiletto thrusts -- a talent mastered in spades by British politicians produced by the Oxbridge debate culture.

 

Hillary, her shrill voice much improved and lowered through brutal overstrain, has certainly gained confidence and performance skill on the campaign trail, but I still don't trust her. [color:red]The arrogant, self-absorbed Clintons have shown their unscrupulous hand to all who have eyes to see.[/color] Yes, Hillary may know the labyrinthine flow chart of the Washington bureaucracy, but her peripheral experiences as a gallivanting first lady scarcely qualify her to be commander in chief. On the contrary, her constant resort to schmaltzy videos and cheap entertainment riffs ("The Sopranos," "Saturday Night Live") has been depressingly unpresidential. Is this how she would govern? All that canned "softening" of Hillary's image would have been unnecessary had she had greater personal resources to begin with. Her cutesy campaign has set a bad precedent for future women candidates, who should stand on their own as proponents of public policy.

 

[color:red]Would I want Hillary answering the red phone in the middle of the night? No, bloody not. The White House first responder should be a person of steady, consistent character and mood -- which describes Obama more than Hillary. And that scare ad was produced with amazing ineptitude. If it's 3 a.m., why is the male-seeming mother fully dressed as she comes in to check on her sleeping children? Is she a bar crawler or insomniac? An obsessive-compulsive housecleaner, like Joan Crawford in "Mommie Dearest"? And why is Hillary sitting at her desk in full drag and jewelry at that ungodly hour? A president should not be a monomaniac incapable of rest and perched on guard all night like Poe's baleful raven.[/color] People at the top need a relaxed perspective, which gives judgment and balance. Workaholism is an introspection-killing disease, the anxious disability of tunnel-vision middle managers.

 

 

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