chuckwoww Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 You're right. It does look as though NATO may have pushed a bit too hard. The Russians have had enough. The big question to my mind isn't how far Putin will push back...it's whether NATO is really ready for World War 3. Crimeans aren't particularly anti-Russian and I can't see Ukraine joining NATO any time soon. Most of the people in the Eastern part are opposed to it and NATO itself is bogged down in Afghanistan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waerth Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 The Crimeans aren't particularly anti-Russian. But the Ukrainians will not give parts of their land. Or their whole nation on a serving platter to the Russians. Whether Nato is ready or not ..... Bush is unfortunately still in office and Cheney with him. I do not think they care if they are ready or not. Bush and Putin hit it of really well for a number of years. I can imagine George being royally pissed with Vladimir at the moment. Both are hotheads. At the moment all of this seems like the perfect recipe for a real disaster unfortunately. I am following the events closely. Waerth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckwoww Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 I'm trying to keep up. I can't decide if it has implications beyond Georgia. Obviously Russia is fed up with NATO expansion. Maybe this is just a test case. I think Russia wants good relations with Ukraine. They just don't want NATO in there. I think Bush has enough wars on his plate. Not sure about Cheney. The BTC oil pipeline seems to be a major factor too. The West sees it as a way into the Caspian fields bypassing Russia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashermac Posted August 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 12, 2008 << Several have even compared events to Nazi Germany's annexation of the Sudetenland. >> Hardly an apt comparison. The Sudeten Germans had lived there since the 12th century and much of the "Sudentenland" had once been part of Bavaria. (They spoke the same dialect.) The Sudeten Germans (3.5 million) asked to be united with Germany in 1918 on the basis of Wilson's 14 Points (i.e. self determination), but the victors forced them to be part of Czechoslovakia against their will. They were supposed to have their minority rights protected, but the Czech government didn't. The Georgians are not Russian and do not want to be. The South Ossetians (70,000) apparently do. Still, Hitler got the Sudentenland through negotiations, not by force. It's also not a very pleasant comparison, as at the war's end the Czech government seized the Sudeten Germans' property and forcibly expelled them all from their homeland. Their towns and cities were repopulated with Czechs. Ethnic cleansing seems to be good or bad, depending on who's doing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangkoktraveler Posted August 12, 2008 Report Share Posted August 12, 2008 Some reports claim that foreign mercenaries were involved. Also Rice was there in July. Would be interesting if she was stirring up shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangkoktraveler Posted August 12, 2008 Report Share Posted August 12, 2008 USA has close ties with Georgia so this conflict might end up being a hot box. Over the weekend, the US military began airlifting 2,000 Georgian troops stationed in Iraq to go back home to Georgia. Just last month, 1,200 US troops took part in military exercises in Georgia. What might be looked upon as a catalyst to start the fire, both the US and Israel have helped arm Georgiaâ??s military. Nonetheless, Georgia also plays a pivotal role in the supply of oil from the Caspian region to the West as the Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan oil pipeline runs through much of the country. Yes, we are talking oil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khun_khon_neua Posted August 12, 2008 Report Share Posted August 12, 2008 I am missing something here? Russia has invaded a sovereign country and not one person here has condemned them or called them all the names they use to describe the US for doing the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.. Posted August 12, 2008 Report Share Posted August 12, 2008 They're a bunch of cunts too. But of course, we expect that of them...they don't say one thing and do another. The monkey wrench in the works however, is that from most accounts, the South Ossetian and Abkhazian people genuinely support secession from Georgia... Cheers, SD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashermac Posted August 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 12, 2008 The Confederate States fought for four years for secession. So your point is ...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.. Posted August 12, 2008 Report Share Posted August 12, 2008 Aren't we supposed to be "a-spreadin' freedom & democracy?" That's what Georgie keeps sayin'. One could look at it as the Rooskies are just helping the So. Ossetians to find their dream of freedom from the Georgians. Isn't that what BushCo says we are doing in Iraq? Then why is it bad when someone else does it, but not bad when we do it? Where do you draw the line? Cheers, SD -- thinks we (and the Russians) should stay out of it as it is none of our business Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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