Iowa third state to legalize gay marriage.

[Flashermac]

Aren't oral sex and anal sex' date=' between heterosexuals also considered perverse by some religious types...? [/quote']

 

The advantages of being an Athiest!

 

Amen to that, brother!

 

 

Nah, atheism sucks. You've got no one to blame when you f*ck up. e.g. When JFK Jr took off in a plane he barely knew how to fly and flew over the ocean at night by instruments (when he wasn't instrument qualified), he crashed it into the sea, killing himself, his wife and his sister-in-law. Rev Billy Graham said it was God's will. Sounds more like stupidity on JFK Jr's part to me. I prefer having a celestial scapegoat.

 

Now admittedly the Kennedy family's spending a few million to recover the bodies, hold a funeral, and then bury them at sea is beyond idiotic.

 

 

 

 

[Flashermac]

Iowa' date=' huh. How about marriages with sheep and other farm animals? Is incest still illegal? Can father marry his daughter if they both are wiling? Was Oedipus a victim of bigotry?

 

[/quote']

 

 

I understand the sheep part.

 

But what other farm 'animals' are appropriate for marriage?

 

 

Got me. I grew up in small towns and city suburbs. You need to ask somebody from Montana or New Zealand. Or maybe a Scot or Welshman.

 

 

 

 

 

[itsmedave]

Hugh Hoy said "The principal espoused by folks who think like me are not important. Okay. If u say so."

 

Are you being intentionally daft on this...because although we frequently disagree, you are usually very intelligent about it.

 

The principle here is that we should all be treated equally under the law...which is the principle that was used when this country was formed and should apply to all.

 

You are entitled to your opinion, but the principle that we should all be treated equally should not be chsnged by the whim of opinion or religeon. And, as an American, I am patriotic enough to understand that my personal feeling towards gays should mean nothing when laws affecting their equality are created. That is what principle is about.

[Central Scrutinizer]

[Central Scrutinizer]

"it is another erosion of cultural and traditional mores that have taken a heavy toll on Western society in just the last 50 years."

 

You mean it is an erosion of YOUR cultural 'bigotry' and YOUR 'religious' traditional mores (not all Americans share those brother). The same ones used for centuries to keep the queers, women and niggers in their place, right? The same ones used all these many years to keep those down that you dislike, don't agree with, and do not to see as should be being considered 'equal' to you and those thinking like you? Meaning you and your like are the REAL Americans, the better Americans, the laws were made for you, and not the rest of the Americans you disagree with or dislike for whatever reasons 'cultural' or 'traditional' you hold so dear (the white man's 'culture' and the judaeo/christian 'traditional mores'). Too bad Hitler lost the war, huh? He was on the way to creating your perfect little 'christian' world by killing all the homosexuals and all those other pesky peoples that did not share your culture and traditional mores. All those inferiors and perverts would have been gone and the world would have been a perfect place! Nothing to fear and despise. Paradise.

 

Your arguments here are the same arguments used by those that opposed freeing the slaves, and kept keeping the blacks down even when they were freed, keeping women from getting the vote and equal rights under the law, and now to continue keeping the homosexuals living among us from having the same equal rights you do. Some Americans are better than others right, Hugh? Those like you?

 

What you consider "another erosion of cultural and traditional mores" others, those that really do believe in true equality for all under our democratic system of freedoms and equality for all, consider to be progress. Progress to a truly free country of equals under the law, as the system was designed and created for all the citizens of our land. Even those the founders had no real thought of, or maybe even desire, to see free and equal in their time. The good thing though is they created a system that could evolve with the times. It works, slowly but surely, it does work.

 

Cent

[rchapstick]

I think the USA is going gay.

 

I think that a few on this board may be peeking through the closet keyhole from inside the closet.

 

HH

 

Sorta funny HH how you are constantly resorting to insults and homophobic rhetoric when your arguments get challenged. It would be interesting to see how many times you have used the terms "fudge packer" or "corn holer" or other erudite phrases. But of course' date=' you are not a bigot ...

 

Why should the people or legislature decide who can get married? Good question. I suspect that for many here, a better question would be: "why should a person marry?" My answer to the first question would be because "the people" are the ones who are most effected and legislatures are representatives of the people. As to why people should marry (or not marry), the reasons will vary from individual to individual.

 

The problem is that many of our laws, at a state and national level, use the term "marriage" to bestow certain rights and obligations. To simply allow civil unions without bestowing those same rights and obligations is meaningless.

[Central Scrutinizer]

I think the USA is going gay.

 

I think that a few on this board may be peeking through the closet keyhole from inside the closet.

 

HH

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yeah, right, Hugh. All those that stick up for the equal rights of the homosexuals in our country are just closet queers. And those that fought for the rights of our black citizens over the past 150 years are just nigger lovers, 'ey?

 

Some people have the capacity to see when justice is being perverted (there's that word again) and have the ability and empathy to put themselves in another's place and see that things are not as fair and equal as we try to claim it to be in our land of the free and equal. Some people know the true meaning of equality for all and freedom for all. 'For all' is the key to it, man. Not some. All.

 

Cent

[Hugh_Hoy]

[The problem is that many of our laws, at a state and national level, use the term "marriage" to bestow certain rights and obligations. To simply allow civil unions without bestowing those same rights and obligations is meaningless.

 

You're right. Depending upon the state, it is estimated that the term "marriage" involves 300-600 laws in each state; and at the federal level, about 1100(?) I've said before, I am not against giving gays all rights of "marriage" under the term of "civil union". This is end game for this thread for me. I'm not going to even respond to Cent's rant that was so far off the mark (regarding what he believes I think/practice) because I consider it nothing more than nonsense.

 

HH

[Faustian]

Yes, but HH what is perverse about homosexuality? You've avoided that question, after having spouted off about it so much.

[Guest lazyphil]

its all very well comparing gay rights with black rights from the 60's but afaik across the caribbean and africa (not so much modern black america now i recall CS saying before) homosexuality is not something that is embraced with by many. imo gay rights should be argued without dragging in black rights, its a guess alot of blacks in many places will find it irksome. what say you chocolatesteve?