The Western Men, are they kind or gullible?

[soongmak]

In reply to:

---

I have not read much of those books any more and I have lost some memories on who and who for the names of kings and knights, however, my husband just bought me a new tape on the movie "Camelot", will spend Saturday night on it.

---

 

 

 

If you like camelot, may I suggest Excalibur made by John Boorman? An excellent movie that sticks close to the tale of King Arthur and his knights of the round table!

 

 

 

Cheers,

 

 

 

soongmak

 

 

[shygye]

I would have suggested Monty Python's, Search for the Holy Grail. It is just a little bunny.

[jasmine]

Hi, sorry took so long to answer.

 

?I also think part of it, for some, but not all, is a feeling of guilt for seemingly living a higher standard of living than Thais in general.?

 

That guilt can very well be a reason. Many Thais are quite rich and realizing that a lot of them try to help, still a lot of them turn their heads the other way.

 

 

 

I met a woman (last trip to Thailand in February) who is my mother?s masseuse whose dwelling consisted of 1 room with 1 wall. Found that out when I talked about the heavy rain from the previous night, she said that her baby and mother and herself were completely wet. I offered to buy material for the walls, and she said there were roof materials that she could use for the one wall and she was saving money for it. So, I went with her to buy the material (used roof material) from some people in the neighborhood (living in a good house) who wanted Baht 450 for the old rusting zinc roof material. I asked the couple to lower the price to 400 and they were so adamant that I said, ?Hell, $50 Baht, and you know this woman is dirt poor, talking about unkind!?

 

 

 

My mother, just being aware of the masseuse?s predicament also helped (she never told my mother because it is ?face? thing AGAIN. I ended up spending only around Baht 750 to get other materials and nails so she could put up the 3 walls with a door.

 

 

 

I think that help seems to come a little easier from American, Australian, English, German men who have contact with Thai women. The financial capacity and cultural and religions belief seem to play a big roll on this concept.

 

 

 

I believe that giving money is only a temporary help, but some temporary helps can make people overcome a crisis and enable them to gain energy to keep on going.

 

 

 

?kop khun krup; chok dee?

 

Yin Dee Kha, Khor Hai Khun Chok Dee Doi Kha?

 

 

 

 

[jasmine]

Hi,

 

?It is great that that your homeroom teacher, and principal, took action against other students for making fun of you. They sound like good people because of that, and shows that it is not acceptable to do so, in the Thai culture. But what made the greater majority decide to do so? A Thai "face isssue", do you think,?

 

 

 

It was a ?face? concept and ?face? did not bother me much, I knew my situation and my goals and no one could have stopped me from getting where I wanted to go.

 

Not all of the rest of the kids (from the 4) made fun of me for accepting help, only 2/3, and they did in different scales for many kids in that school thought that accepting charity was to lose face. Please notice also that this school, even today, has brainy kids and most of these kids become brainy because their medium to rich families can afford to give them privileged education. Most of them never had a hungry day in their lives and they did not understand, I would probably have been that way too having their experience.

 

 

 

Another reason too, I, not to sound conceded, being from up-country which was stereo-typed as not competitive with Bangkok students, surprised and worried a few of not-so-confident ones. Nevertheless, the principal (a female) and most teachers were great.

 

 

 

The experience did make me stronger and hopefully understand life better. And the good news is, as far as I know, around five years after I graduated from that High School, the school started good grants available to the students who are in need. The last time I checked, about 3 years ago, there are additional programs for emergency financial help also.

 

 

 

Cheers!

[jasmine]

Hi,

 

?What you deem as kindness, most folks here in the US would expect.?

 

 

 

I definitely agree with you on this sentence. Being in the West for over 30 years has made me realize how things are taken for granted. What bothers me sometimes are the complaints of the way the country is run, benefits and so on, it is hard to be content when ones take may things as the rights to have.

 

 

 

?We are programmed to feel guilty if we do not help those who are perceived to be less fortunate. Hence the entire pan handling and charitable contributions that goes on today in the US. Maybe it feeds our egos somewhat?

 

 

 

Some Indian friends told me that beggars in India believe that they are there to give opportunities to give, to do merits. I don?t know about the homeless in DC. I never met a person who asked ones to give a specific amount until I started working in DC. One man, he has been hanging out by the Metro station where I get on/off. Every morning he asked for $3.50, I usually gave what I had to spare for I had a few more homeless people that I gave regularly, not more than $2.00. One day I gave him $5.00 note because it was close to Christmas and he said ?I want $3.50, here is your change!?, I really had smile on my face all day that day. I?ve noticed that most Americans seem to want to give, it becomes obvious during Christmas time, and it is good to see.

 

 

 

?they tend to take on a male personas. The man no longer gives, but instead the woman is just getting what she deserves. With that being the pervasive mind set of the western woman, there is no longer the feeling that you are helping or giving.?

 

This is not the first time I heard this type of perception of Western women, especially, American women. I have worked alongside with these women my entire career and I do agree (to some extent) that some American women seem to be very harsh and way too competitive at times and lacking feminine qualities. At time at work, it is a turn off, in fact, I?d rather work with men. I have to say, though, that some of my friends are quite sweet. I do wonder also, whether the impact of this type of behavior is known to them.

 

 

 

?Ask a western woman the same question and they?ll tell you a different answer. I?m sure of it.?

 

 

 

Did, many times. Most answers were negative, some with colorful adjectives that I cannot repeat, what can I say?

 

 

 

I feel that ones must receive and give, cannot just one task alone. Gratitude is a very good quality, for all of us wants to be appreciated. Thanks for responding to my post.

 

 

 

Cheers!

 

 

 

 

 

[soongmak]

One thing I have to say is that when you see so many beggars as one does in BKK, you go numb. I especially hate it to see people lying on the sidewalks making a spectacle of themselves. I also don't like it when I see very young children begging for money. It's so hard to know who really is in need and who is simply trying to scam you. I must admit that I ignore most beggars. My sympathy goes out to those people who work and barely can make ends meet.

 

 

 

Talking about beggars, a friend of mine told me he was stopped by one (in the Netherlands) who asked him some money because he was hungry. My friend, who is quite soft at heart, offered to take him to the restaurant at the nearby railway station. At that point the man started cursing my friend. He probably only wanted money to feed his drug habit!

 

 

 

cheers,

 

 

 

soongmak

[Zaad]

You're right about that beggar in The Netherlands.

 

The beggars there can go to several places for food.

 

Those places are supported by the locals who are willing to offer money for that "charity".

 

So yes, he wanted your friend's money to by drugs or alcohol, not food they can get that elsewhere.

[Guest]

I think western men or should I say farang men go to thailand to spend money and have fun. I imagine that many set aside the money they are going to spend and spend it like they are at the race track or something.

 

 

 

I also have to say, that if you are making 40K a year, you are doing well. If you are making 60K a year, you are gettingy our money on and macking and stacking and coming up like a big pimp! I was making 40K a year at my dot com job, ....man that sucked losing that job!

 

 

 

I also thought it was an intersting story and a great contribution to the board. I do wonder how her "brother" died in the Philippines. I hope he did not get caught slipping on the wrong side of town and run into Abu Sayaff without his Glock.

[jasmine]

Hello,

 

"that if you are making 40K a year, you are doing well"

 

 

 

You are referring to US$? That amount is being made now by people who just graduated from college (IT), I hired a few for the past few years. My salary is far above that and with tax, social security, 401K, stock option, I don't consider as being rich. However, if I just pay tax and social security, I would have a bit left. We save on 401K and buy more company stocks for the old age.

 

 

 

"I do wonder how her "brother" died in the Philippines."

 

 

 

My "brother" got killed in US Navy helicoptor crash in 1969.

 

 

 

You could have asked the question above directly instead referring as "her "brother"" The "her" is a third person. Perhaps you were not talking to me?

 

 

 

 

 

Cheers!

[jasmine]

Hello,

 

I feel that these women know what to say. Coming from some background, which mainly consist of ?trust worthy? people, I came from that type of background and we tend to believe what we hear. We do learn though, that not all people are sincere, but every time I hear this type of talk, it tugs at my heart.

 

 

 

?Guilt about satisfying my lust in the manner I did, e.g. originally through prostitution.?

 

 

 

Perhaps, this is why I prefer the Americans/British men more, for they do no feel like most Thai men that prostitutes are just for their sexual release. A Thai man said, ?It is just a toilet for semen dump?.

 

 

 

?genuine spontaneous smile on her face when I do something nice to her that she hadn?t asked for, or didn?t expect.?

 

 

 

I think this is one of the charms that lacking in American women. It is also happens with the Thai females who are from rich families, perhaps, things are given too much/often that the values are less appreciated.

 

 

 

Sorry, it took me a long time to answer.

 

 

 

Cheers!