legover Posted May 24, 2003 Report Share Posted May 24, 2003 Not too sure about knighthoods. Alan Greenspan got his after tanking the stock market by raising interest rates 6 times in a row in 2000. Thanks a lot Sir Al. guess his actions prior to that were appreciated & rewarded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bibblies Posted May 24, 2003 Report Share Posted May 24, 2003 Eh? Just came into this out of nowhere... How can Alan Greenspan have a knighthood? He isn't a British citizen. Plus, I don't think you'd get much support among market commentators for saying he's responsible for "tanking the stock market"! That was your (and my) irrational exuberance popping! And, to answer the original thread - of course it does. It makes for a much easier time in PB Hotel if you don't have the reflection of a big fat warty whale putting you off in the background as you're trying to concentrate on the girl's body. :: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jitagawn Posted May 24, 2003 Report Share Posted May 24, 2003 "but he never gave up and now we are very happy" In general when it comes to Thai women this is the absolute truth- One must be patient as hell- They are women and they LIKE CONTROL-make them wait for that sweet thang.... :hubba: :hubba: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legover Posted May 25, 2003 Report Share Posted May 25, 2003 Bibblies- the Queen gives titles to non UK citizens from time to time. Steven Spielberg, Rudolf Giuliani & George Bush are knights among others. Rudi can?t call himself Sir Rudi but can add the letters Kt, KBE or KC to his name. Greenspin is now revealed as the worst head of the Fed Resv since its creation (or the best depending on how much money you made) the view of many market commentators who saw the bubble for what it was. Here?s what he said in August 2002 reported by one commentator, Grant?s Interest Rate Observer ?.http://federalreserve.gov/boarddocs/speeches/2002/20020830/default.htm ????We at the Federal Reserve considered a number of issues related to asset bubbles--that is, surges in prices of assets to unsustainable levels. As events evolved, we recognized that, despite our suspicions, it was very difficult to definitively identify a bubble until after the fact--that is, when its bursting confirmed its existence??.AG. Starting in 1995, the Fed went on a tear lowering interest rates at a rapid pace. This pumped up the money supply, feeding into the stock market and creating the greatest bubble of all time. This is also responsible for the size of the debt bubble and indirectly the dollar bubble. Upon seeing the evidence of the direct relationship between the money supply growth and the beginnings of a market bubble in 1996, the Fed failed to act?? 'it was very difficult to definitively identify a bubble until after the fact'... the words of the greatest financial wizard in all the world. ?big fat warty whale putting you off? you been spending too much time in Blighty? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldtimer Posted May 25, 2003 Report Share Posted May 25, 2003 Methinks Alan Greenspan would attract quite a few TGs if he showed up in Pattaya. Although in his rumbled suits, the Chairman of the Federal Reserve Bank doesn't look like he has a cent in the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legover Posted May 25, 2003 Report Share Posted May 25, 2003 I can see him in the Thermae or the Winchester with a flock of fawning bgs round him stroking his bald pate recalling the high points of his career & having a good laugh about the biggest scam in history?. ?and you know, my lovely cherubs, the exuberant fools fell for it, hahaha. More B52s everybody?? guess that's an answer to the question on looks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ABCinBK Posted May 25, 2003 Report Share Posted May 25, 2003 pattaya, "i see a lot of white guy/asian gal couples here in SF...." This is going to be a long reply, but I wanted to totally explain my idea, as it seems there are a lot of ways to explain "attractive" and "all things being equal", and this is making it hard for people to understand my idea. I think the question is what percentage of these Asian girl/white guy couples there are, compared to the percentage of say white girl/white guy couples there are, and/or compared to black girl/black guy couples there are. We are talking about where the guy is not up to par with the girl in the looks department of coarse. If the ratios are in line, the fact there appeared to be "many" for you is a relative thing. Two other things to consider is what is "attractive" in a girl and other hidden agendas you may find in the Asian women in Asian girl/white guy couples in the USA and specifically in San Franciso. For one thing, I worked there from May 2001 to October 2001. While I found *some* of the Asian women to be attractive in other people's eyes (those that wern't used to what's available overseas and those that don't mind some fat from the US diet), I didn't find that many, and I tried to classify the Asian women I saw as "attractive in someone's eyes" vs. "attractive in my eyes". I did this, trying to convince myself at the time of what other guys meant when they had told me that there were many Asian hotties in SFO...I just didn't find anymore there than elsewhere, and I will say I have never seen so many "fatter" Asians in my life. Obviously they were fatter than most women I'd seen in Singapore, Japan, or Thailand, or even the few I'd seen at the Taiwan, Korea, and Hong Kong airports. They were generally "fatter" than their counterparts in Asia. Lastly, I would tend to believe a lot of these women may be "money motivated" as well. Certainly, many of the first generation immigrants would be, and even the second generation (born in the US) Asians would possibly still carry some of the traditional "money motivation/good provider" mentality found in many Asian family upbringings. Being Chinese, I can tell you this idea is often put in the mind of the girls. Chinese are generally taught to "improve" beyond the situation of their parents (in education, family stature, and finances). For the girls, this interprets into not marrying "down" but marrying "up". And looks don't garuntee or help in marrying up, a good education/career/family/bank account does. So this of coarse means what they find attractive may be what many Thai women find attractive, which is not so much the guy's actual physical appearance, but his wallet. The question here is what happens if their motivations were suddenly re-shifted to consider only looks, personality, and common interests, with no concern or relatively less concern for the financial factors? Also keep in mind that some of these women may also be looking to either get a greencard (i.e. the ones on student visas or tourist visas) or to find a guy who is able to sponsor their family members to get to the USA. This is, to me, also a financial matter, as it involves both standard of living improvement and increase in future potential earnings. You find this more with Chinese and Filipinos, in my opinion, while Thais aren't heavy migrators and Japanese usually have little problems due to an agreement with the US (as of 2 years ago, not sure of today). However, these are general trends, and many Asians in general seek to migrate to the US, including numerous Thais. So again, I would question if the Asian women in SFO may bear the same financial motivations and "financial attraction" to these guys. I guess I should really say I believe many Thai bar girls are going to be attracted, on a physical basis, to guys their age. And that they are, when it comes to a "real" non-customer heterosexual relationship where money is not a factor (i.e. "all things being constant"), going to prefer someone with a similar set of interests, cultural background, and set of interests. That is why their mangdas tend to be younger and often attractive, while their customers tend to be older and looks don't seem to matter so much. Who are they getting money from? (The farang customers.) Who are they paying money to in order to keep them around? (The Thai mangdas). One can only assume the bargirls find the mangdas physically or personality-wise attractive, as they don't have as much money. If you would say the bargirls are "financially attracted" to these older and/or less physically attractive guys, then sure that is likely true. As far as what they would prefer "as a whole package", I would tend to believe that the more a woman is motivated by money, the more she will find the guy with more money to be attractive, though if you are dealing with "all things being held constant" (i.e. two guys with the same income, future income potential, etc.), it would only make sense that now we have isolated the traits of age and physical appearance. Here, I would suggest she will chose the young guy and the more attractive one. First, the younger one has more years of earnings and future promotions available to him. (Remember, I said their earnings are the same despite the age difference). Second, why chose the less attractive one. The only monkey wrenches that can be thrown into this idea would be if: 1) she doesn't think she can hold the younger guy's interests as well, and thus will lose the chance to get his support via him marrying her, or 2) she feels that his better looks will cause him to again not stay with her, causing her to waste time as she'll never get him to stay and marry her, thus not allowing her to get his support financially. But even these two exceptions point directly back at the fact she is money motivated. That is why women who aren't so concerned with money tend to pursue the more physically attractive and younger men. As Western women have more economic choices, it's no suprise they are the ones that tend to behave the most like this. On the other hand, women in less developed countries who have less economic potential, tend to discount the looks and what they find physically attractive, in place of those they are more confident they can retain (in marriage) and support them. That is what we find in less developed Asian countries, such as Thailand, among those women whose per capita earnigs are substantially less than those of Western guys working in Western countries. After all, a woman seeking financial support cannot just seek the one guy with the most Baht. She needs to find the one with the most Baht SHE CAN KEEP INTERESTED IN HER (usually via marriage). I think the less attractive guys or older guys matched with a younger and attractive girl is the perfect example of this. When you consider also that women understand financial support doesn't just mean a guy's assets today, but also his earnings potential tomorrow (i.e. career and education) and his willingness to support her, you see the real reasons why many young Thai bargirls prefer older guys. They are simply willing, due to their understanding of their opportunities and place in the life cycle, to pay these women more....or "take care of them better", if we want to get into what is politically correct. BTW, I did not mean to ever imply means better looking or old means less attractive in looks. They are not always joined together. I only mean when you remove money from the picture that YOUNG Thai girls will prefer attractive (physically) to unattracive, and young to old. There are two other reasons why a young Thai bargirl would prefer either an older and/or less attractive guy, if it wasn't for financial reasons: 1) She has low self-esteem and isn't sure she can keep a better looking man or younger man in a "real" relationship, 2) She found real "chemistry" and the "spark of love" with the older guy. Both are possible, but then love is somethings that can just as well happen with the younger guys. And if low self-esteem leads to trying to find guys that are "less attractive", then a low self-esteem girl chosing an older guy or a less attractive guy only points out they consider the younger guys or better looking guys more attractive to start with. ABC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jp1 Posted May 25, 2003 Report Share Posted May 25, 2003 ABC, thanks for your detailed explanation. This view from an Asian standpoint in very valuable. Maybe it's not to everybody's liking but the way you described relationships between young woman and older men is exactly what I've heard so often from Chinese colleagues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ABCinBK Posted May 25, 2003 Report Share Posted May 25, 2003 Pattaya127, >PHYSICALLY handsome...So yes, I do believe looks matter, >where "all other things are equal... "yes, but their idea of handsome is different from ours and even farang women. That reminds me of indian movie stars (males) we see flirting and singing with gorgeous indian females in videos and movies: ARGHHHH! (by my own standards)....." True, but Thais often find Western noses and white skin attractive, and so they are more inclined to find Western farang men attractive, as well as lighter skinned Asians with more of a bridge to the nose (including Japanese, Koreans, and Chinese). They do not find Indians attractive generally, or Arabs; we are talking of Issan Thai bargirls here. >As other aspects of jai dee, does anyone really think the girl >would consider him good hearted.... "that maybe because you think of these girls only when they wait all night behind a bar or are out in the discos as freelancers. If you meet them in other settings, like being your neigbours or acquaintances or friends of your GF, they may very well use the word without any prospective greed or interest attached to it. Usually, the word "Khon dee" is used as well when they know you have been (or someone else) rather nice about something that may have nothing to do with money changing hands." True, and good point. The bargirls are still people and they can still find a man of "good heart" (jai dee) because of good actions not involving money. Then again, both young and old men are capable of such actions. Age can bring cynicism or the ability to be more tolerant, but there's no trend there and it depends on the man in question. I do not see older men having any advantage in personality or gallantry, as experience can either bring cynicism or tolerance. As for wisdom, some people get dumber over time while others get smarter. It all depends on the ability to learn what is both real and practical. >Most of the time, it was and still is a prostitute and her >client. "maybe so, but isn't it where so many are inflamed, when they are given the "frown" by farangs and thai alike for beeing seen with a younger woman...who just happens to be their wife and was never working in the "industry" ? Furthermore, it certainly does not take to prostitute oneself to elect to be with an older man who indeed will/could be a galant and providing husband. IMO, "working" girls are of the same mind as many non-working thai women when they are interested in dating a farang man. True. Many younger women are assumed to be prostitutes. The ones that are either bargirls or gold-diggers are "prostitutes" though in different ways, but it is unfortunate the ones that truelly find the older man attractive (as a human being and husband, and NOT due to financial motivations) are judged as such. Though the fact the age gap seems to close when the economic status of the couple is the same, in Western countries or among many of the upper class in developing countries, also says something about the likelihood of such high age gap marriages being only for non-financial reasons on both sides. It seems to say the age gap starts to disappear when money is not a factor. "Finally, in Pattaya, i find the big butterflying girls are indeed more likely to be seen day in and day out with younger type men, whereas the girl with an older man may very well settle with him and in some measure, become monogamous. Finally (#2), far from me to say there is no prostitution in Pattaya (my area of expertise, If say) of course, but when i hear the girls refer to some guy(s) they know, they never say client or customer, but often use the word boy friend, even if there are more than one. Kind of a twisted truth, but most telling of their mind frame as I just think in the back of most of these girls, there is still the search for a providing man more than a customer. Kind of a twisted truth given the reality, but most telling of these young women, IMO." You use the word "providing man". That is another word for support, which means money and equates to financial support. My reply to your other post (either just before or after this one) goes into the various forms and aspects of "financial motivations and support". I'll touch on it a bit here, and point out that a woman seeking long-term financial support will often search out a husband. Obviously, the techniques such a bargirl uses to seek her money will be different than one chosing the more direct and (IMO) honest approach of doing as many ST and LT's as possible. These are very good points. It makes me realize why so many people sometimes think the bargirls really do prefer less attractive or older men on a pure "looks" basis. But it just doesn't seem to be the case, and obviously I am getting older every day. Still, the truth is neither dictated by a man's age nor by his appearence. ABC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ABCinBK Posted May 25, 2003 Report Share Posted May 25, 2003 TTM, "My take: being handsome may count a little (if that) at your first encounter." Very true, for first encounters with BGs. Like that BG you mentioned said, "I am her for the money". ABC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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