Thanks You Idiot

[chuckwoww]

Yeah, well who knows who is provoking who. The point is it drove the oil price up. Hang on, now it's down again because of recession fears. Just another day at NYMEX.

[sayjann]

so the Iranians were in International Waters :question:

 

but the Americans thought this to be a threat :question:

 

since when are no other Country allowed to sail in International waters when the Americans are about :question: :question:

[..]

Citing unidentified U.S. officials, CNN said the Iranian vessels came within 200 yards (meters) of the U.S. ships in international waters in the strait on Saturday, and U.S. sailors came close to opening fire.

Not that I doubt *you* Cava, but look at the story (and the BushCo). Once again, more shit from "unidentified" sources. So it is untraceable and unverifiable. Just like the supposed expert who claims that Iran ordnance was found in Iraq. If so, why the "unnamed source." Makes me call bullshit, especially given Bush's track record.

 

But hey, I want to play speechwriter. Here goes, a speech for pResident Bush:

 

[color:blue]President's speech to America

August 4, 1964January 8, 2008

 

My fellow Americans: - As President and Commander in Chief, it is my duty to the American people to report that renewed hostile actions against United States ships on the high seas in the Gulf of TonkinPersian Gulf have today required me to order the military forces of the United States to take action in reply.

 

The initial attack on the destroyer MaddoxPort Royal, on August 2, was repeated today by a number of hostile vessels attacking two U.S. destroyers with torpedoesmines. The destroyers and supporting aircraft acted at once on the orders I gave after the initial act of aggression. We believe at least two of the attacking boats were sunk. There were no U.S. losses.

 

The performance of commanders and crews in this engagement is in the highest tradition of the United States Navy. But repeated acts of violence against the Armed Forces of the United States must be met not only with alert defense, but with positive reply. That reply is being given as I speak to you tonight. Air action is now in execution against gunboats and certain supporting facilities in North VietnamIran which have been used in these hostile operations.

 

In the larger sense this new act of aggression, aimed directly at our own forces, again brings home to all of us in the United States the importance of the struggle for peace and security in southeastsouthwest Asia. Aggression by terror against the peaceful villagers of South VietnamIraq has now been joined by open aggression on the high seas against the United States of America.

 

The determination of all Americans to carry out our full commitment to the people and to the government of South VietnamIraq will be redoubled by this outrage. Yet our response, for the present, will be limited and fitting. We Americans know, although others appear to forget, the risks of spreading conflict. We still seek no wider war.

 

I have instructed the Secretary of State to make this position totally clear to friends and to adversaries and, indeed, to all. I have instructed Ambassador StevensonKhalizad to raise this matter immediately and urgently before the Security Council of the United Nations. Finally, I have today met with the leaders of both parties in the Congress of the United States and I have informed them that I shall immediately request the Congress to pass a resolution making it clear that our Government is united in its determination to take all necessary measures in support of freedom and in defense of peace in southeastsouthwest Asia.

 

I have been given encouraging assurance by these leaders of both parties that such a resolution will be promptly introduced, freely and expeditiously debated, and passed with overwhelming support. And just a few minutes ago I was able to reach Senator GoldwaterReid and I am glad to say that he has expressed his support of the statement that I am making to you tonight.

 

It is a solemn responsibility to have to order even limited military action by forces whose overall strength is as vast and as awesome as those of the United States of America, but it is my considered conviction, shared throughout your Government, that firmness in the right is indispensable today for peace; that firmness will always be measured. Its mission is peace. [/color]

 

Wha'? That's been done already. Shit! Well, hey, I just updated it to reflect tomorrow's events. As we all know, that original speech by Lyndon Johnson ushered the United States into the Vietnam War. The Gulf of Tonkin incident, of course, did not really happen. Yet newspapers still uncritically report government pronouncements of "attacks" upon U.S. ships as if they really happened, with no attempt at independent verification. 1964, 2008...nobody learns. Nobody ever learns.

 

Regards,

SD

[cavanami]

I was not there for the recent "incident" but I was there in 2004 when a vessel came at the ship I was on...and I have the pictures to prove!

 

BS, cooked up news for this incident...after all the lies and BS that has gone on for the past umpteen years, yes, caution is advised before believing or acting on about anything the US gov says...IMO.

[shygye]

so the Iranians were in International Waters :question:

 

but the Americans thought this to be a threat :question:

 

since when are no other Country allowed to sail in International waters when the Americans are about :question: :question:

 

Iranians have every right to be in International waters BUT that does not mean they can get close to US warships. Remember the US Cole was bombed by a small boat in Yemen.

[cavanami]

so the Iranians were in International Waters :question:

 

but the Americans thought this to be a threat :question:

 

since when are no other Country allowed to sail in International waters when the Americans are about :question: :question:

 

Iranians have every right to be in International waters BUT that does not mean they can get close to US warships. Remember the US Cole was bombed by a small boat in Yemen.

Exactly right!

The Iranians have the right to be in international waters but they do not have the right to harass other ships, or to invade the other ships' right of way!

[sayjann]

so who says the Iranians were harrassing an American ship?.....i imagine the spin comes from the Americans.

we never seem to hear anyone's view about any incident except the official American view.

 

but we all know the Americans are always right and could never be wrong......

and even if the Iranians provided proof that they were innocent it would be proved wrong by American spin.

[Mekong]

so the Iranians were in International Waters :question:

 

but the Americans thought this to be a threat :question:

 

since when are no other Country allowed to sail in International waters when the Americans are about :question: :question:

 

Iranians have every right to be in International waters BUT that does not mean they can get close to US warships. Remember the US Cole was bombed by a small boat in Yemen.

Exactly right!

The Iranians have the right to be in international waters but they do not have the right to harass other ships' date=' or to invade the other ships' right of way![/quote']

 

So by applying the same logic if an Iranian warship was International waters ofsshore from the United States and the US sent a boat out to "have a look" the Iranians would be well within their rights to blow the American boat out of the water?

 

 

 

[cavanami]

Having a "look", no problem.

"Rules of the Road (sea)" is that you MUST keep a safe distance and not invade any ships' space.

You can have a "look" at another ship from say, 1/4 mile away, no problem...but from 50 feet away, no.

 

[cavanami]

so who says the Iranians were harrassing an American ship?.....i imagine the spin comes from the Americans.

we never seem to hear anyone's view about any incident except the official American view.

 

but we all know the Americans are always right and could never be wrong......

and even if the Iranians provided proof that they were innocent it would be proved wrong by American spin.

Let's say you are crossing a large street. You are in the middle and I accelerate my car straight toward you, slam the brakes 10 feet away from you and then repeat this five or six times...I think you would not be pleased...and if you complain, ohhh no, I am innocent, the fault lies with you!

 

This situation has zero to do with nationality.

It has everything to do with the international laws when ships are at sea.