Hmong man opens fire in USA, 6 dead

[thai3]

 

>>>As for the hunters, I took the mrs to a backwoods hunting bar, pretty friendly people, in the hunting/fishing stores too, desent people, of course there will be idiots among them but they're everywhere! <<<

 

I understand these places often erupt into drunken violence, surely 'common sense' not to take a woman into such dangerous territory, or is it OK as long as not in a LOS cafe?

[Guest]

FYI, before making some sort of sarcastic remark, just look first who has made the original post. wasn't me.

[rickfarang]

I've got to say that its a shame that they toss these guys into new surroundings (cultural, social, legal, etc.) with little in the way of support and guidance. While it is wonderful that they could take many Hmong to the U.S., and I'm sure it will result in a much better life for many of them, and especially their children, I would have to say that I read of animals being relocated aclimatized more carefully. Yeah, this might drive a wedge between the bigots in Wisconsin and some of their fellow Wisconsonites, but I think it underscores the responsibility of the officials and sponsors in helping these people adjust to their new way of life as pointing out that there are still a lot of hateful people out there who cannot let their fellows live in peace (and I am talking about those who likely drove this Hmong into the edge of snapping).

 

Bigotry happens.

[Guest lazyphil]

<<are knowledgable people accompanying inexperienced hunters?>>

 

A father to son thing here perhaps??

[bushpilot]

flyonzewall said:

 

 

anyhow, it is not really about guncontrol, but about people control themselves (i guess the question of guncontrol would not have to come up if people would be able to control themselves).

 

anyhow, was asking a few simple questions regarding hunting in the US. is that so difficult to understand?

why hasn't anyone been able to answer them, other than speculating on my ulterior motives?

 

again: what training receive people before they are allowed to hunt?

can anyone who can buy a gun go to hunt?

are knowledgable people accompanying inexperienced hunters?

 

you mentioned that you like to hunt. so tell me, what training did you receive?

do you know about the particular animal population in the areas you hunt?

 

I agree this is all about personal discipline and self control. This nasty little incident in WI shows how quickly it can break down.

 

I don't think any state in the US has any training requirements prior to getting hunting licenses. I think there is something wrong in general regarding the insanity of opening weekend of gun hunting in WI. I don't want to anywhere near it.

 

My own experience with firearms goes back as far as I can remember with my grandfather(a decorated marksman and WW1 and WW2 veteran) I participated in numerous NRA competitions. When I was 16 I spent a year in Gsaadt, Suisse, where I won a .22 rifle competition(I think the top locals weren't present). Yet none of this is a requisite for the ownership of of a firearm.

 

 

 

My hunting experience is limited to deer hunting on private farms in Minnesota and about five seasons hunting caribou, moose, and brown bear in AK.

Again no specific training was required though I made the effort to gain as much local knowledge as possible.

Even so on one occasion I got in trouble for shooting an animal 1/2 mile on the wrong side of an imaginary park boundary deep in the AK wilderness! That was also a $500.00 lesson!

When you purchase a hunting license in the US you accept many responsibilities to remain within the structure of the laws and rules, which can be admittedly complex at times.

The freedom which we enjoy in the US mandates a large amount of personal responsibility. Unfortunately many don't seem up for the task.(myself included sometimes)

 

Personally as I mentioned I don't see the need to use a semi-automatic rifle for hunting. Most serious hunters don't. Should there be legislation in this area? I don't think so. But I do unfortunately see an educational need particularly in places like WI. Alaska the hunting situation is overly complex and changes rapidly and frequently to respond to localized conditions.

I would like to see a licensing in AK similar to Canada where you have one bar coded card for a license and the computer base with have the record of what you are licensed for. Right now the amount of paperwork one has to carry into the field to be legal is silly.

 

This event will undoubtedly stir things up and cause a few changes.

I do question the "common sense" of a individual who chooses to go into the woods to hunt deer with a weapon like an SKS rifle.

But the issue should be the "common sense" and not a particular weapon. Though I'm sensing that this argument has inherent weakness because I doubt that we can legislate "common sense".

cheers.

[khunsanuk]

Hi,

 

"nops, he has simply asked to be civil."

 

Wrong, Fly, the request not to turn this into a guncontrol discussion was made at the very beginning of the thread.

 

Having said that, I think your question on "what do "semiautomatic rifles have to do with hunting"." is valid to this discussion. Must admit that I too wonder why one needs a semi-automatic rifle to hunt deer ::

 

Sanuk!

[Paillote]

pasathai said:

Not trying to be a smartass here, but

 

 

"The group had one (1) rifle. Does that make them gun crazed?

 

"

 

I would call that not thinking ahead ( If in fact a group of hunters indedd only had one gun amongst them.

 

The police reported that only one rifle was found on the scene. Don't you find it unlikely that one guy could take down 8 armed hunters alone? This was pure slaughter.

 

Paillote

[Guest]

now we can talk.

 

briefly to gun control, not to debate the issue, just to show you my personal POV: as you mentioned, you have difficulties to understand why people use semi automatic weapons for hunting, so do i. i am not "against hunting" per se, and upcounty here in thailand we have two cheap flintlock rifles so the boys can hunt. if i would have the money to buy better rifles i would buy them. and i do not agree with the policy now here in thailand to take those kind of guns away from the farmers. they do need them. but i agree to confiscate war weaponry. AK47's, UZI's etc. are made for killing people and nothing else, and should only be in the hands of professionals. but that's just my personal position. both sides on the guncontrol debate are far too ideological, IMHO, and do not look at practical solutions. that way no compromise can be reached.

 

 

 

>>>Should there be legislation in this area? I don't think so. But I do unfortunately see an educational need particularly in places like WI. <<<

 

the question here is also who are the ones who misbehave most - locals who have been living there forever, or city people who enjoy shooting animals, but have no real knowledge about the complexities of nature. how can you educate them other than by introducing hunting licenses? as you said - one cannot legislate common sense.

 

 

 

>>>When you purchase a hunting license in the US you accept many responsibilities to remain within the structure of the laws and rules, which can be admittedly complex at times.<<<

 

another question: how is the procedure for purchasing a license? do people have to show what guns they are using, are quotas given, and controlled? any sort of test?

 

 

 

 

>>>Alaska the hunting situation is overly complex and changes rapidly and frequently to respond to localized conditions.

I would like to see a licensing in AK similar to Canada where you have one bar coded card for a license and the computer base with have the record of what you are licensed for. Right now the amount of paperwork one has to carry into the field to be legal is silly. <<<

 

complex in what aspect? only the amount of paperwork, or is every year the animal population counted, and quotas changed according that?

[Zorro]

Sorry but I don't see why anyone needs to go hunting unless it is for food as a necessity or you are a farmer killing pests.

 

I can't for the life of me see any sport in killing animals for fun.

 

Therefore i see no reason why your average joe should even be granted a gun licence.

 

The less guns there are around the better as far as i am concerned.

[buffalo_bill]

bushman,

 

I have always been of the opinion that this nanaplaza-board is one of the foremost educational instruments existing in the universe, I am in particular referring to the fact that comrade fly does not use any rude english words any more since you complained .God bless you and your family.

 

About the thrills of hunting in Germany which fly did elaborate on at an earlier stage : as has been said, you need a comprehensive training incl. law , weapons, animals etc etc , need a clean criminal record and at the end of the day you receive a hunting license but are not allowed to hunt anywhere. This you achieve by renting the hunting rights from somebody who owns a wood and it is terribly expensive. Or you buy a wood which is difficult . The huntable wildlife population is represented by mainly wild boar , deer-like animals and rabbits. As Germany is densely populated, said animals are not very much afraid of men any more so that I usually fall over a couple of them when I walk through the forest with my dog. I reckon there are one billion wild boars / square mile at the moment at least where I live. Reason is this : to have something to shoot at during the hunting sason , they feed them and the deers throughout the whole year . I am calling this a perverted pleasure which has nothing to do with hunting . In comparison I find the Wisconsin hunting-attitude relatively fair except that they seem to use machine guns. Apart from all that I disagree with people who kill animals for their pure pleasure but that is just me.

 

To come back on KS's request to turn this back into a gun control thread :

 

The most successful recent mass slaughters in Germany have been comitted by people with a license to carry a gun or children who stole their father's hunting rifle. I think if people need something to play with they should consider golf or a Lego-box.

 

BuBi , who like steak from deer too mut